South Africa is going (further) down thew toilet

[jafagsx250]

Is that really a bad reason to emigrate somewhere if you've witnessed a whole state be destroyed by a bunch of corrupt idiot's. All they did was flipped the oppressed and the People doing the oppression.

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[jasonu]

e people involved were even alive... How would most react to that happening to them I wonder?

SA will go the way of Zimbabwe in that it will become a total basket case, totally reliant on foreign aid


I doubt any aid will come from here.



Oh and how do I know? Well I grew up in SA through those nasty Apartheid years. I no longer live there - There are very good reasons for this as can be seen by the latest state of affairs...

I know a couple of SA expats from my Sky City casino days (mid 1990's). They all had similar reasons for getting the hell out.

[jasonu]

It was my experience the first preferred destination was Australia.
they came to NZ because they could easily become NZ citizens after 3? Years then go to Australia as a NZder.

Lots of asians running from Hong Kong (reverting to chinese rule in 1997) did the same. The ones that wanted to go to Aussie but were rejected came to NZ (more lax entry rules for cultural diversity and such shit), became residents (3 years I think) then fucked off to Australia. It pissed off the Aussies no end.

[TheDemonLord]

I'd just like to challenge the last part of your statement.

There are several viewpoints - One appears to be that of 20/20 hindsight vision, the other IMO places the interpretation of the events within the time period that it occurred.

Was Churchill racist? Probably by todays standards (although everyone who is right of Mao is apparently some form of Racist these days...)

You could say that Churchill's beliefs in English democracy, sovereignty of the individual and associated Philosophy and Thought meant that he simply places a higher value on the English than the Indians.

However you could counter this with pointing out that it wasn't India who declared War on Germany, nor was it won by primarily Indian Generals and Admirals. Furthermore, the prevailing philosophy of the Indian independence movement was one of Pacifism.

It's interesting to note that Churchill spent time in India in his Youth - and although the Author disputes this, I'm certain that his experiences as a Young Man shaped the views he held later in life.

For me - the Allies took a Gamble:

On the one hand - you risk the possibility of Famine, but deny the enemy critical resources.
On the other - you don't have to worry about Famine, but you guarantee the enemy a tactical advantage.

Given that the majority of Britains forces were tied up in the European theatre at this point and the disastrous result of the Battle of Borneo/The Malayian campaign - the prevailing thought was that Britain couldn't split her forces and fight on another front against the Japanese.

Thus it seems to me at least, they took the lesser of the 2 evils.

And to any Indian author who wishes to shit all over Churchill - I'd suggest the read about the Rape of Nanking and Unit 731 - so they have a baseline as to what would have awaited them if the Japanese had invaded.

[oldrider]

There are several viewpoints - One appears to be that of 20/20 hindsight vision, the other IMO places the interpretation of the events within the time period that it occurred.

Was Churchill racist? Probably by todays standards (although everyone who is right of Mao is apparently some form of Racist these days...)

You could say that Churchill's beliefs in English democracy, sovereignty of the individual and associated Philosophy and Thought meant that he simply places a higher value on the English than the Indians.

However you could counter this with pointing out that it wasn't India who declared War on Germany, nor was it won by primarily Indian Generals and Admirals. Furthermore, the prevailing philosophy of the Indian independence movement was one of Pacifism.

It's interesting to note that Churchill spent time in India in his Youth - and although the Author disputes this, I'm certain that his experiences as a Young Man shaped the views he held later in life.

For me - the Allies took a Gamble:

On the one hand - you risk the possibility of Famine, but deny the enemy critical resources.
On the other - you don't have to worry about Famine, but you guarantee the enemy a tactical advantage.

Given that the majority of Britains forces were tied up in the European theatre at this point and the disastrous result of the Battle of Borneo/The Malayian campaign - the prevailing thought was that Britain couldn't split her forces and fight on another front against the Japanese.

Thus it seems to me at least, they took the lesser of the 2 evils.

And to any Indian author who wishes to shit all over Churchill - I'd suggest the read about the Rape of Nanking and Unit 731 - so they have a baseline as to what would have awaited them if the Japanese had invaded.

You can take the boy out of England but you cant take the English out of the boy!

[TheDemonLord]

You can take the boy out of England but you cant take the English out of the boy!

Must Spread etc.

(even though I don't agree with the manner in which it was meant )

[oldrider]

Must Spread etc.

(even though I don't agree with the manner in which it was meant )

OK how was it meant?