Gun happy US police

[Akzle]

Sorry, "semi"-automatic assault weapons then; why does Joe Public need them?

define "assault weapons"

pro-tip, try to do better than the nz stasi.

12G shotgun would be my weapon of choice for protecting my family in my home.

interesting choice.
unwieldly.
in many cases presenting a firearm (personally I find the business end of a .4x calibre pistol scary as shit) will de-escalate the situation, without even the need for shots fired.
hollywood has a lot to answer for. if you don't shoot, or don't get shot at, it's all hyperbole.

I for one hope the Police don't get to carry guns all the time, they just don't get the training required and they would be a danger to the public. I'm reliably informed they currently get one day training per year, (perhaps, weather permitting).

the average bobby (with access to firearms) has to shoot LESS than is even required for a B cat (pistol) license (by about 10 fold)
just goes to show, sign up with the right gang and they'll look after you, legislature or no,

there are many and varied reasons why (particularly NZ) police should not be routinely armed. not least of which is their inability to de-escalate situations. (let alone actually shoot the people who should be shot)

NZ had no firearms licencing prior to 1918 and that year is not a coincidence. The then new law was not to protect the public, the politicians had noticed what had taken place in Russia in 1917 and didn't want that to happen here. Then as now, they were motivated soley by the desire to save their own arses.

crown legislature is a fucking laugh, all the way through. but oldie hit it. legislation only affects the X% who choose to abide by any part of it at any time, and those who get caught infringing it.

i've seen police amouries. i've seen gang amouries.
i know which side i'll be on when the SHTF.

That's the one, pre-meditated murder just gets much easier with high capacity and high rate of fire weapons.

Some car drivers ride bikes too... So why do farmers need semi automatic weapons?

to kill lots of shit quickly.

are you sugesting my 90y/o grandfather (who can crank 30rds through an enfield over irons faster and more accurately than most goons with a modern semis) should be limited to a single shot?

your argument is stupid.

[pritch]

So why do farmers need semi automatic weapons?

Now you have demonstrated that you've no idea what you're on about. Best to stfu?

[scumdog]

President Kennedy was head shot in a moving vehicle with a Carcano Model 91/38 ..

Impressive shot one thinks to ones self

sent for a divine source

And the Raurimu massacre dude used a single-barrelled shotgun to kill his 5 victims

[bogan]

Now you have demonstrated that you've no idea what you're on about. Best to stfu?

Or, you could answer the question, cos none of the farmers I know need em. None of the farms I've shot on have even had em, bolt actions do a fine job of varmint control.

[pritch]

And the Raurimu massacre dude used a single-barrelled shotgun to kill his 5 victims

To me the interesting thing about that was that people sent their kids to the houses of firearms owners.

But the likes of Bogan will have no idea why?

[pritch]

, cos none of the farmers I know need em.

There you go. You need to get out more.

[bogan]

To me the interesting thing about that was that people sent their kids to the houses of firearms owners.

But the likes of Bogan will have no idea why?

I'd ask why a nutjob had access to a gun in the first place. While more guns could have saved his later victims, you're never going to stop the first shots (not having access to that gun would though). But more guns will mean more first shots. It's almost as if there could be some sort of causal link to go along with US's high gun death and high gun ownership rates... But I guess you don't want to hear that, is that why I'm told to STFU?

There you go. You need to get out more.

And you still need to give a reason... bit tricky to think up a good one though isn't it

[pritch]

And you still need to give a reason... bit tricky to think up a good one though isn't it

Fuck off. I don't come to KB to argue but excessive stupidity can piss me off.

Helen Clark didn't own a gun, none of her friends owned guns, in her mind therefore nobody needed guns.

Your logic is exactly the same.

Have you ridden south of Taupo? Have you ridden SH43? If you get out and about with eyes open you'll see lots of country where the major pest control problem isn't rabbits.

You don't even seem to know what country you live in. Like I said get out more.

[bogan]

Fuck off. I don't come to KB to argue but excessive stupidity can piss me off.

Helen Clark didn't own a gun, none of her friends owned guns, in her mind therefore nobody needed guns.

Your logic is exactly the same.

Have you ridden south of Taupo? Have you ridden SH43? If you get out and about with eyes open you'll see lots of country where the major pest control problem isn't rabbits.

