Round 5 of NZ Superbikes may be canned?

[Howie]

And there lies 1 of the biggest contributing factors too the National series being in the state it is,Too many options!Back through the 70s/80s and early nineties there were only F1,F2,Bears,Senior production,600 production,250 production, 125gp and sidecars that had a national championship and they all ran at the same championship rounds.Now theres Classic senior and junior,Pre 72 post classic senior and Junior,Pre 82 post classic senior and junior,Pre 89 post classic senior,Junior,classic sidecars,Post classic sidecars,Superbike,600 sports production,F3,Protwins,125gp,Bears and sidecars.Thats 10 more championship classes now than there was back then and only 6 of those classes run at our National rounds.Imagine if some of those other classes were brought in.How many riders would there be at the Nationals then ???Without doing any research Id be confident too wager there are atleast the same amount of people if not more roadracing in NZ now than there were then.

Ok , I looked up a couple of old Two wheeler programs(4th round of nationals run by the vic club) that have somehow survived a few moves over the years, and back in feb 86 they ran 10 different classes, with 7 classes being National Championship ones, those being :
Sidecars
125cc racing
Formula 1
250cc Production
Formula 2
Senior Production
Junior Production

A total of 31 races over the two days

The other classes they ran were:
Classics ( one race Sat only)
Bears
B Grade (clubmans) (sat only)

The 1988 was the same format of classes with the addition of formula three,and the dropping of 125cc racing, from the championship classes. B grade(clubmans was not run at this meeting) A teams race event was also run giving a total of 28 races.

Attached is a scan of the race schedule from the programs, the one on the left is the 1986 one.

[wharfy]

I notice the program mentions "prize money". I was talking to Ginger Molloy at the Road Race Spectacular and he said that in his day* every meeting paid prize money.

* His day isn't over actually he dorked everyone at Pearoa in the classics.

[Str8 Jacket]

I VMCC have done Streetstocks before. This time they tried something different. Granted, it didn't work. Streetstocks aren't the best adverts at National meets. Damn right about full classes and helping those starting racing. That's why they should be treated the same as Clubmans. (Not disdain or anything like that - just as a novice class. Not really National level stuff.) I have no idea on a substitute for Nationals though...

Yep and then there is another way of looking at it.

You want numbers, you guy's are complaining you dont get them. Get the "newbie" racers hooked on the Nationals from the beginning. Scrap the support class and allow maybe even half the laps for that boring Street stock race, get them hooked and as they move up the classes they will most likely be aiming for the Nationals every year in their respective classes.

OR

Keep complaining about the lack of numbers and dismiss Streetstock cause its boring and dont get the supprt.

I know for a fact just about all Vic Club streetstock racers would have entered the Manfeild round and I know of 5 riders from the South Island that wanted to compete at Manfeild but had no class.....

[cowpoos]

why the hell isn't streetstock a national class???

Because if you got nationals lenght races....you would probally take half of sunday to complete them!!!....nah just joking...

Probally because its not that interesting to the specators...unfortunatly

[Billy]

Ok , I looked up a couple of old Two wheeler programs(4th round of nationals run by the vic club) that have somehow survived a few moves over the years, and back in feb 86 they ran 10 different classes, with 7 classes being National Championship ones, those being :
Sidecars
125cc racing
Formula 1
250cc Production
Formula 2
Senior Production
Junior Production

A total of 31 races over the two days

The other classes they ran were:
Classics ( one race Sat only)
Bears
B Grade (clubmans) (sat only)

The 1988 was the same format of classes with the addition of formula three,and the dropping of 125cc racing, from the championship classes. B grade(clubmans was not run at this meeting) A teams race event was also run giving a total of 28 races.

Attached is a scan of the race schedule from the programs, the one on the left is the 1986 one.

Yip,I know.I was there entered in Junior Production.Im thinking you didnt read the post properly.The point was that the riders are now spread over 18 championships instead of 7 and that a lot of those championships dont take any part of the national series and that is a contributing factor to the smaller numbers.

The only reason I have been given for streetstock not being given National championship status is that there are no new models available.Suzuki NZ were keen as too run a seies about 5 yrs ago when I approached them,In fact there was talk of them paying someone too do so,But they couldnt get any stock as the Asian market was taking all the bikes they could produce.Has anybody approached MNZ lately ???

