Harley shocks

[rudolph]

I have a 1973 XLCH sportster I bort over a year ago, I have only ridden it 3 times, the rear shocks do not move at all under my weight, and it jars the shit out of my back.

It has S&W gas shocks, 345mm eye to eye. Any of you other Harley riders Know of some good shocks under the $600 mark? or are Ironheads normaly like this?

[rok-the-boat]

There must be something wrong with the shocks - can you not adjust them?

[scumdog]

My iron-head was a little SOFT two-up but not bad one up, it had Showa shock which I THINK were factory fitted.

Can your shocks not be adjusted? i.e. is the spring on it's highest setting?

[Robert Taylor]

I have a 1973 XLCH sportster I bort over a year ago, I have only ridden it 3 times, the rear shocks do not move at all under my weight, and it jars the shit out of my back.

It has S&W gas shocks, 345mm eye to eye. Any of you other Harley riders Know of some good shocks under the $600 mark? or are Ironheads normaly like this?

Good and under $600 dont go hand in hand. We have built a number of Ohlins twin shocks for Harleys and they will do exactly what the oem Harley shocks and cheap aftermarket shocks WONT do. They will actually absorb the abrupt bumps without the feel of a jackhammer being shoved up your hind quarters, while at the same time giving you superb ride height control. Just under a thousand dollars and the best money you will ever spend on the bike, plus a real saving on chiropractors fees later in life. Tyre life is also extended because the poor old tyre wont be trying to forever and unsuccessfully compensate for the non compliance of the suspension.

It never ceases to amaze me just how bad shocks are on many oem bikes and passenger cars, and also how bad the cheap aftermarket stuff is.

[Robert Taylor]

My iron-head was a little SOFT two-up but not bad one up, it had Showa shock which I THINK were factory fitted.

Can your shocks not be adjusted? i.e. is the spring on it's highest setting?

On cheap shocks external adjusters may as well be there for decoration only as they will not fundamentally change the character of the internal function. This is also not predominantly about spring rates either. The internal piston design and ''valving'' ( the inverted commas are deliberate ) chokes off at relatively low shock shaft speeds. The non compliance you feel over abrupt bumps is basically the shocks going into hydraulic lock.

[rudolph]

I pulled the shocks apart, found they are progressive brand, they had heeps of preload on the springs so i closed up some of the bottom coils by heating them, they move now.

Dose any one know the progressive agent in NZ?

[rudolph]

On cheap shocks external adjusters may as well be there for decoration only as they will not fundamentally change the character of the internal function. This is also not predominantly about spring rates either. The internal piston design and ''valving'' ( the inverted commas are deliberate ) chokes off at relatively low shock shaft speeds. The non compliance you feel over abrupt bumps is basically the shocks going into hydraulic lock.

My bos Ken Mcintosh sed you were the one to talk to, I am now willing to spend a bit more money, better than having my spine hammed to death.

I need something witch is 14 1/2" eye to eye long

[Robert Taylor]

I pulled the shocks apart, found they are progressive brand, they had heeps of preload on the springs so i closed up some of the bottom coils by heating them, they move now.

Dose any one know the progressive agent in NZ?

The basic methodology in cheap mass produced shocks for motorcycles and passenger cars is to have springs with a LOT of preload to hold them up in their stroke. And because there is so much spring force there needs to be lots of rebound force to control re-extension speed after a lot of travel is used. Thousands upon thousands of these can be churned out because there is no development cost in individually developing a proper damping curve for each individual model and the motion ratio it imparts to the shock. OEM and cheap aftermarket twin shocks are the easiest to build in this way.

A high quality, high performance and therefore higher price shock will have a properly arranged and effective compression damping curve which controls otherwise largely uncontrolled spring movements during a bump or ''g out'' action. You can usually tell the pedigree of shocks in cheaper passenger cars if you accelerate briskly across the downramp of the raised pedestrian crossings we so often see in main shopping centres. If the rear end of the car basically blows through its stroke and hits the bump stops the dampers are single acting with no compression control, control happens in rebound only. But having said that much of the import stuff coming in also has very weak rebound control, a nasty cocktail on our high proportion of bumpy roads. That you follow so many of these cars on the open road at speeds 20 or so ks below the limit is often testament to how unstable they are at speed due to poor damping control.

The high quality shocks have very effective compression control giving in turn good ride height control. This also allows softer springing with much much less preload. If arranged with low friction, precise tolerancing and an internal piston design with suitable flow charcteristics the ride quality over even the nastiest bumps will be significantly improved. The springing arrangement in turn allows a lot less aggressive rebound damping force meaning that the suspension will react more readily to hollows in the road surface. That means the tyres will remain more interlocked with the grain of the pavement, enhancing mechanical grip and indeed tyre life.

I real terms cheap shocks are very poor value for money and percentage margins on them are appreciably higher than for high quality high performance shocks.

