MotoTT trackday, Friday 16 May

[jrandom]

On a circuit the size of Taupo it is possible to have safe numbers on track...

There's a big difference between 'safe numbers on track' and 'being able to ride as you wish with clear track ahead of you'.

If the groups out on track were any bigger, people would be spending half their on-track time riding around other bikes instead of getting in clear laps. While safety may be able to maintained with larger groups, rider enjoyment would go down markedly.

I second DMNTD's comments; I've done three MotoTT days this year, and at each of them I've been out for at least five sessions. My trip meter generally shows slightly over 160km for the day (which, on Betty, is barely do-able on one tank of gas at track riding pace), and by selecting the correct group, I find myself spending most of my time with nobody holding me up and nobody parked up my arse.

Maybe I'm not the riding god you are, Mort, but I know that by the end of one of those days, I'm well knackered and pretty much ready to park up and collapse.

In terms of safety, smaller group sizes aren't going to stop people giving themselves the learn and falling off of their own accord, but they are going to reduce the chance of multiple-bike incidents, which can get much nastier than just going for a slide off the track on one's arse. I think MotoTT have the right idea with the format they're running.

[jrandom]

The noise restrictions that mean that Taupo has to close at 4:30pm are an arse.

I don't imagine Hampton Downs will be subject to anything similar. Summer evening trackdays, anyone?

[Mort]

I agree with you 100% however I think you'll find that to be able to maintain safe numbers on the track at any one time and achieve 6x20min sessions that the pricing would simply go up.
How much are the trackdays in the UK on average? Also how long are some of these tracks? (genuine questions)
IMO 30ish out there at any one time is just right. Any more and it's an arse...

Average UK group size is around 30ish... (sometimes seems like more) At Donington Park for instance the National circuit is 3.1km and the full Grand Prix circuit is just over 4km. Other circuits are about the same size... So Its comparable to Taupo (3.5km). I never felt any event was over crowded.

No UK track day firm uses 4 groups and they all offer 6 or even 7 sessions starting at 9am prompt with 1 hour for lunch...(not 4 as MotoTT are showing on their web page). I note also that Frosty uses 3 groups.

Running 3 groups of 30+ riders on a full circuit is not unsafe. This is purely a matter of good organisation. Having groups ready to roll when the previous group ends. Swift collection of crashed bikes and riders. Much can be done to reduce crashes (for instance repeated reminders to spend 3 laps warming up tyres). Its not rocket science.... and its not as if it isnt done elsewhere.....

why does MotoTT have to be different ? Where is the benefit of what they are offering ? I can only assume they feel it necessary to accomodate the antics of Supermotards..at the cost of every one else.

[Mort]

The noise restrictions that mean that Taupo has to close at 4:30pm are an arse.

I don't imagine Hampton Downs will be subject to anything similar. Summer evening trackdays, anyone?

I can't wait for Hampton Downs... At Donington they run evening sessions after many day events.... Book for both and you get 9 or 10 sessions... I've done it a few times... Its a top day. The best events are two days together.... on Day 2 you really fly...

[Meekey_Mouse]

Average UK group size is around 30ish... (sometimes seems like more) At Donington Park for instance the is 3.1km and the full is just over 4km. Other circuits are about the same size... So Its comparable to Taupo (3.5km). I never felt any event was over crowded.

No UK track day firm uses 4 groups and they all offer 6 or even 7 sessions starting at 9am prompt with 1 hour for lunch...(not 4 as MotoTT are showing on their web page). I note also that Frosty uses 3 groups.

Running 3 groups of 30+ riders on a full circuit is not unsafe. This is purely a matter of good organisation. Having groups ready to roll when the previous group ends. Swift collection of crashed bikes and riders. Much can be done to reduce crashes (for instance repeated reminders to spend 3 laps warming up tyres). Its not rocket science.... and its not as if it isnt done elsewhere.....

why does MotoTT have to be different ? Where is the benefit of what they are offering ? I can only assume they feel it necessary to accomodate the antics of Supermotards..at the cost of every one else.

