So its pretty late in the pandemic

[TheDemonLord]

Even slightly deadly was deadly enough for me.

Is it though?

Everyday - I guarantee that you do multiple things that involve a degree of deadly risk.

This is, to me, like the person who is scared of flying, but will happily drive to the airport.

[TheDemonLord]

Fuck there's some good circular reasoning.

But for the slow of thinking:

Health recommendation was pushing for isolation and mask wearing. They don't to in operating theatre for giggles.

But politicians were concerned that closing restaurants etc would be crippling. So they pushed for compromise.
Can you not see that?

Except it is not circular reasoning. I will put the operating theatre to one side for the moment.

The degree of Compromise betrays the degree of Risk. There are some health and safety related policies that the Government does not compromise on. Try taking a pocket knife into a court house for example - there is no exception. Because of the high risk involved.

However, with Covid - yeah, we will put all these exceptions in place - because of the high risk that there is not.

Now - to be clear - I am fine with a health Recommendation. Those who want to adhere to it or those who are very worried about their health can heed that recommendation. Those of us that think is is unneccesary can choose to ignore it.

Just like Motorcycling, yes we have a Helmet law - because of the high risk associated with Head Injuries - but everything else: Stubbies and Flip Flops if you so choose - whereas I wont ride in anything less than full gear.

Which is to lead back to this: If the Risk is so benign that an exception can be granted to sit down and eat at a restaurant, then the risk is not severe enough to require legislative force.

Coming back to the Operating theatre - because of the factors around surgery: large open wounds for long period of time, people with pre-existing health conditions, close working proximity etc. Then is makes sense that this would be the standard.

You wouldn't do that if you were a socialist Totalitarian government bent on public control as you suggest.

Except that it was a Policy we imported from China - which very much is a Socialist totalitarian government bent on public control (by every objective standard)

So, kinda refutes your point there...

[Berries]

Everyday - I guarantee that you do multiple things that involve a degree of deadly risk.

This is, to me, like the person who is scared of flying, but will happily drive to the airport.

You can mitigate some of the risk when driving to the airport in a multitude of ways, from wearing a seat belt or travelling slowly or going when the roads are quiet or getting a fancy 10 star car. Once you are on the plane your life is in someone else's hands so not a fair comparison of risk at all.

Like mask wearing. If someone thought that by wearing one they would be less likely to breathe in the virus, or indeed thought they would be less likely to breathe out the virus and infect others they were doing what they thought best to mitigate things for their health and the health of others. Unlike those who shout out loud that they just didn't give a shit about other people like you did when you dredged up a three year old thread just to tell/troll everyone.

I think you will find most people moved on several years ago, apart from you and TLDR.

[Katman]

I think you will find most people moved on several years ago, apart from you and TLDR.

And yet, here you are.

[TheDemonLord]

You can mitigate some of the risk when driving to the airport in a multitude of ways, from wearing a seat belt or travelling slowly or going when the roads are quiet or getting a fancy 10 star car. Once you are on the plane your life is in someone else's hands so not a fair comparison of risk at all.

It is entirely a fair comparison, for the exact reason you outlined.

Taking a large risk which you are (mostly) in control of is psychologically preferable to taking a much smaller risk to which you are mostly not in control in.

And I appreciate that - but....

Like mask wearing. If someone thought that by wearing one they would be less likely to breathe in the virus, or indeed thought they would be less likely to breathe out the virus and infect others they were doing what they thought best to mitigate things for their health and the health of others.

So, hold up here - above, previously you outlined that it is preferable to take an increased risk that you are in control of (like say choosing to wear or not wear a mask) - but now you seem to be switching position as to require other people to manage your risks for you?

Which is it?

Surely you must see that this is an inconsistent position.

Either we are free to assume individual risk or we are not. Either the masks are effective and you wearing yours should protect you, or they are not and my not wearing one has no impact on you.

Unlike those who shout out loud that they just didn't give a shit about other people like you did when you dredged up a three year old thread just to tell/troll everyone.

I think you will find most people moved on several years ago, apart from you and TLDR.

What are the limits to giving a shit about other people?

And before you try to make the argument that there arent - let me be clear - you dont give a shit about other people in many of the same ways I dont - and this is not the moral judgement that you may think it is.

You presumably have a house - you could allow a homeless person to sleep on the floor of your house - but I am willing to bet you dont and you wouldnt - in just the same way that I dont and I wouldnt.

We both agree that there is a point where we say - You do you.

Where we draw the line differs from individual to individual, and that is fine - but we both agree that at some point, we are going to allow people we do not know to suffer from the results of their actions. If you choose to go into a public place, even with a Mask on, but with underlying health complications that means you are at an elevated risk - the demand to control the actions of everyone else just for your safety is unreasonable.

