New Championship, new rules

[ArcherWC]

I would second that.

second from me too

[CHOPPA]

Discussed this today with a couple of suspension experts, and we all ended up agreeing ( God) on running Total STD motors in SB class, with a pipe and power commander only, Apart from the chassis, which would remain as is.

And also to change the SS600 class to the same as above.

Prodi racing as such!

It seems so simple aye! I fully agree, how does a rule change take place?

[slowpoke]

MotoGP was smart enough to do away with 990's and bring it back to 800's, and it has improved it.

Are you watching the same series that I am? Costs have ballooned with the 800's because horsepower is expensive now as manufacturers try to screw every last pony out of the smaller capacity, whereas the 990's almost made more than enough. They also need more sophisticated electronics to control the now peaky as fuck donks. The ol' 990's were also comparartively understressed making that massive hp and lasted twice as long.

Hell Glen williams is competitive in 600ss on his thing.

How much of that is Glen? I reckon he'd be competitive on a GN250

.... but surely a shit load of nicely presented clangers is better than the huge differential of horsepower and money that we currently have in F3 right now.

If horsepower is primary then how come Sam Love embarrasses most F3 bikes on a Pro-Twin? Because he's blardy good! People get caught up with the bike spec's rather than just riding the wheels off what they've got.

[Brian d marge]

This Idea was muted a year ago ( ish ) , except for the transport side of it , which funnily enough I was looking at the price of second-hand trucks on trade me ,,,surprisingly cheap ( read more than I could afford but not so expensive as a club /sponsor couldnt afford ... we are talking Kenworths here ,,not a Mitsi flat deck ! )

What Shaun has said ..has a lot going for it and it Can be made to work ( dont worry about the details such as F2..what size ,,etc ,,,, get the basics right ,,, whats in it for me ....me as a racer, me as a supplier , me as a wife of a racer , with 2 kids wanting an ice cream ...me as a TV producer charged with finding something for the sunday slot at 3 pm

Trouble is racing costs money , either the person pays , or someone elses pay , and both need an ROI either in enjoyment or ion the case of sponsors ,, products/services shifted ( or in my case product tested ) So untill all parties get a reasonable ROI , the grids will remain empty.

Here ( in Japan ) I race a Royal Enfield ..( I know!!) , but I get 5 races in one championship a year , costs all up for the year about one months salary ( which is a lot when you have 2 young children , with school fees etc )

My ROI , is the parts that I develop for this bike , using the computer , have some spin offs...1..... other design work in other areas such as Logo designs . 2 Repair of other bikes , which come in due to exposure on the track . finally a small amount of part sales ...from bits I have developed. (very small ).

So overall , while I still do a part time Job to make ends meet ,,,in the long term the racing pays off (in a small but acceptable way , for me )

Finally , when My wife turns round and says , lets go tot he bike racing ,, A , Hell would have frozen over , or B there was something there that made her want to go ...such as the kids asking to be taken there because it was fun ......

I reckon the Paris /Daker meets all the above ,,,but the wjife doesnt even know it exists .... unlike most of Europe ,,,and almost All of Chilli !


Stephen

[Shaun P]

Discussed this today with a couple of suspension experts, and we all ended up agreeing ( God) on running Total STD motors in SB class, with a pipe and power commander only, Apart from the chassis, which would remain as is.

And also to change the SS600 class to the same as above.

Prodi racing as such!

A rule to limit tyre use and testing at tracks would be the biggest levelling/cost reduction factor imo. Also dyno testing of the bikes would have to be carried out at each track to show up any anomalies for stock machines, suppose wouldnt take long with 8 bikes

[ajturbo]

ok... how do "we" do this?... do we HAVE to go the MNZ way? or make a clean brake and book the tracks our selves?...
set up a race COMPANY for NZ?...

why cannot one man (Shaun?) do this himself?...

IE:the Crusty Demons... they have a show, lets take it to the people...

why cannot one person do this????(set up the Co?) and say. stuff the establishment, this is what I believe NZ racer/viewers want...then just do the homework and get the ball rolling....

i'll wave a flag for food..(and beer)

[ArcherWC]

ok... how do "we" do this?... do we HAVE to go the MNZ way? or make a clean brake and book the tracks our selves?...
set up a race COMPANY for NZ?...

why cannot one man (Shaun?) do this himself?...

IE:the Crusty Demons... they have a show, lets take it to the people...

why cannot one person do this????(set up the Co?) and say. stuff the establishment, this is what I believe NZ racer/viewers want...then just do the homework and get the ball rolling....

i'll wave a flag for food..(and beer)

This was tried a few years ago with the "Dirtbike Federation", I believe they were even running Woodville (one of the biggest events on the calender), however, once they got to a size where they were challenging MNZ, MNZ started to stop the top riders from competing (I think they threatened to take there licenses off them, which would have effected their overseas commitments), and it dosnt matter how good the entertainment is, if you take away the "known" riders, you take away the big crowd draw-cards

[ajturbo]

This was tried a few years ago with the "Dirtbike Federation", I believe they were even running Woodville (one of the biggest events on the calender), however, once they got to a size where they were challenging MNZ, MNZ started to stop the top riders from competing (I think they threatened to take there licenses off them, which would have effected their overseas commitments), and it dosnt matter how good the entertainment is, if you take away the "known" riders, you take away the big crowd draw-cards

bugger....................

