Your sovereign rights being flushed down the toilet by our politicians

[Katman]

You could, but it does not mean you would be correct.

Relying on others to tell you what you should believe doesn't mean you're correct either.

[bogan]

Relying on others to tell you what you should believe doesn't mean you're correct either.

And I've covered that already (in the part of the post you deleted in fact), but to summarise. A youtube video tells you what to believe, a properly referenced article shows you what to believe.

[Katman]

And I've covered that already (in the part of the post you deleted in fact), but to summarise. A youtube video tells you what to believe, a properly referenced article shows you what to believe.

No, a 'properly referenced article' references you back to one other person's opinion.

[Brian d marge]

Wrong, I can conclude the cup on my desk cup contains 78% water, there is no bias in that. Just an impartial examination of the reality; it is the key to understanding what is, do you not meditate?
Yet by 'knowing' the govt enslaves us, you are choosing the one in which you are enslaved, not by the govt, but by your own mind.

Lets try a thought experiment, try to list the three biggest points of enslavement our govt puts upon us.

I posted , some examples , now lets look at enslavement ... A some froggie wrote * man was born free but everywhere is in chains * or something like that . To find out if you are enslaved , try not doing or using it . IF all works out fine , then you are free but if shit hits the fan , you is enslaved... try not paying rego .... a useless tax or not using a driving licence ....

You should try it, it is a good way to examine your own self and its bias'.

I say isn't, and ask you to provide reasons to back up your is. You say lets not; thus refusing to back up your own opinion. This is why I say it is your mind that enslave you, seek enlightenment and shared understanding with me, break free of your shackles

I , we are trying , there is hope for you young Bogie , but life aint black and white sometimes .....

So you do claim it has been shown the govt enslaves us?

Did they ever find weapons of mass destruction ? for which they killed hundreds . How come the Icelandic economey is doing fine , when they said it wouldnt . Why has the oil price dropped to 60 dollars when we were told it was running out ..... Now we are being told that ISISISISISL is a bad muslim group intent on chopping peoples heads off ....but the plot thickens when we look deeper into ISISISIS es history ....the stench of Israel seems to be on the air .... and that wealth will trickle down.
As for NZ, Student loans would open up education to the poor ...tui ... Competition would lower electricity prices ...tui ...ACC is broke ....tui .....need I go on! oh and these have ALL been proven false ...have mom and dad made a profit on their meridian shares yet ? hope so ..because its at the expense of other Kiwis .....

I've already said taxes and money are not points of slavery. Money is simply a system of barter, a concept, if you feel enslaved by this it is your own mind doing it; same with taxes. Interest is not valid either as nobody is forced to get a loan in the first place. Conscription? when was the last time anyone was conscripted? Electoral system, nope, not having things run the way you would like does not constitute slavery by the govt; but if you look at it too negatively then your mind does enslave you to it.

So it is still only mandatory Education on the list.

try not using any of it ..and see how far ya get .......I do agree with the concept part and with taxation being a concept but even I recognise ATM , one is enslaved, i.e cannot escape from it. ( not from lack of trying on my part)

Try me.

Which viewpoint would you like me to back up?

Money, and the application of interest leads to enslavement ..... there ya go ... take as long as ya want

So what's happening in Tokyo?

And where are the warehouses full of cheap Eurobikes in various states than end up here?

Im waiting on a shipment of arms from america , ( a new long bow and some arrows , should be here today ) the house is a friggen mess and the Russians with their new found wealth have raised the prices of bikes to stupid levels ..... I have an old tomos if you are interested !


Stephen

[bogan]

No, a 'properly referenced article' references you back to one other person's opinion.

Which is generally derived from empirical data, also referenced; as was the case in my example which you put in too hard basket deleted (and you call me close minded ).

Opposed to youtube, when basically all the content is just one person's (the uploader) opinion.

[Katman]

Which is generally derived from empirical data, also referenced

What a load of shit.

It is generally just a reference back to where someone else has said the same thing.

You could do the same sort of referencing while watching Youtube videos.

You could get to a discussion point and think "hey, that sounds like an interesting claim - I'll do some research on that and decide whether I should agreee with it or not"

But that's probably too much hard work for you.