[Robert Taylor]

My bos Ken Mcintosh sed you were the one to talk to, I am now willing to spend a bit more money, better than having my spine hammed to death.

I need something witch is 14 1/2" eye to eye long

PM me and I will give you some options.

[F5 Dave]

Progressive are finest in Mexican quality I'll have you know. Some years ago I bought a pair for my old GS11 touring bus as opposed to Ikon or Hagon in the hopes that they would be better. Really odd, it felt like they had more compression than rebound. Some wag suggested fitting them upside down.

OK they were better than the dangerous stockers but wore out pretty quickly. Its a hard call, only answered by "Are you going to keep the bike"

I've often thought Harleys with their limited travel & usually well heeled clientèle would be the best target for better suspension sales. Yet walk into scooter centre (not that I have for some while) & all you can see is shiny stuff Emblazoned with Eagles & Slogans on the walls.

[Robert Taylor]

Progressive are finest in Mexican quality I'll have you know. Some years ago I bought a pair for my old GS11 touring bus as opposed to Ikon or Hagon in the hopes that they would be better. Really odd, it felt like they had more compression than rebound. Some wag suggested fitting them upside down.

OK they were better than the dangerous stockers but wore out pretty quickly. Its a hard call, only answered by "Are you going to keep the bike"

I've often thought Harleys with their limited travel & usually well heeled clientèle would be the best target for better suspension sales. Yet walk into scooter centre (not that I have for some while) & all you can see is shiny stuff Emblazoned with Eagles & Slogans on the walls.

1) Many people ( irrespective of brand ) prefer first to fit noisy mufflers, often of an offensive decibal rating. It draws attention, ''hey Im making a noise but in fact the ride quality and handling of my bike is somewhat wanting''

2) Many people just simply do not realise what a very huge and pleasurable improvement the highest quality suspension components and careful, knowledgable set up can make.

3) Many more people have very different interpretations of quality and levels of knowledge.

4) The improvements that can be made to the ride quality of a Harley are very real. Suspension doesnt have to give a ride quality akin to a jackhammer drilling your spine.

5) Usually anything with shiny chrome has had the greater part of the budget spent on looks rather than function. Ill be codemned for speaking the truth.

ETC...................

[AllanB]

Just a thought - I'd give consideration when ordering new rear shocks for any HD twin shocker going a bit longer than stock - goving more travel (HD's have very little), it will jack up the rear a fraction giving it a bit less front end rake and quicken the steering, plus the bonus of a tad more ground clearance.

[Robert Taylor]

Just a thought - I'd give consideration when ordering new rear shocks for any HD twin shocker going a bit longer than stock - goving more travel (HD's have very little), it will jack up the rear a fraction giving it a bit less front end rake and quicken the steering, plus the bonus of a tad more ground clearance.

Yes thats exactly right and it is exactly what we have been doing. Combine that with a set of emulators and linear wind springs in the front and you end up with a Harley that actually absorbs bumps, steers with some precision and handles half decent.

The same also applies to all the Jaspanese metric cruisers, the suspension on past and present offerings is woeful. It IS possible to have suspension that is both ''firmer'' in maintaining chassis stability and ride height control BUT also way more ( and I really do mean way more ) more compliant over abrupt bumps. The current Japanese offerings wobble around like a piece of jelly but also have a jackhammer reaction to abrupt bumps.

That many people put up with this is always a source of amazement to me.

[Pixie]

Yes thats exactly right and it is exactly what we have been doing. Combine that with a set of emulators and linear wind springs in the front and you end up with a Harley that actually absorbs bumps, steers with some precision and handles half decent.

The same also applies to all the Jaspanese metric cruisers, the suspension on past and present offerings is woeful. It IS possible to have suspension that is both ''firmer'' in maintaining chassis stability and ride height control BUT also way more ( and I really do mean way more ) more compliant over abrupt bumps. The current Japanese offerings wobble around like a piece of jelly but also have a jackhammer reaction to abrupt bumps.

That many people put up with this is always a source of amazement to me.

People's idea of perfection often only displays their level of ignorance

[Edbear]

The same also applies to all the Jaspanese metric cruisers, the suspension on past and present offerings is woeful. It IS possible to have suspension that is both ''firmer'' in maintaining chassis stability and ride height control BUT also way more ( and I really do mean way more ) more compliant over abrupt bumps. The current Japanese offerings wobble around like a piece of jelly but also have a jackhammer reaction to abrupt bumps.

That many people put up with this is always a source of amazement to me.

Or mebbe we just can't afford to upgrade yet? Or mebbe we haven't experienced the difference? I went up 2 notches on the rear shock and it's made a world of difference, especially two-up! Have you done a C50T? What would it cost?

People's idea of perfection often only displays their level of ignorance

While I wouldn't put it quite so bluntly, you're right. I thought my old '89 GSX-F600 went like stink and handled really well with great brakes! But then I've not ridden a modern sports bike like a GSX-R1000, so was comparing it to my '73 T500 and '80 XS750 Special...