Halloween - Please think of the children!

[Dilligaf]

10 characters....

[judecatmad]

Bollocks

It is an american tradition that has been commercialised here in good ole NZ -next we will be expected to celebrate thanksgiving as well.

By all means dress your wee ones up and have a bit of fun ..... in your own back yard... don't bring 'em into mine and expect to get sweets for it. bah humbug

Notices on both the letterbox and the front door are ignored and parents are often abusive if you open the door to turn them away politely.

My youngest had the right idea when he was living at home and used to keep weetbix and apples by the door and hand them out randomly. The nasty responses that he got from both the adults and the children were eyeopeners into the expectations that had been obviously been set.

So is Christmas but I bet you still have a Xmas tree decorated with lights, and presents wrapped in bright paper. And I'll bet there is a clear expectation from the family that presents will be given and that they will be good ones. Try giving your kids a stocking filled with oranges, nuts and a home-made wooden toy and see the response you get.

And the modern Mother's Day - that's a commercialised bastardisation of a once a year pilgrimage that working children used to make home to see their mothers. Oh, and Father's Day was invented by the card companies so that dads didn't 'feel left out'.

And why should you get money for your teeth falling out? It's just a natural process on the road to getting your adult teeth, after all.... The fact that it's your parents who put the money there (or in my case, my dead grandfather who used to put the money under the carpet...long story, LOL) is awful cos parents are so cash-strapped these days without all that extra nonsense.

How would carol singing be viewed? That's an age-old tradition. Granted that those kids that come along and sing one line of 'we wish you a merry xmas' are not greeted very favourably, but those that make an effort are duly rewarded (as are those kids who dress up well for Hallowe'en - I don't just hand sweets out indiscriminately to any old kid who turns up on the doorstep)

Totally agree that the response some kids (and adults) have when they don't get what they were expecting is shocking - as was proven when I offered (fruit) mince pies one year to some carol singers cos it was all I had in the house. But hey, their choice.

At the end of the day, there's a big difference between kids taking sweets from strangers in cars (as was one scenario offered in this thread), and kids begging on doorsteps on non-festive occasions, to kids making an effort, getting into the sprit of the night (the night as it is NOW, not how it used to be years ago - cos lets face it, times change...or they do for some people at least).

I just love the fact that NZ is safe enough for kids to go out trick or treating without fear of paedophiles taking advantage and for their spoils to not have to be vetted for ground-up glass, as is the case in so many places around the world.

Kids are kids for so short a time, it's a bit of magic in an otherwise dull week. And so it's an Americanisation - give me something these days that hasn't been bastardised in some way by the Yanks.

And no, I wouldn't expect anyone to celebrate Thanksgiving who didn't have a link to the USA - but if someone wished me Happy Thanksgiving I wouldn't run at them with a pitch-fork and tell them to go to hell. Will you be going to a firework display this year? God forbid that one of those might disturb your night on the 5th November because that's an English tradition.....

Take away what each and every culture and religion has brought to this country (Diwali, Chinese New Year, Guy Fawkes night, Christmas, Hallowe'en, Easter etc etc) and you'd be left with a pretty boring year.

But hey, you don't like the traditions that have evolved around Hallowe'en, I don't mind them. Who's to say who is right and who is wrong? Being held to ransom on Hallowe'en is wrong, I agree - especially by parents. If you don't want to give lollies, you shouldn't have to and you shouldn't be viewed as mean - just don't answer the door for goodness' sake if the response bothers you that much. But to begrudge the kids a bit of fun running around the neighbourhood dressed up as ghouls and ghosts (the fairies I don't quite understand....!), is a bit grinchy.

Anyway, I'm just off to do some street begging for the Wellington Free Ambulance. Here's hoping for a more favourable response than many kids will have got last night.



(don't take any of this to heart btw - I'm tired and grumpy and fed up of having this constantly kicking beach ball stuffed up my t-shirt. I'm just trying to keep some semblance of sanity by getting into the spirit of things!)

[ninjac]

The kids bang on the door.
I open it up just enough for them to say 'trick or treat' and have a squiz at their costumes. I then let the dog (Bull Mastiff) stick her head out and watch as the kids jump out of their skin.

[Trudes]

We don't tend to get many here, only the neighbours kids cause we live at the top of a hill and the rest of the lazy overweight kids and parents can't be arsed walking up the hill to get more sweets to stuff in their fat little mouths. The grinch strikes again!!

[Swoop]

A mate was telling me last night, about someone who moved into a high-rise apartment in town and thought he would be immune to ToT visitors knocking on his door.
Alas, he forgot that other families in the building had young kids...

[Her_C4]

So is Christmas but I bet you still have a Xmas tree decorated with lights, and presents wrapped in bright paper. And I'll bet there is a clear expectation from the family that presents will be given and that they will be good ones. Try giving your kids a stocking filled with oranges, nuts and a home-made wooden toy and see the response you get. etc etc

......(don't take any of this to heart btw - I'm tired and grumpy and fed up of having this constantly kicking beach ball stuffed up my t-shirt. I'm just trying to keep some semblance of sanity by getting into the spirit of things!)

Hmmm, interesting response.... I didn't click re: the 9 months bit (a bit slow these days - sorry ) Amazing how it can feel like a year long isn't it??? Hope yu don't have too long to go??

FWIW, there was a time when my children did indeed recieve presents for xmas very much as you have outlined above. They had no expectations other than what I could or could not afford at the time. I also had a couple of friends at school (admittedly maaaaany years ago now), who never even got the home made toy, but were still made to feel treasured and special with simple family parties and outings.