You don't even seem to know what country you live in. Like I said get out more.

Ah, there's the eloquence we've come to expect of gun advocates Nobody is saying take all the guns, nobody is saying take away all your deterrents for 'pests'; so lets shoot down that strawman eh. I'm saying take away the guns that any demented fuckwit can pick up, and go kill tens of people in one spree.

I've ridden much of the country in fact, it gets a little different up in the far north. Perhaps the problem is that people take exception to being refereed to as pests? That's probably your problem tbh, get some wider perspective, tally up gun murders vs armed police kills vs self defense kills with guns...

[scumdog]

Ah, there's the eloquence we've come to expect of gun advocates Nobody is saying take all the guns, nobody is saying take away all your deterrents for 'pests'; so lets shoot down that strawman eh. I'm saying take away the guns that any demented fuckwit can pick up, and go kill tens of people in one spree.

I've ridden much of the country in fact, it gets a little different up in the far north. Perhaps the problem is that people take exception to being refereed to as pests? That's probably your problem tbh, get some wider perspective, tally up gun murders vs armed police kills vs self defense kills with guns...

Are you drunk?

[Brian d marge]

What happened in 1917 ... Was a colorful revolution... And one family in a basement not exactly sharp shooting
Dumbarse americans


sent for a divine source

[Brian d marge]

And the Raurimu massacre dude used a single-barrelled shotgun to kill his 5 victims

He reloaded quickly then

sent for a divine source

[bogan]

Are you drunk?

Jeez, what is it with this topic and all these questions and insinuations about me instead of actual points? It's like arguing with Ed, but less pink bits. You guys really should be doing better than that

If you want a drunk guy to talk to, check the two posts above this one...

[TheDemonLord]

Or, you could answer the question, cos none of the farmers I know need em. None of the farms I've shot on have even had em, bolt actions do a fine job of varmint control.

Pest control/Culling (especially on a commercial scale).
Competition shooting.
Preference for the lighter recoil of a Semi-Auto.
Preference for the ease of reloading (esp if the shooter has trouble cycling a bolt).

To address your points - IMO, the US gun Laws are fucked. The UK went waaaay too overboard - NZ has got a pretty good balance. Personally anyone who thinks they need a firearm for self-defence is not the type of person that I think should be walking around with a firearm - case in point, the US and accidental shootings by scared people with a handgun (and yes, that includes the police). If your point is what we 'need' then yes the concession is that for the purpose of Farming or Hunting, there isn't a 'need' for semi or full auto. But then I don't need a Hayabusa, a 250 was 'fine'. The point being that we are allowed to safely operate objects that far exceed the limits of what is needed, provided we follow the rules for the operation of said objects.

Final point - whilst there is a causal link in the US, look at Canada, Norway, Sweden, Switzerland and NZ, all countries with relatively high Guns per capita - all countries with high guns per Capita (although not as high as the US) all countries with strong and well established Hunting and farming cultures and all countries with a very mature gun cultures.

I'll agree that part of the problem is America's Gun Laws (and the extremely high availability of firearms), but it's not the only part.

[pete376403]

President Kennedy was head shot in a moving vehicle with a Carcano Model 91/38 ..

Impressive shot one thinks to ones self

sent for a divine source

But it was loaded with magic bullets. How else to explain the "single bullet theory" - According to the single-bullet theory, a three-centimeter (1.2″)-long copper-jacketed lead-core 6.5×52mm Mannlicher–Carcano rifle bullet fired from the sixth floor of the Texas School Book Depository passed through President Kennedy’s neck and Governor Connally’s chest and wrist and embedded itself in the Governor’s thigh. If so, this bullet traversed 15 layers of clothing, 7 layers of skin, and approximately 15 inches of tissue, struck a necktie knot, removed 4 inches of rib, and shattered a radius bone. The bullet was found on a gurney in the corridor at the Parkland Memorial Hospital, in Dallas, after the assassination. The Warren Commission found that this gurney was the one that had borne Governor Connally.[3] This bullet became a key Commission exhibit, identified as CE 399. Its copper jacket was completely intact. While the bullet's nose appeared normal, the tail was compressed laterally on one side