[bogan]

I posted , some examples , now lets look at enslavement ... A some froggie wrote * man was born free but everywhere is in chains * or something like that . To find out if you are enslaved , try not doing or using it . IF all works out fine , then you are free but if shit hits the fan , you is enslaved... try not paying rego .... a useless tax or not using a driving licence ....



I , we are trying , there is hope for you young Bogie , but life aint black and white sometimes .....



Did they ever find weapons of mass destruction ? for which they killed hundreds . How come the Icelandic economey is doing fine , when they said it wouldnt . Why has the oil price dropped to 60 dollars when we were told it was running out ..... Now we are being told that ISISISISISL is a bad muslim group intent on chopping peoples heads off ....but the plot thickens when we look deeper into ISISISIS es history ....the stench of Israel seems to be on the air .... and that wealth will trickle down.
As for NZ, Student loans would open up education to the poor ...tui ... Competition would lower electricity prices ...tui ...ACC is broke ....tui .....need I go on! oh and these have ALL been proven false ...have mom and dad made a profit on their meridian shares yet ? hope so ..because its at the expense of other Kiwis .....



try not using any of it ..and see how far ya get .......I do agree with the concept part and with taxation being a concept but even I recognise ATM , one is enslaved, i.e cannot escape from it. ( not from lack of trying on my part)



Money, and the application of interest leads to enslavement ..... there ya go ... take as long as ya want



Im waiting on a shipment of arms from america , ( a new long bow and some arrows , should be here today ) the house is a friggen mess and the Russians with their new found wealth have raised the prices of bikes to stupid levels ..... I have an old tomos if you are interested !


Stephen

I don't pay rego, still going fine...

Well we know they lie to us, I'm asking about enslavement.

Not being able to go without is not really the same as being enslaved by it. Otherwise you could also say one is enslaved by one's freinds and family, by the air, earth, water... the list goes on and on.

Sorry, did I need to clarify that I would only back up my own viewpoints, not yours?

Perhaps to frame the discussion better, I'm wishing to discuss how the govt enslaves us; which is, by definition:

"Definition of slave in English:
NOUN

1(Especially in the past) a person who is the legal property of another and is forced to obey them:
he killed the natives or turned them into slaves
MORE EXAMPLE SENTENCES
SYNONYMS
1.1A person who works very hard without proper remuneration or appreciation:
by the time I was ten, I had become her slave, doing all the housework
MORE EXAMPLE SENTENCES
SYNONYMS
1.2A person who is excessively dependent upon or controlled by something:
the poorest people of the world are slaves to the banks
she was no slave to fashion
MORE EXAMPLE SENTENCES
1.3A device, or part of one, directly controlled by another:
[AS MODIFIER]: a slave cassette deck
Compare with master1."

So who is a slave and why, and how have they been enslaved? Simply saying money and taxes is not justification of slavery.

[bogan]

What a load of shit.

It is generally just a reference back to where someone else has said the same thing.

Not in my example it wasn't, and not in the many others I've dealt with either. Have you gone and deleted all the things that didn't fit your bias in that set too?

You could do the same sort of referencing while watching Youtube videos.

You could get to a discussion point and think "hey, that sounds like an interesting claim - I'll do some research on that and decide whether I should agreee with it or not"

But that's probably too much hard work for you.

You could, and I have done, and it takes fucking ages and the rate of bullshit is attrocious because not many others do. So it is more efficient to just filter them out from the start. Not to mention that when I don't agree the person who presented it as evidence generally just finds some other bit of drivel in an attempt to waste my time. It just isn't conducive to discussion and shared understanding like a referenced article is.

[Katman]

You could, and I have done, and it takes fucking ages and the rate of bullshit is attrocious because not many others do. So it is more efficient to just filter them out from the start. Not to mention that when I don't agree the person who presented it as evidence generally just finds some other bit of drivel in an attempt to waste my time. It just isn't conducive to discussion and shared understanding like a referenced article is.

Fuck you talk some shit.

[bogan]

Fuck you talk some shit.

Don't we all? at least mine is accurate shit though.

[Scuba_Steve]

Ok, so what statement are you using that video to support?