It would be the same as a Mother insisting that no one else drives on the road between 8 am and 9 am when she is doing the school run to drop her child off at school.

My issue with Mask wearing comes from its philosophical inconsistency, contradiction in policy and the fact that it was mandated.

I bumped the COVID forum because of the report that was released - many people suffered greatly as a direct result of unneccesary government policy - and the fact that no one has been held to account means that we cannot move on.

[Berries]

I bumped the COVID forum because of the report that was released - many people suffered greatly as a direct result of unneccesary government policy - and the fact that no one has been held to account means that we cannot move on.

My apologies. My bacon buttie was about to land so I answered your post in a hurry thinking it was from Katman.

The thread bump comment was related to the somewhat pointless dredging of this particular thread just for someone to proudly say they never wore a mask. That's all fine and dandy if they were sitting at home, working in a big dirty workshop, milking cows or whatever but i am guessing that would not always be the case. I would also guess that an anti-mask kind of person would not bother testing either due to the chemtrails or whatever so would have no idea if they were contagious and might actually just want to give other people a bit more space. And that is where my not giving a shit comment comes from.

[Katman]

I would also guess that an anti-mask kind of person would not bother testing either due to the chemtrails or whatever so would have no idea if they were contagious and might actually just want to give other people a bit more space. And that is where my not giving a shit comment comes from.

If I get a case of the 'sniffles', I'll keep my distance from other people.

That's just common courtesy.

[TheDemonLord]

My apologies. My bacon buttie was about to land so I answered your post in a hurry thinking it was from Katman.

To be fair, Bacon Butties are serious business, so understandable.

The thread bump comment was related to the somewhat pointless dredging of this particular thread just for someone to proudly say they never wore a mask. That's all fine and dandy if they were sitting at home, working in a big dirty workshop, milking cows or whatever but i am guessing that would not always be the case.

Me, personally, when the Mask laws were in effect, I made a point of wearing my full-face helmet, with obscured Visor.

To really make the point of how absurd the rules were.

If I am going to follow silly rules, I will do so in the most silly way possible. There were some fun times - especially when security guards and alike wanted to complain but knew they had no leg to stand on.

Then when more data became available, I stopped altogether. Some shops had issues with it, they no longer get my business. Other shops decided it was better to just leave me be - they have had my repeat custom.

I would also guess that an anti-mask kind of person would not bother testing either due to the chemtrails or whatever so would have no idea if they were contagious and might actually just want to give other people a bit more space. And that is where my not giving a shit comment comes from.

If I was sick, I tested and stayed home.

[1/32 man]

If I was sick, I tested and stayed home.

Unlike a lot of other fucktards who walked around coughing and sneezing their germs everwhere and on everything....so a fucktard rule for fucktards, of which there are many.

[TheDemonLord]

Unlike a lot of other fucktards who walked around coughing and sneezing their germs everwhere and on everything....so a fucktard rule for fucktards, of which there are many.

I had the luxury of working full time from home - not everyone else has that.

Some people who were walking around coughing and sneezing may have had to do so to keep a roof over their head and food on the table.

[pritch]

You can mitigate some of the risk when driving to the airport in a multitude of ways, from wearing a seat belt or travelling slowly or going when the roads are quiet or getting a fancy 10 star car. Once you are on the plane your life is in someone else's hands so not a fair comparison of risk at all.

That is the crux of the matter. People who are afraid of flying are closely related to control freaks. They do not like having no control whereas they will be happy driving a car - no matter how crap their driving is.

[Katman]

That is the crux of the matter. People who are afraid of flying are closely related to control freaks. They do not like having no control whereas they will be happy driving a car - no matter how crap their driving is.

What about the people who are afraid of flying but have no problem being a passenger in a car?

[R650R]

That is the crux of the matter. People who are afraid of flying are closely related to control freaks. They do not like having no control whereas they will be happy driving a car - no matter how crap their driving is.

Substitute the word flying with Covid and you have an image those more keen on freedom see the bigger picture.
Any large fear psychosis at its core likely has over consumption of mainstream media fuelled fear porn rather than any inherent personal traits being cause.
Turn off the tv a lot of fear vanishes.

I think a control freak would prefer flying, it’s highly regulated with over lapping layers of safety checks and maintainance checks where by stark contrast driving is open to anyone with poor enforcement of rules, complete ignorance of “preflight” checks by most imbibed with much higher chance of death or injury.

[pritch]

What about the people who are afraid of flying but have no problem being a passenger in a car?

What about them?

[Katman]

What about them?

Well they clearly don't have a fear of not being in control.