I would encourage you to spend a day with Sue, Peter, Chris, Kevin or Trevor (any one helping to run it)

You will very quickly realize how much effort IS being put into these days.

They do try to send groups out ASAP of the last one, they get the collection truck ready to go and waiting at the gate before the last session is finished etc.

Re warming tyres: Go to race days, you will even see that after many years of track riding even good riders will forget about warming their tyres and bin in the first few laps. Sure, telling people helps... But at every motoTT day I've been to they have stressed that point at each briefing... Keep in mind I live 10 mins from the track so I have been to a lot of they're days. Helping, riding and as a spectator.

Why does motoTT have to be different?! If they were the same as every one else then at some point you'd be complaining as to why no one was willing to try anything new
The benefits they are offering is that you can ride in a group of people that will be taking roughly the same lines as you. Motard lines are so much more different to road bikes that it can wreck your track time if you are constantly having people cut your lines. It's also a big safety thing.

Super Motarders pay the same amount as every one else... And they don't have JUST their own class. The quick racing guys also go with them.

[westie]

That doesn't make sense to me at all.... I've seen crashes-a-plenty on their days (just like any other organiser), I've seen them operate without an ambulance and I've seen aggressive and dangerous racing by motard riders tolerated on track sessions... so MotoTT doesn't stand out as being super-safe to me..

However, my point about track time stands and I dont believe it has any impact on safety.

I have been to almost every motott track day since august last year and have not seen it operate without a binner taxi. But any way.

The NEW four groups has seen less crashes and less serious crashes. You may be confused with the past Three group format

[Mort]

Absolutely nothing personal about this - I know those guys work hard at this and they do a good job. My point is about the format of the day....

But getting back to my point.... four sessions in a full day with at least an hour and sometimes two hours around lunch sitting around waiting for the next session makes for a dull boring day. It doesnt temp me to drive 5 hours to attend where as more track time and less sitting on my arse would....

On the subject of motards.... if they do upset peoples lines, racing each other in packs, aggressively cutting up other riders (as has happened to me more than once at Taupo) I'd kick 'em off the event..... I wouldn't be allowed to ride like that on my road bike....what makes them so special that they can cause problems for other riders ???..... and the have whole day structured to accommodate them ?? Motards are fine with me.... I've had some good scraps with them in the UK but I absolutely don't see why they should be allowed to spoil other rider's sessions. One rule for all I say... and if they can't live with respecting other riders they should find their own event.

[westie]

One rule for all I say... and if they can't live with respecting other riders they should find their own event.

Hmmm I could agree with you there

[Shaun]

I have been to almost every motott track day since august last year and have not seen it operate without a binner taxi. But any way.

The NEW four groups has seen less crashes and less serious crashes. You may be confused with the past Three group format

Agreed, MotoTT track days are the best organised days I have ever seen in NZ for track days

[fireball]

sadly i wont be at this track day, going to wellington
but have fun all!

[westie]

Agreed, MotoTT track days are the best organised days I have ever seen in NZ for track days

Are you coming to this motott track day shaun? I would like to catch up with you about setting up my suspension on a 97 fireblade. Its got an ohlins rear and standard front.
Could come down to your shop if it is open?

[stify]

all booked in..now just gota get me bike ready

anyone got a space on a trailer??(heading down from auckland area)

[Shaun]

Are you coming to this motott track day shaun? I would like to catch up with you about setting up my suspension on a 97 fireblade. Its got an ohlins rear and standard front.
Could come down to your shop if it is open?

I will be there mate, just PM me to confirm booking space, I do get rather busy there on those days

[Tony.OK]

Are you coming to this motott track day shaun? I would like to catch up with you about setting up my suspension on a 97 fireblade. Its got an ohlins rear and standard front.
Could come down to your shop if it is open?

Just look for the really HUGE trailor,then listen for lots of swearing coming from within (f**k,d*mn,sh*t,b*stard!!!wheres the keys),if ya hear that then by all means rock on in for a chat

[Meekey_Mouse]

Wrong thread