[Goblin]

Couple of questions.... was there prize money up for grabs at previous National rounds? Was the prize money forefeited on the promise of TV coverage? And was there any TV coverage ever aired?

[Skunk]

Yep and then there is another way of looking at it.
You want numbers, you guy's are complaining you dont get them. Get the "newbie" racers hooked on the Nationals from the beginning. Scrap the support class and allow maybe even half the laps for that boring Street stock race, get them hooked and as they move up the classes they will most likely be aiming for the Nationals every year in their respective classes.
OR
Keep complaining about the lack of numbers and dismiss Streetstock cause its boring and dont get the supprt.

As I said before, I don't think you can do a Nationals meeting without having done three Club races.
Also I don't have anything against Streetstock; quite the opposite. But the state of some of the bikes leaves something to be desired... The racing can be very good. It's just that this year VMCC did something that a lot of racers had asked for. Guess they shouldn't do what racers ask for huh?

Probally because its not that interesting to the specators...unfortunatly

I think it's good racing. What made Nationals good this year was the racing instead of the circulating.

The only reason I have been given for streetstock not being given National championship status is that there are no new models available. Suzuki NZ were keen as too run a seies about 5 yrs ago when I approached them, in fact there was talk of them paying someone too do so, but they couldnt get any stock as the Asian market was taking all the bikes they could produce.

I think that is now a permanent problem.
What do we do to advance Streetstock should be the question. VMCC have tried 250cc four strokes.

[Str8 Jacket]

As I said before, I don't think you can do a Nationals meeting without having done three Club races.

I have done way more than 3 club races. Like I said we (Malcolm and I) could have easily entered down south. Funny that they dont seem to get "up in arms" as much as the Nth Islanders re numbers... Like I said earlier, we will support the South Island National meeting next year...

Guess they shouldn't do what racers ask for huh?

Maybe this is the problem...

[roogazza]

I notice the program mentions "prize money". I was talking to Ginger Molloy at the Road Race Spectacular and he said that in his day* every meeting paid prize money.

* His day isn't over actually he dorked everyone at Pearoa in the classics.

Now that brought a knowing smile . G.

[Kevin G]

I am amazed, the NZRRC heads to NZ's biggest and so we are told best city in NZ with the most people and the most money (bla bla)and you can't get enough entries! un-bloody-believable.

Way down here in the murky, cold, wet and as we are told "backward" south we had three absolutley dynamite rounds of racing with (as has been mentioned) massive fields of streetstock and also lots of recent street stock graduates feeding into 125, F3, Pro Twin and other classes.
This has all been generated by the clubs and individuals down here getting off their arses and actually getting involved in putting bums on seats in the development/learning class of streetstock.

I have heard the moans and groans about "would sooner watch paint dry than see 150's at Puke" this attitude is part of the problem. As competitors and as organisers we need to stop and think about how do we get newbies into this sport and it has to come with a development class with committed mentors/trainers that give a dam and are passionate about this cause not just open the gates and let the kids ride around. This has happened in the south and look at the results:
The following list is not intended to be complete but it is the names of riders in this years nationals (full and part) that have come thru or been involved with South Island club based road race training/streetstock
Cameron Jones, Alastair Hoogenboezem, Avalon Biddle, Tim McArthur, Eric Oliver Maxwell, Nick Cain, Gregor Stevens, Gordon Hastings, Colin Hastings, Tom Boss, Wade Vanderarden, Patrick Jones, Vic Tinning, Will Montgomery, James Hoogenboezem....I am sure I have missed some. This is pretty bloody amazing all from the work of a very small number of very passionate people with committed clubs behind them who have purchased bikes, gear and offer subsidised training opportunites.

Yes recent times are hard but this is when the fruits of years of work are seen.

For anyone that was at last years MNZ conference the road race workshop agreed that most important thing for the sport of road racing going forward was youth development programs and mentoring etc...What has been happening up north with the clubs? Can anyone give us slow backward types down here an update? With the exception of the good work Steve and crew are doing with Moto Academy I am unaware of any club based programs.

Sorry some of you find streetstock boring to watch, personally I find in bloody great, the size of the smiles at the end says it all. I would also add it is bloody rewarding putting something back into the sport that has given me so much enjoyment over the years.

Kevin Goddard
Otago.

[Str8 Jacket]

Sorry some of you find streetstock boring to watch, personally I find in bloody great, the size of the smiles at the end says it all. I would also add it is bloody rewarding putting something back into the sport that has given me so much enjoyment over the years.

