PT racers or thinking about racing PT

**FROSTY:Me** · 26th March 2009, 20:44

Originally Posted by Deano

How would a Cagiva Raptor go ? Honest question - I know F.A about them.

SHHHHH---they are a nice bit of kit out of the factory.--a bit fragile in certain areas and the seat height is waay down

**FROSTY:Me** · 26th March 2009, 20:49

Originally Posted by svr

75 is a big number! If any pt out there was making 75 it should be pulled down fer sure. It wouldn't like pump gas for a start.
70 sounds about right for a good one.

sorry mate but 72-73 out of the box -run in for a SV
The reason for 75 is to allow a reasonable variation to suit height above sea dyno variation etc.

**GSVR** · 27th March 2009, 07:20

Originally Posted by johnsv650

we were going to put the ttx in the mz but it didnt fit, okay then a 400 ducati bit it still didnt fit, i guessed it would be worth 5 seconds a lap and be worth about 3 mz's

Originally Posted by Robert Taylor

John I forgot you need 2 for the MZ so that equates to 10 seconds per lap!!

So that would equate to 6 MZs then! Hell you could forget the shocks and start your own Production class. But then everyone in it would be going 10 secs a lap too slow.

**codgyoleracer** · 27th March 2009, 07:24

[QUOTE=Tony.OK
Every class from SS150 or buckets up will have people that find it expensive, it really comes down to which class you'd like to be in rather than which class you can afford.[/QUOTE]

Theres some good advice in their for you young guys:

1) Commit to a budget figure that you are willing to spend or arraange with sponsors.
2) Ride in a class that allows you to spend the allocated budget most effectivley & most likely to get you good results.

If you dont have the budget but want to run in a class that requires more money/time then expect to do maybe as not as well as some of the guys that do have the budget organised. (unless you have talent for Africa of course -which can counterbalance lack of funds)

There is a class structure or "pecking order" in New Zealand , - at the top of the list is Superbike & somehwere in the middle is PT. I can definatly relate to wanting to be a part of the next class up the ladder - but to be part of it the fact is that 9 times out of 10 you need to spend the money to build a potential class winning bike no matter which one you are in.

Maybe the problem with this thread is that some are seeing the PT class being so close in build costs as the F3 class ?, - I can assure you that if someone went out there & built an F3 bike to the ultimate limit of the rules it would cost an arm and a leg (& probably a left testicle as well)

So this codgyole bugger says "do the budget first - then choose the class that suits" If you choose to build bike for a class that is less specificed than a competitor might for the same class - then expect to be relying on having more talent to get around the track quicker than the other fella.

Hope that makes sense ?????
Glen

**Robert Taylor** · 27th March 2009, 07:57

Originally Posted by codgyoleracer

Theres some good advice in their for you young guys:

1) Commit to a budget figure that you are willing to spend or arraange with sponsors.
2) Ride in a class that allows you to spend the allocated budget most effectivley & most likely to get you good results.

If you dont have the budget but want to run in a class that requires more money/time then expect to do maybe as not as well as some of the guys that do have the budget organised. (unless you have talent for Africa of course -which can counterbalance lack of funds)

There is a class structure or "pecking order" in New Zealand , - at the top of the list is Superbike & somehwere in the middle is PT. I can definatly relate to wanting to be a part of the next class up the ladder - but to be part of it the fact is that 9 times out of 10 you need to spend the money to build a potential class winning bike no matter which one you are in.

Maybe the problem with this thread is that some are seeing the PT class being so close in build costs as the F3 class ?, - I can assure you that if someone went out there & built an F3 bike to the ultimate limit of the rules it would cost an arm and a leg (& probably a left testicle as well)

So this codgyole bugger says "do the budget first - then choose the class that suits" If you choose to build bike for a class that is less specificed than a competitor might for the same class - then expect to be relying on having more talent to get around the track quicker than the other fella.

Hope that makes sense ?????
Glen

Glen, that makes a whole load of sense and in fact states the obvious.

**svr** · 27th March 2009, 08:14

Originally Posted by FROSTY

sorry mate but 72-73 out of the box -run in for a SV

Whatever. Someones dyno needs fixing.

**GSVR** · 27th March 2009, 09:29

Originally Posted by codgyoleracer

Maybe the problem with this thread is that some are seeing the PT class being so close in build costs as the F3 class

I would say build costs are about the same or even cheaper for F3. It only gets expensive in F3 if you want to run at the pointy end at National level or completely dominate at club level.

F3 at club level you can buy an old bike for as little as 2G and race. Whats the cheapest SV racebike sell for. I know I sold my old one 6.5G with spares. 10G for something reasonable but I doubt you'd get spare rims and wets with it.

Would be interesting to see what Sam wants for his bike.

**GSVR** · 27th March 2009, 09:35

Originally Posted by svr

Whatever. Someones dyno needs fixing.

The dyno test only needs to be comparative. It would be very easy to spot if one bike is making excessive power.

I'm sure Robert Taylor used to have a dyno and even ran an add in Motorcycle Marketplace years ago showing the difference between a modded 250 Proddy bike and a stock one! Right Robert?

