The 800s are faster!

[Toast]

Wooohooo, go Colin! I'm a big Rossi fan, but I'd love to see the Texan do well this year.

Does anyone know if the 800's have a weight advantage over the 990's?

[vifferman]

Honda also firmly believed they had the most powerful and usable engine. 990/5 = 198. 198 x 4 = 792. Honda assumed that all they would have to do is lop the 5th cylinder off and they'd have the winning engine.

That's kind of a weird synopsis.

Honda have been making V4s for years, so they know a thing or two about them. Back in the 80s their VF750 was cleaning up in the US in sportbike racing. And what about the RC45?

Their RC211V was essentially a V4 with an extra cylinder tacked on: it has two pairs of cylinders each sharing a crankpin (as in the VFR750 and VFR800), and then the fifth cylinder is slotted in on its own crankpin.
And to start with, Honda did have the most powerful bike. Because they were well prepared for the change to 990cc (I think they instigated it?) the other teams were playing catch-up, and it was at least a season before they had the same sort of power as Honda. They were undoubtedly behind the change to 800cc as well, having been developing several possible engines long before the change was announced.

[denill]

Does anyone know if the 800's have a weight advantage over the 990's?

This wot you want Toast?

MotoGP Class Specs

Minimum Weight

# of Cylinders / 2004 Min / 2007 Min / Difference
2 Cylinder / 135 kg / 137 kg / 2 kg
3 Cylinder / 135 kg / 140.5 kg / 5.5 kg
4 Cylinder / 145 kg / 148 kg / 3 kg
5 Cylinder /145 kg / 155.5 kg / 10.5 kg
6 Cylinder / 155 kg / 163 kg / 8 kg

In 2005, fuel tank capacity was reduced by 2 litres to 24 litres
In 2006, fuel tank capacity was reduced by a further 2 litres to 22 litres
From 2007 onwards and for a minimum period of five years, FIM has regulated in MotoGP class that two-stroke bikes will no longer be allowed, and engines will be limited to 800 cc four-strokes. The maximum fuel capacity will be 21 litres.

[denill]

This wot you want Toast?

MotoGP Class Specs

Minimum Weight

# of Cylinders / 2004 Min / 2007 Min / Difference
2 Cylinder / 135 kg / 137 kg / 2 kg
3 Cylinder / 135 kg / 140.5 kg / 5.5 kg
4 Cylinder / 145 kg / 148 kg / 3 kg
5 Cylinder /145 kg / 155.5 kg / 10.5 kg
6 Cylinder / 155 kg / 163 kg / 8 kg

In 2005, fuel tank capacity was reduced by 2 litres to 24 litres
In 2006, fuel tank capacity was reduced by a further 2 litres to 22 litres
From 2007 onwards and for a minimum period of five years, FIM has regulated in MotoGP class that two-stroke bikes will no longer be allowed, and engines will be limited to 800 cc four-strokes. The maximum fuel capacity will be 21 litres.

So apart from being smaller capacity than the previous class they are also heavier - but faster??

[Toast]

So apart from being smaller capacity than the previous class they are also heavier - but faster??

Wow, very interesting...maybe the manufacturers will start bragging about their streetbikes being heavier and less powerful than the previous year now?

[denill]

This wot you want Toast?

MotoGP Class Specs

Minimum Weight

# of Cylinders / 2004 Min / 2007 Min / Difference
2 Cylinder / 135 kg / 137 kg / 2 kg
3 Cylinder / 135 kg / 140.5 kg / 5.5 kg
4 Cylinder / 145 kg / 148 kg / 3 kg
5 Cylinder /145 kg / 155.5 kg / 10.5 kg
6 Cylinder / 155 kg / 163 kg / 8 kg

In 2005, fuel tank capacity was reduced by 2 litres to 24 litres
In 2006, fuel tank capacity was reduced by a further 2 litres to 22 litres
From 2007 onwards and for a minimum period of five years, FIM has regulated in MotoGP class that two-stroke bikes will no longer be allowed, and engines will be limited to 800 cc four-strokes. The maximum fuel capacity will be 21 litres.

Readers may be interested in the - Source Of Information:

Lota info there.