That YouTube shouldn't be dismissed just because it's YouTube, there's valuable info contained within

"Definition of slave in English:
NOUN

1(Especially in the past) a person who is the legal property of another and is forced to obey them:
he killed the natives or turned them into slaves
MORE EXAMPLE SENTENCES
SYNONYMS
1.1A person who works very hard without proper remuneration or appreciation:
by the time I was ten, I had become her slave, doing all the housework
MORE EXAMPLE SENTENCES
SYNONYMS
1.2A person who is excessively dependent upon or controlled by something:
the poorest people of the world are slaves to the banks
she was no slave to fashion
MORE EXAMPLE SENTENCES
1.3A device, or part of one, directly controlled by another:
[AS MODIFIER]: a slave cassette deck
Compare with master1."

Doesn't 1.2A say money is a slave maker? "the poorest people in the world are slaves to banks" due to everyone being "excessively dependant upon" money... I mean try living in the country you were born without it
But moreso the 1st sentence "person legal property of another & forced to obey"; tell me do you have a IRD number? are you legally registered as belonging to NZ i.e. birth cert? Do the cops not force the Govt rules on you should they find you not obeying their (& your) masters? Sounds awfully like the definition to me

[bogan]

That YouTube shouldn't be dismissed just because it's YouTube, there's valuable info contained within




Doesn't 1.2A say money is a slave maker? "the poorest people in the world are slaves to banks" due to everyone being "excessively dependant upon" money... I mean try living in the country you were born without it
But moreso the 1st sentence "person legal property of another & forced to obey"; tell me do you have a IRD number? are you legally registered as belonging to NZ i.e. birth cert? Do the cops not force the Govt rules on you should they find you not obeying their (& your) masters? Sounds awfully like the definition to me

If it is valuable info, it'll turn up elsewhere. All information is information, but all time is time too...

Perhaps the poorest people shouldn't be taking out loans and living beyond their means then. IRD # and birth cert does not mean I'm legal property, the laws are there to prevent slavery, yes that does involve forcing law breakers not to enslave others, but it does not constitute slavery.

[Brian d marge]

Don't we all? at least mine is accurate shit though.

no and im still waiting on anything peer reviewed or anything for that matter from both you and the great flapper

That YouTube shouldn't be dismissed just because it's YouTube, there's valuable info contained within




Doesn't 1.2A say money is a slave maker? "the poorest people in the world are slaves to banks" due to everyone being "excessively dependant upon" money... I mean try living in the country you were born without it
But moreso the 1st sentence "person legal property of another & forced to obey"; tell me do you have a IRD number? are you legally registered as belonging to NZ i.e. birth cert? Do the cops not force the Govt rules on you should they find you not obeying their (& your) masters? Sounds awfully like the definition to me

yup
would agree with that

try not having an ird number and see how far you get
or paying ya tax in weed . .

or smokin it if one had an urge

your freedoms would rapidly disappear

now having ya freedom taken away because a corrupt body said so
sounds like enslavement to me

try it let me know how ya get on

[Scuba_Steve]

If it is valuable info, it'll turn up elsewhere. All information is information, but all time is time too...

Perhaps the poorest people shouldn't be taking out loans and living beyond their means then. IRD # and birth cert does not mean I'm legal property, the laws are there to prevent slavery, yes that does involve forcing law breakers not to enslave others, but it does not constitute slavery.

[God, much better to look at now... the black is back!]
Maybee so, still no reason to dismiss the YouTube version of it

So you're forced to register with the crown, you're forced to obey their rules regardless & it's a "do as I say not as I do" system... But to be honest I'm not 100% on how enslavement came into it? I'm really just playing devil; however on the original topic, everyones rights (both human & sovereign) are being raped & pillaged by the politicians, there is no doubt to that

[bogan]

no and im still waiting on anything peer reviewed or anything for that matter from both you and the great flapper


yup
would agree with that

try not having an ird numbrr and see how far you get
or paying ya tax in weed . .

or smokin it if one had an urge

your freedoms would rapidly disappear

To support which claim?

How is having an IRD number slavery though? It doesn't force you to do anything. Taxes are paid on goods purchased or sold within the bounds of our economy, what is stopping you going off the grid and living self sufficiently out in the bush?