The American (USA) 2016 presidential elections thread?

**TheDemonLord** · 5th November 2018, 21:48

Originally Posted by pritch

Which is completely irrelevant.

Except it's not the completely unprecedented action that you are trying to portray it as, Unless you want to argue that the National Guard don't count... but I suspect that the NG themselves would have some rather choice words to say about that.

Originally Posted by pritch

Hopefully Trump will be knobbled Wednesday evening our time and the Nazi pricks who have felt emboldened by his rants will crawl back under their rocks.

I'll give you a hint - that type of whining is what makes the average centrist voter vote FOR Trump, not against.

**oldrider** · 5th November 2018, 21:55

Iran's Powerful Hardline Cleric Threatens To "Instantly" Create $400 Oil By Seizing Tankers https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-...missiles-ahead - Yeah right! - Tui moment?

**jasonu** · 6th November 2018, 04:00

Originally Posted by pritch

You're starting to sound like a Trumpist. They're always whinging about "illegals" leeching off the welfare system and voting illegally whereas anybody with a functioning brain knows illegal immigrants can't get welfare and they can't vote.

Most do pay taxes though although they get nothing in return..

Going by these statements it is obvious you have not spent any significant time here and you absolutely don’t know what the fuck you are talking about.

**seattle smitty** · 6th November 2018, 06:35

Two cents from another 'merkin:

Let me start by stating that I detest Trump, this country's biggest bullshyter, a huge embarrassment. His followers are likely to do very well in this election because the economy is doing very well at the moment, . . . despite the fact that this is something for which Trump cannot begin to legitimately take credit (he has been in office for a year and nine months, far too little time to greatly affect any economic cycle, this one being nearly ten years old, so far). I will also say that despite my distaste for modern self-described conservatives, I was an enthusiastic Goldwater conservative in my youth, and remain generally somewhat to the Right of center, so don't imagine that any agreement here for a Trump idea is a product of American political liberalism.

What I want to say is that Trump's anti-illegal-immigrant rhetoric does NOT repeat NOT make him a racist or xenophobe in itself, and I doubt that he is one. Furthermore, I applaud his current stated intention (his statements usually lead to nothing, and are often reversed in a week or two) to end automatic citizenship for all offspring of non-citizens who bring them across our borders to be born. I will further say that the first-generation immigrant Mexicans, legal or not, are by and large hard-working, tax-paying, and admirable folk (where too many of the non-immigrants here are lazy whiners).

BUT . . .

BUT, THIS COUNTRY HAS TOO MANY PEOPLE ALREADY!!!!

When I was a kid in the Fifties, the far-sighted were already, and I remember this very well, warning of over-population, . . . in a time when the country had about 155-160 million citizens. We now have something near 330 millions!!! Our cities, formerly liveable, are daily gridlocked with all the people trying to get to work and back. Sit in your car in one of these creeping, miles-long traffic crawls and you surely can see how stupid we were all those years ago to fail to do anything we could to prevent the doubling of our population. Where are all the people who want to come here going to live? Millions of acres of rich farmlands and wild country stretching for tens and hundreds of miles out from the old city and town limits of the years of my youth have and are being paved-over by developers, who get rich on this environmental despoilation. The America of my youth is utterly unrecognizable.

So it is long-since time that we took down the signs inviting any and all to come here. The welcome mat is long-since obsolete. The sign should be, "Visitors welcome, we'd love to meet you, but if your country is a mess, go back and try to fix it, by whatever means you feel necessary. We have no more vacancies here, we are FULL, period."

**pete376403** · 6th November 2018, 06:54

Originally Posted by seattle smitty

Two cents from another 'merkin:

Let me start by stating that I detest Trump, this country's biggest bullshyter, a huge embarrassment. His followers are likely to do very well in this election because the economy is doing very well at the moment, . . . despite the fact that this is something for which Trump cannot begin to legitimately take credit (he has been in office for a year and nine months, far too little time to greatly affect any economic cycle, this one being nearly ten years old, so far). I will also say that despite my distaste for modern self-described conservatives, I was an enthusiastic Goldwater conservative in my youth, and remain generally somewhat to the Right of center, so don't imagine that any agreement here for a Trump idea is a product of American political liberalism.

What I want to say is that Trump's anti-illegal-immigrant rhetoric does NOT repeat NOT make him a racist or xenophobe in itself, and I doubt that he is one. Furthermore, I applaud his current stated intention (his statements usually lead to nothing, and are often reversed in a week or two) to end automatic citizenship for all offspring of non-citizens who bring them across our borders to be born. I will further say that the first-generation immigrant Mexicans, legal or not, are by and large hard-working, tax-paying, and admirable folk (where too many of the non-immigrants here are lazy whiners).

BUT . . .

BUT, THIS COUNTRY HAS TOO MANY PEOPLE ALREADY!!!!