**slowpoke** · 27th March 2009, 10:17

Originally Posted by codgyoleracer

Theres some good advice in their for you young guys:

1) Commit to a budget figure that you are willing to spend or arraange with sponsors.
2) Ride in a class that allows you to spend the allocated budget most effectivley & most likely to get you good results.

If you dont have the budget but want to run in a class that requires more money/time then expect to do maybe as not as well as some of the guys that do have the budget organised. (unless you have talent for Africa of course -which can counterbalance lack of funds)

There is a class structure or "pecking order" in New Zealand , - at the top of the list is Superbike & somehwere in the middle is PT. I can definatly relate to wanting to be a part of the next class up the ladder - but to be part of it the fact is that 9 times out of 10 you need to spend the money to build a potential class winning bike no matter which one you are in.

Maybe the problem with this thread is that some are seeing the PT class being so close in build costs as the F3 class ?, - I can assure you that if someone went out there & built an F3 bike to the ultimate limit of the rules it would cost an arm and a leg (& probably a left testicle as well)

So this codgyole bugger says "do the budget first - then choose the class that suits" If you choose to build bike for a class that is less specificed than a competitor might for the same class - then expect to be relying on having more talent to get around the track quicker than the other fella.

Hope that makes sense ?????
Glen

Makes perfect sense mate.

Just like buying a house you have to be honest with yourself and buy/build something which suits your budget. Why alter the rules of a certain class to suit a certain budget when classes already exist to suit virtually any budget?

**svr** · 27th March 2009, 11:18

Originally Posted by slowpoke

Makes perfect sense mate.

Just like buying a house you have to be honest with yourself and buy/build something which suits your budget. Why alter the rules of a certain class to suit a certain budget when classes already exist to suit virtually any budget?

Except....
Motorcycle racing aint house buying. It's not based on reason, need, budget, risk assessment, cold utilitarian calculations of any type really (if it were, no one would even take part).
It's far closer to an obsession or addiction from a behavioural or psychological viewpoint, particularly for young racers.
If the average 18-20yr old apprentice can't `afford' rent and car payment - how the hell can he rationally `budget' as suggested above for a competitive bike, new tyres, decent van, `unforceeables', etc., etc.
Basically it requires bankrolling from a signicant other, or huge (=long term) debt for one seasons racing at the pointy end.

**wharfy** · 27th March 2009, 12:24

Originally Posted by svr

Except....
Motorcycle racing aint house buying. It's not based on reason, need, budget, risk assessment, cold utilitarian calculations of any type really (if it were, no one would even take part).
It's far closer to an obsession or addiction from a behavioural or psychological viewpoint, particularly for young racers.
If the average 18-20yr old apprentice can't `afford' rent and car payment - how the hell can he rationally `budget' as suggested above for a competitive bike, new tyres, decent van, `unforceeables', etc., etc.
Basically it requires bankrolling from a signicant other, or huge (=long term) debt for one seasons racing at the pointy end.

I agree motorcycle racing is not about what is sensible

But an apprentice can budget and go racing, they might have to start in streetstock but that's what streetstock is for. He or she will have to give up or greatly reduce some of their other past times (drink,drugs,street bikes, girls/boys) That is what budgeting is "living within your means"

Visit link below to see how it is done.

http://www.skachillracing.co.nz/about.php

Of course I DON'T do that, one of the few advantages of being an old bugger !!!

**Shaun** · 27th March 2009, 12:41

As with any thing in life, where this is a will, there IS a way

Bleating on the internet will never fix a thing

**Dom** · 27th March 2009, 13:03

Originally Posted by Robert Taylor

I saw Dom racing an MZ250 at Sound of Thunder. I think it was so slow it wasnt able to pitch the forks forward under hard braking, solves that issue. He had fun, racing another MZ250. We had fun watching, it was a similiar pace to cricket.
I think youd maybe be able to forego the safety gear and just wear a bicycle helmet and sunnies. Wear lycra for slipstreaming through the two stroke mist. Bug spatter that can ruin fork seals would no longer be a problem because the closing speed wouldnt exceed maybe 2km/h and if a squadron of bugs landed on the bike they may be able to assist in a little extra forward propulsion.
Clever guys those Czechs. Ive built a TTX36 for a Hyosung, how about one for your MZ Dom?

Yeah, sounds like a good idea. Just put two TTX shocks in the post, I'll send ya the address. Even, better why don't you throw in some of those Ohlins gas forks too.

Might be a little impratical, would be like having suspension worth 9 million on a NZ superbike but I'm up for it with the full support of CKT. I could be your development rider for MZ ohlins suspension, I'm sure there is a huge untouched market out there waiting.

**Ivan** · 27th March 2009, 15:57

right I vouch for Roberts post earlier about helping with other brands regardless.

Dennis set my brothers 125 up for him running Showa Suspension and didnt say put Ohlins in etc he just helped my brother as best he could.

Right Racing is expensive deal with it if your commited youl find a way