I believe (and happy to be corrected if I am wrong) but Mothers Day has its origins in ancient Greece, Christmas in Ancient Rome, the tooth fairy has its origins in 18th century Europe, and in fact even Halloween comes from the Celts in Ireland / UK…

My issue I guess is with the (IMO) crass commercialism and sensationalism that comes with everything these days and the expectations that are bestowed upon us all to adopt, advocate and indeed ‘buy in’ (literally) to the need to exaggerate everything.

I don’t do things just because the person next door does, nor indeed do I bow under peer pressure (unless of course I have a wish to). Why do we teach our children to? Why are we not teaching them and and supporting them to make independent, rational decisions? What happened to simplicity? What is wrong with it? What happened to responsible parents teaching their children to have fun with the basic things in life - and with that an APPRECIATION of the finer things??

My other main issue is one of individual privacy and respect.

You want to celebrate these festivals? By all means 'fill your boots' as they say, and please do find likeminded souls to share the experience, but I - as an individual believe in choosing what I celebrate, how I celebrate, who I celebrate with and when. I try really hard to respect other people’s beliefs and wishes whilst I do. It would be cool if others would do the same to be and mine in return.

PS: Fathers Day is indeed American – started somewhere in the early 1900’s I believe….

[Virago]

Halloween is one of those events that bring out the nastiness and misery in communities. Bah Bloody Humbug.

But what's it all about? Kids in the neighbourhood dressing up and parading around their neighbours, with perhaps the reward of a lolly or two? And this brings out all this anger and resentment?

Come on guys, where the hell is your community spirit?

Neighbours don't get to know each other like they used to. This is the perfect opportunity to reach out to each other, to get to meet others in the community, and yes, get to meet their children. Remember the good old days when adults and children could interact without fear and mistrust? I do...

Okay, stay inside your castles, with you guard-dogs and "keep-out" signs, and complain about those very neighbours you are rejecting. Tossers...

[Finn]

Last night was brilliant! After eating all the lollies myself, I had a major sugar rush that only some vigorous exercise with a water cannon could fix. It was priceless and taught the little shits the meaning of "Trick", the other part of the equation they didn't seem to understand.

One thing stumped me though - a van load of Samoans turned up again this year. I asked them where they were from. Mangere. No further comment.

[Dilligaf]

Come on the huge difference here between Halloween and Christmas which surprisingly no-one has mentioned is that on Christmas, your next door neighbours do not come knocking on your door with their hands out for a present. Nor when little Johnny loses his first tooth, does he go knocking around the neighbourhood for money.
Halloween makes everyone have to buy into some people's beliefs (whatever). And look what you get called if you are not interested in participating!
So to all of you who talked about bah humbug etc then I'd like to see you fronting up with say, a baptism present for young Nats eh? Doesn't matter if you believe in Christianity or not, it's all about community right???
Hypocrisy much??

[Freakshow]

On the way home from work I saw many kids in the streets and was really disappointed with thier efforts in Newlands. Yet over in Fetherston the lil hick town the kids had really put some effort into thier costumes. Was this noticed that the urban kids were not that dressed up?

[007XX]

(don't take any of this to heart btw - I'm tired and grumpy and fed up of having this constantly kicking beach ball stuffed up my t-shirt. I'm just trying to keep some semblance of sanity by getting into the spirit of things!)

Good post...good to knwo the beach ball is healthy and kicking!

And sanity is highly overrated...

I personally don't go for the whole Halloween thing, never have. maybe because I wasn't raised with it (noone in New Caledonia used to do it). I don't begrudge it to anyone, but I don't like the constant marketing brain washing that seems to appear with it, as is the case with the other holidays...

I mean, did anyone else notice that Xmas decorations are already out????

So anyway, back on topic, sorry... I look forward to being in a neighbourhood that does celebrate Halloween so my son and I can take part in it. I'd only do it for his sake, but where we are, no one does it...

[HTFU]

Americanisation or is that Americanization is here to stay thanks to good old T.V and especially if there's money to be made. Maybe those who have treats to give should put a little American flag on there mailbox so the kids know who to harass . Would be cool if they then showed these flags on T.V so Muslim Terrorists could see we really are just in the process of becoming a mini america that drives on the wrong side of the road.

[Flatcap]

Okay, stay inside your castles, with you guard-dogs and "keep-out" signs, and complain about those very neighbours you are rejecting. Tossers...

I don't mind my neighbours kids, as Finn mentions above it's the random vanloads that seem to appear from outside the neighbourhood that piss me off.

[Mikkel]

Back home we had another tradition instead of Halloween. It was originally a feast to celebrate the end of the fast (as in adhering to a strict diet for a certain time - not as going down the road at great speed).
We children would dress up and we would have a party were we knocked a wooden barrel down with clubs, called "to hit the cat of the barrel". (In the good old days they would put a living cat into the barrel and it would usually not be alive anymore when the barrel broke) Inside the barrel was lollies and fruit. Good fun all around and we didn't go bother anyone besides the ones that showed up for the event. In my teens when I did taekwon-do we had our own variation - same deal except for the costumes and the clubs. That did cause me a few broken and and swolen knuckles and shins.

As for christmas - it's just a clever adaptation of a pagan ritual to usher in christianity without too much fuss. The original pagan ritual was of course the mid-winter solstice - the shortest day of the year - and was celebrated properly with mead, meat and orgies... good times all around. No wonder christianity needed something to fill that gap if they had any hopes for it's success.

[Wolf]

I spent last night at home quietly celebrating the beginning of Beltane. (Hallowe'en is a Christianised (and later commercialised) version of Samhain, the beginning of Winter, which is what's happening in the Northern Hemisphere around now. "Downunder" where the seasons are reversed, Beltane is more appropriate for us Celtic Pagans to celebrate.)

Still Beltane until nightfall tonight, so Happy Beltane, all.