[Scoot_6R]

Rather than do away with the premier class, why not just build a series using superstock rules from another country (U.K.)?

Superstock 1000 over here got really expensive as they were all running pretty much superbike spec bikes especially one particular yamaha with traction, launch and wheelie control suppled from motech. He turned up to race meets in a helicopter with his mechanic and then drove away in his ferrari. Not naming any names!!

[scracha]

suppose wouldnt take long with 8 bikes

You don't have to dyno test every machine....just pick 3 at random. This would work in other classes too.

Can someone explain how MNZ can block riders from racing at other events? Surely that's not in their mandate?

Their Mission Statement : Fostering the sport of motorcycling and making it safe, fun and fair

We essentially are MNZ, without us MNZ would not exist. Therefore MNZ don't tell us what to do...it's the other way around.....innit?

[Shaun]

Rather than do away with the premier class, why not just build a series using superstock rules from another country (U.K.)?
There's a brilliant product (motorcycle racing as entertainment) waiting to be marketed correctly. I agree with you that there needs to be a paid promoter, and raise you a promotion company with dedicated publicists, advertising sales reps, and a team of journalists knocking out press releases every 5 minutes. Live radio commentary of each and every race would be a good start, allow TAB to take bets on race outcomes, and delayed TV coverage (even on sky) of every race would work too. If speedway can be run profitably, then what are MNZ fucking about with?

PS, I have no personell problem with the things that MNZ do, they are officually just an admin centre to process licenses and follow up with protests Insurance etc, the rules,and the legal aspects of the sport really.

[Tony.OK]

Why can't we have the two classes combined but with separate championships? Exactly like the ProTwins and F3. Then you have the drawcard of the big teams and a goal for the S/stock rider to aim for rather than just being there with no hope of staying near the big boys.
That way a really talented rider on a S/stock bike may be noticed if he's beating a worked bike..................

[scott411]

This was tried a few years ago with the "Dirtbike Federation", I believe they were even running Woodville (one of the biggest events on the calender), however, once they got to a size where they were challenging MNZ, MNZ started to stop the top riders from competing (I think they threatened to take there licenses off them, which would have effected their overseas commitments), and it dosnt matter how good the entertainment is, if you take away the "known" riders, you take away the big crowd draw-cards

this statement is not very true

the NZ dirtbike federation was started by the Auckland Motocross club (ardmore mx track) after he was declined entry into MNZ on a number of issues, some of them were petty small issues, but one of the major ones being the lack of a true club structure (no voted in commitee), Whakatane now runs under similar rules to the Dirtbike federation but does not name them in their summercross advertising so i am unsure if they are members or not, woodville has not been ever run under NZDBF,

one previous MNZ CEO (Trevor) did make some noises about trying to penalise riders for racing outside MNZ, however he was quickly reminded that it is against NZ law to do so, it comes under restraint of trade laws, and has been proved in law against the old NZACU's speedway control board back in the late 80's (this was when all speedway came under MNZ (incl Cars))

As for the person that asked how to change the rules, contact the Road Race Comissioner, (i would wait till after the nationals to get a reply) and thier is normally a road race workshop held on the saturday of the conference in May, Paul Pac the CEO of MNZ has stated he wants to lesson the mods available to the SUperbike and Sports production rules, in any email to the road race comissioner i would link these conversations,

good conversation in here to guys,

[Bren_chch]

Why can't we have the two classes combined but with separate championships? Exactly like the ProTwins and F3. Then you have the drawcard of the big teams and a goal for the S/stock rider to aim for rather than just being there with no hope of staying near the big boys.
That way a really talented rider on a S/stock bike may be noticed if he's beating a worked bike..................

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/sh...t=79825&page=4

[ArcherWC]

this statement is not very true

the NZ dirtbike federation was started by the Auckland Motocross club (ardmore mx track) after he was declined entry into MNZ on a number of issues, some of them were petty small issues, but one of the major ones being the lack of a true club structure (no voted in commitee), Whakatane now runs under similar rules to the Dirtbike federation but does not name them in their summercross advertising so i am unsure if they are members or not, woodville has not been ever run under NZDBF,

one previous MNZ CEO (Trevor) did make some noises about trying to penalise riders for racing outside MNZ, however he was quickly reminded that it is against NZ law to do so, it comes under restraint of trade laws, and has been proved in law against the old NZACU's speedway control board back in the late 80's (this was when all speedway came under MNZ (incl Cars))

As for the person that asked how to change the rules, contact the Road Race Comissioner, (i would wait till after the nationals to get a reply) and thier is normally a road race workshop held on the saturday of the conference in May, Paul Pac the CEO of MNZ has stated he wants to lesson the mods available to the SUperbike and Sports production rules, in any email to the road race comissioner i would link these conversations,

good conversation in here to guys,

Cheers for clearing that up Scott, its amazing the sort of rumors and half truths that circulate the pits :-)