When I was a kid in the Fifties, the far-sighted were already, and I remember this very well, warning of over-population, . . . in a time when the country had about 155-160 million citizens. We now have something near 330 millions!!! Our cities, formerly liveable, are daily gridlocked with all the people trying to get to work and back. Sit in your car in one of these creeping, miles-long traffic crawls and you surely can see how stupid we were all those years ago to fail to do anything we could to prevent the doubling of our population. Where are all the people who want to come here going to live? Millions of acres of rich farmlands and wild country stretching for tens and hundreds of miles out from the old city and town limits of the years of my youth have and are being paved-over by developers, who get rich on this environmental despoilation. The America of my youth is utterly unrecognizable.

So it is long-since time that we took down the signs inviting any and all to come here. The welcome mat is long-since obsolete. The sign should be, "Visitors welcome, we'd love to meet you, but if your country is a mess, go back and try to fix it, by whatever means you feel necessary. We have no more vacancies here, we are FULL, period."

Good, rational post - totally out of place here. Its not just the US that is full - the entire planet is overpopulated. A decent plague would help (I had high hopes for Ebola, but alas not to be)

**Ocean1** · 6th November 2018, 07:05

Originally Posted by pete376403

Good, rational post - totally out of place here. Its not just the US that is full - the entire planet is overpopulated. A decent plague would help (I had high hopes for Ebola, but alas not to be)

http://statisticstimes.com/populatio...on-density.php

**oldrider** · 6th November 2018, 07:26

Originally Posted by Ocean1

http://statisticstimes.com/populatio...on-density.php

Overpopulated? [ 185 New Zealand 18.206 ] Perhaps KB could bare testimony enough to that.

**jasonu** · 6th November 2018, 07:53

Originally Posted by seattle smitty

Two cents from another 'merkin:

Let me start by stating that I detest Trump, this country's biggest bullshyter, a huge embarrassment. His followers are likely to do very well in this election because the economy is doing very well at the moment, . . . despite the fact that this is something for which Trump cannot begin to legitimately take credit (he has been in office for a year and nine months, far too little time to greatly affect any economic cycle, this one being nearly ten years old, so"

Maybe the good economy is not trumps doing but dollars to donuts if the economy had taken a slide since he got in it would be all his fault.

**oldrider** · 6th November 2018, 08:15

Originally Posted by jasonu

Maybe the good economy is not trumps doing but dollars to donuts if the economy had taken a slide since he got in it would be all his fault.

True! - Like him or lump him that's the way of politics world over.

**pritch** · 6th November 2018, 09:24

Originally Posted by TheDemonLord

Except it's not the completely unprecedented action that you are trying to portray it as, Unless you want to argue that the National Guard don't count... but I suspect that the NG themselves would have some rather choice words to say about that.

I'll give you a hint - that type of whining is what makes the average centrist voter vote FOR Trump, not against.

You apparently have difficulty with simple things. The National Guard is not the Army. The National Guard is permitted to be deployed against civilians. The Army is not.

One mans "centrist" is another mans Nazi.

**Viking01** · 6th November 2018, 10:36

Did I miss something like Obama being re-appointed to head up the
Democrats again ?

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-a8618811.html

**Viking01** · 6th November 2018, 14:50

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-...lections-guide

**TheDemonLord** · 6th November 2018, 18:01

Originally Posted by pritch

You apparently have difficulty with simple things. The National Guard is not the Army. The National Guard is permitted to be deployed against civilians. The Army is not.

Which is why I used the word "Troops", and the NG have participated in active Combat roles in recent years. However, even if I accept your nitpick (which I don't FYI) - you're still left with the problem that the people wanting to come in are not US Civilians, and therefore are not subject to the limitations placed on the Army.

Originally Posted by pritch

One mans "centrist" is another mans Nazi.

And there you have your truest statement - you're right, if your other Man happens to be to the Left of Stalin...

**seattle smitty** · 7th November 2018, 05:25

Originally Posted by jasonu

Maybe the good economy is not trumps doing but dollars to donuts if the economy had taken a slide since he got in it would be all his fault.

Absolutely right. Happened to Obama, where he was blamed for the very slow recovery following the bank crashes of 2008. He could have handled the situation he inherited from Bush a whole lot better than he did, but the economy would have recovered slowly regardless. A lot of presidents were either lucky or unlucky depending on the trajectory of the economy during their term. The current boom is getting somewhat long in the tooth, and if Trump is wise he might want to quit after one term and declare himself Greatest Ever.

Pete, why was my post out of place? It's an election thread, and I was discussing a central issue, immigration and border control, and why I agree with a president I otherwise dislike.

**Voltaire** · 7th November 2018, 06:15

Dropping the corporate tax rate from 35% to 21% has given companies a huge boost. Means they can do more share buy backs and increase investor returns. Company I contract too just bought another one for 34 billion us. Ceo has 35 mill in shares and this week bought another 3 mill. Nice.....