Kevin Goddard
Otago.

I love you Kevin

I know I have not quoted all your post but this is exactly what I was trying to say earlier. You have to get people hooked early and alot of awesome riders come from street stock. I agree with everything you say and we will see you next year!

[Billy]

Bloody well said Kevin,The biggest problem we face with the Actrix series and streetstock is getting suitable tracktime,The constraints at Manfeild and Taupo regarding time are quite severe,I have been trying too work through this problem with a Vic club exec member.I have also spoken with Brian Bernard,Jay Lawrence and I know a number of other experienced riders are keen too help with rider training,However it always comes back too tracktime.I think we may have something sorted for this years series but as yet havent heard back.Last year I offered a free ride for the last round of the Actrix series and ended up having too contact someone too ride it as there were NO takers (good on you Maduckfor getting out there).I have also offered 1 on 1 rider training on this site and still no takers and have also purchased another 150 so I can do the Actrix series as an observer only in this class.But theres only so much 1 person can do and Im not sure theres much more I can do without some serious input from a club

[Mystic13]

Someone mentioned that this was what was needed for the whole thing to be successful;


1)spectators
2)riders
3)organisers
4)promotion
5)sponsors

It seems to me you need;

- good communication between the bunch.
- a clear plan and outcome.
- someone to tap the resources available.

As a spectator I'm wanting to get value for money and to enjoy myself. I'm looking for a good day out and having a family I'm looking for a good family day out.

Communication with spectators is pretty poor.

I'm wondering if you either need to get a group of people together who represent the parties and have a good go at communicating with everyone and finding out what they all want, then setting about creating that. Someone will have to take a punt on the investment needed.

Let's face it getting a few more bikes won't draw more spectators if they don't get an entertaining day out, if the facilities and food are crap and you don't communicate with them.

Alternatively you need a promoter to take things over. Making decisions by committee and managing volunteers is apparently always challenging.

Paeroa was a great day out and I bumped into a friend who rides but drove down. He didn't have anywhere to store his gear so thought "take the car". Apparently he couldn't find anything on gear storage on the bots site.

I agree blaming people for things not working isn't useful so the opposite seems to get together and figure out what you do want. Then plan for it.

If you look at this whole thing as a business you'd have to say it's well and truly broken.

And a last comment. Sloan, my son loves the motorcycle poster he picked up at Paeroa. That one poster was a highlight for him and he's now got that plastered on his wall with "LG" all over it. Paeroa ticked a lot of boxes for us as spectators.

So what would the whole package look like if you picked your best outcome.

[Skunk]

I have done way more than 3 club races. Like I said we (Malcolm and I) could have easily entered down south. Funny that they dont seem to get "up in arms" as much as the Nth Islanders re numbers... Like I said earlier, we will support the South Island National meeting next year.

I wasn't talking about you specifically. I know your crash, opps, I mean race experience Some of the Streetstock and Clubmans riders have not done three club rounds. This would reduce numbers - but not much though. I feel some riders are riding a class above what they can afford to run if they're going to do Nationals. Others see Nationals as needing to enter all rounds or it's not worth bothering.

I don't have any problem with any class - just the people who say one thing and then do another. Then blame someone else for why they didn't do it. It helps no one.

[Str8 Jacket]

I wasn't talking about you specifically. I know your crash, opps, I mean race experience Some of the Streetstock and Clubmans riders have not done three club rounds. This would reduce numbers - but not much though. I feel some riders are riding a class above what they can afford to run if they're going to do Nationals. Others see Nationals as needing to enter all rounds or it's not worth bothering.

I don't have any problem with any class - just the people who say one thing and then do another. Then blame someone else for why they didn't do it. It helps no one.

Dont get personal. I had one crash on a race track, one, once. What you are saying doesnt make sense at all - What about the size of the fields down south, they would have had to have done more than 3 races too, hmm?
Again I bring you back to - "why is no one entering our race".... Cause we didnt have a bloody class but we would have entered and as I said there is alot of us. You probably would have had another 20 (at least entries)...

What's not happening is people are not listening. People are saying, yes we do the club rounds cause the size of the classes are great etc etc but when it comes to Nationals most people (who are sponsorless) have to make a decision. Street racing or Nationals.
I get it, people arent made of $$.