[denill]

MotoGP Official Test: Qatar

Day Two Official Times

1. Colin Edwards – Yamaha Factory – 1’56.296

2. Valentino Rossi – Yamaha Factory – 1’56.537

3. Dani Pedrosa – Repsol Honda – 1’56.712

4. Carlos Checa – LCR Honda – 1’56. 874

5. Casey Stoner – Ducati Marlboro - 1’57.040

6. John Hopkins – Rizla Suzuki – 1’57.065

7. Shinya Nakano – Konica Minolta Honda – 1’57.274

8. Randy de Puniet – Kawasaki Racing – 1’57.288

9. Kenny Roberts Jr – Team Roberts – 1’57.504

10. Marco Melandri – Gresini Honda – 1’57.591

11. Nicky Hayden – Repsol Honda – 1’57.629

12. Loris Capirossi – Ducati Marlboro - 1’57.698

13. Chris Vermeulen – Rizla Suzuki - 1’57.770

14. Alex Hofmann – Pramac d’Antin Ducati - 1’57.999

15. Alex Barros – Pramac d’Antin Ducati - 1’58.513

16. Makoto Tamada – Yamaha Tech 3 - 1’58.610

17. Toni Elias – Gresini Honda – 1’58.990

18. Sylvain Guintoli – Yamaha Tech 3 – 1’59.138

19. Shinichi Ito – Ducati TTT – 1’59.617

20. Andrew Pitt – Ilmor GP – 2’02.453

[Maido]

So apart from being smaller capacity than the previous class they are also heavier - but faster??

Quicker NOT faster, there is a difference,

also, i don't know if many noticed that Nakano is slowly getting faster...... (I will probably eat those words later on in the season??)

[denill]

i don't know if many noticed that Nakano is slowly getting faster......

Or quicker??

[denill]

So apart from being smaller capacity than the previous class they are also heavier - but faster??

Quicker NOT faster, there is a difference,

'Quicker' than, 'Faster' than. A 'Quicker' lap or a 'Faster' lap - buggered if I know?

Is there even a pedantic difference?

And if there is - who cares.

I reckon Rossi will be toooo 'Fast' (or toooo 'Quick') for the rest anyhow.

[denill]

So apart from being smaller capacity than the previous class they are also heavier - but faster??

Quicker NOT faster, there is a difference,

'Quicker' than, 'Faster' than. A 'Quicker' lap or a 'Faster' lap - buggered if I know?

Is there even a pedantic difference?

And if there is - who cares

I reckon Rossi will be toooo 'Fast' (or toooo 'Quick') for the rest

[steved]

I think they were saying something like;

Faster = straight-line.

Quick = lap time.

Could be wrong.

[gav]

OK, couple of things, the weight limits have not changed from the 990cc 2006 bikes and the new 800cc 2007 limits. Contrary to popular opinion Honda do not write the rules for MotoGP, thay have a say as a major manufacturer but do not have an over riding vote etc.
Most paddock opinion suggests that the Ducati since its appereance in MotoGP has had the most powerful engine, again not Honda. Whats your info source, TonyB?
The main instigator for the change was a backlash after Dajiro Kato's death, suggesting the bikes were getting too powerful. Interestingly since then the electrical and engine management systems have managed to get the bikes way more easier to ride with the ability to limit power in cornesr and under hard acceleration as neccesary. When was the last time you saw a wicked high side? Most accidents now are a lose on the front end on corner entry.
I reckon though that if a 800 was racing against the 990, the 990 is more likely to win, even if the 800 has a quicker lap time. I'm picking the 990 would still be faster in a straight line and would hold the 800 up in the corners, any advantage that the 800 may hold in higher cornering speed would be negated by the 990 being in its way.

Oh, 800cc bikes rock.....

[Mental Trousers]

Rules are often changed in racing for various reasons. When the rules governing a class change the winner will be the one that can adapt and develop their bike the quickest. That sort of thing takes money. At MotoGP level, we're talking fuck loads on money. Honda has the biggest R&D budget of the lot so they have an advantage straight off.

It'd be interesting to see if a 2007 990cc could match the 800cc bikes. The main problem with a larger engine is the spinning mass - there's just so much more. That spinning mass fights what the rider wants the bike to do etc. Not only that but the 990cc engines were able to produce more power than the riders could use. With the 800cc bikes the rider can use more throttle more of the time and turn into corners quicker even though they weigh the same as a 990cc.

gav is right though, a 990 racing an 800 would most likely win because the 800's higher cornering speed advantage is negated if it's stuck behind the 990.

[Superweetard]

IMO .Marco will be up there,he may not get the title,but you just watch the little wog go.Other than that Rossi will come out fighting from the get go.