More detail on the new Africa Twin

[Racing Dave]

Having a R1200GSA I can certainly say that when looking for something interesting it seems to go from boring gravel to holyshitnoway pretty damn quick I need more in between...

Too true - here are a couple of photos taken at Edwards Pass. Easy to cross the stream - until my back wheel caught a rock and I lost my speed. Getting up the bank took a serious effort. By myself I would have been stuffed!

[Gremlin]

Getting up the bank took a serious effort. By myself I would have been stuffed!

Always better when you can convince a mate or two to come on a ride. Little do they know what they're in for if you hit any problems. Plus you can try trickier stuff knowing they're on hand

[Muzz67]

Always better when you can convince a mate or two to come on a ride. Little do they know what they're in for if you hit any problems. Plus you can try trickier stuff knowing they're on hand

At least if ya fall off when alone,, it didn't happen.
But then its easier to tackle tricky shit when there's back-up muscle.

[Woodman]

Lots of guys perhaps fell for the advertising on the AT and thought they would be able to do the same thing too. I read a post where one guy who bought an AT wanted to make it lighter by changing the exhaust but that weight would likely be made back up again and more with any gear carried. So it seems to me he has bought the wrong bike. It has been stated that most people that buy big adventure bikes are only wanting dirt road handling ability anyway. If you are paying 20k or more for a bike unless you are rich you will not be wanting to take it places where there is a high chance of dropping it anyway.

If I was paying 20k for an adventure bike I would be taking it more places where there is a high risk of droppage to get my moneys worth, and anyway the bulk of the dropping on the big bikes in my experience are slow or no speed drops so damage is minimal anyway.

[Night Falcon]

Nope.
I'm saying that we are a set. For best results, it's the capability of the combination that counts.

Example:
I bought a GS. The GSA is arguably (slightly) more off road capable (it's certainly tougher) but it would have made no difference to me. I would be in a tangled heap at the same point on either machine.
It simply doesn't matter how good the bike is, it's how good the bike and I are that gets results. Granted there's likely to be some link between the two, but as in the example I gave, not always.

Don't disagree with any of this. The point I was endeavoring to make was evaluating the Bike's general ability to cope with off road terrain - not the riders, or the bike and the riders. Flagging a bike because you don't think you can handle it in the rough is one thing, but that's not to say the bike couldn't easily cope with it......I'm talking an average off road rider skills here not ex extreme enduro pilots

But back on topic The AT certainly falls into this category....will a lot of owners take if off road lots? maybe not....is the bike capable of handling it....definitely!....that's all I'm sayin .

[Bass]

Don't disagree with any of this. The point I was endeavoring to make was evaluating the Bike's general ability to cope with off road terrain - not the riders, or the bike and the riders. Flagging a bike because you don't think you can handle it in the rough is one thing, but that's not to say the bike couldn't easily cope with it......I'm talking an average off road rider skills here not ex extreme enduro pilots

But back on topic The AT certainly falls into this category....will a lot of owners take if off road lots? maybe not....is the bike capable of handling it....definitely!....that's all I'm sayin .

Furry muff - semantics eh.

[george formby]

I guess now that a spate of videos showing big beemers in strife are available for comparison we just need to wait for AT vids to surface and then we can gauge which one gets the most stuck. Always a good off road bench mark. Some bikes have an ability to tempt mere mortals into some very precarious situations.

[Gremlin]

I guess now that a spate of videos showing big beemers in strife

You gotta be joking. We all ride them like this:



ok, maybe not This guy seems to be able to make a compilation by himself:

[george formby]

Two vids succinctly showing the can and the can't. Well done.

The poor bugger in the 2nd one, on road tires..... I felt sorry for him. He needs to weight the pegs more.

[Gremlin]

He needs to weight the pegs more.

I would imagine all big adventure bikes are similar in riding style. Momentum is actually your friend, you want to bulldoze through things... until momentum is your enemy and then it's your nemesis.

Clearly some momentum would have helped there and make some of it look really easy, but equally, when it hits a rock, or your wheel starts going in the wrong direction, it's super hard to bring it back. Road tyres... yeah, really not a good idea. That's actually one of the beauties of these big bikes. Throw on road tyres, do long days back to back in comfort. Switch to knobblies and they're reasonably competent (ability directly proportional to your stupidity) in rough environments.

[george formby]

The peg weighting was defo tongue in cheek and I totally agree with the momentum. That's what I learned on the TDM, don't sit there like a rigid muppet, stand up, relax, look, and ride the bloody thing with the right hand.

[Box'a'bits]

Marks for persistence through...

[vegeman]

. At least the bigger ones have the grunt and torque to compensate for their weight. :

100% correct. The AT with a 1000cc really feels a lot more like a 690 in regards to power overcoming the weight. It has torque, and power to wheelie so it's ok from that perspective.

I know we often get to performance in these discussions, while for some it's not important, but for me, I like a bit of grunt and excitement that power gives. Besides the hoon factor, power helps riding. Being able to pop the wheel over obstacles, streams etc or punch into a head wind, over take traffic, attempt a hill climb in the wrong gear or have enough power to pull higher gearing so that roads are manageable. I would rather put a better seat and better fairing on the 690, which in my mind is all the AT really offers. Forget the big bikes here in NZ...save them for the continent riding. (I rode a GSA in Aussie and thought it was great).

I also take on board that as we age, we are also not up for hard core riding which again leads me to suggest lighter bikes not heavier?...PS love the NF 530 adventure btw

[vegeman]

[QUOTE=Gremlin;1130968855]You gotta be joking. We all ride them like this:

QUOTE]

That 2nd guy bought the dream I bet when he put all his shit on it and rode it out the garage...like mentioned here, too slow, too frustrating to watch...if he carried momentum and let the bike do its stuff....it would be fine. I think it fall off anything.

The aussie ride I did was with Geoff Ballard and his mate ,who were pre riding the course for the Aussie BMW safari so he lent me an older GSA1200 and I was clearly concerned riding with a legend like him but he;s awesome and is about the ride more than trying to break speed records...yet he does prefer taking the bike where they shouldn't. I was genuinely surprised where this big pig would go but you really have to be good first, as learning on that is hard. I only dropped it once, got stuck-ish twice and let him ride it down one fucking nasty downhill, I didn't want to wreck his bike, nor myself!!

[Night Falcon]

How many of us actually give a decent amount of thought to the riding we actually do (opposed to would like to do) or are capable of doing before deciding on a bike? Then there's the try it and see approach of ownership....I've just done that one, its expensive when it don't work out.

Big bikes have their limitations, that's a given, but they do cover a broad range of bases. Generally speaking you get:

A good road bike that handles blasting, commuting, day tripping, or touring.
They can carry good amount of luggage and a passenger
Not lacking on power...wow factor is important...on ya Veg for pointing that out!
Can get you off the beaten track and will handle quite gnarly terrain....if your up to it.
Are more comfortable ride....big plus for broken down over 50's

I do like the AT and also the 1050 but its 19inch front wheel was getting me down....until I realized nearly all the competition including the 1190 adv as well as zee fuer of all adventure bikes, the BMW GSA all have 19inch fronts and 17inch rears. So I don't think its going to limit me much at all especially in 99% of the terrain I will be riding it in.

I looked hard at a new 690 last night which is also a $20K+ bike (with all the add-ons I would need to hiff at it) but in the end most of the reasons you'd want a great lightweight adv bike for I wont be needing and I had that and more with the 530 I just sold

The big bikes are quite possibly overkill for NZ conditions, but as Arnie says in his latest war game advert.....why send in one attack Helicopter when six will do!