My first poll for the NZ public [Archive] - Page 6

mashman

29th May 2015, 19:07

So if the program decides we need more gardeners, they get valued at more? so have more to spend. What are the people who choose not to work valued at?

If the program says we need more gardeners, we search for someone to do gardening, then the program alters the value in whichever direction it needs to to hit its target. The people will be valued at whatever the program has been configured to value them at. I expect that a current financial system value record will also be held, if only for "fair" rollback purposes.

bogan

29th May 2015, 19:14

If the program says we need more gardeners, we search for someone to do gardening, then the program alters the value in whichever direction it needs to to hit its target. The people will be valued at whatever the program has been configured to value them at. I expect that a current financial system value record will also be held, if only for "fair" rollback purposes.

You do realise what you've described are the basic concepts behind our current system right?

Jobs (services) valued by supply and demand.
Spending capped by job value (earnings).
Resources/products valued by supply demand.

mashman

29th May 2015, 19:19

You do realise what you've described are the basic concepts behind our current system right?

Jobs (services) valued by supply and demand.
Spending capped by job value (earnings).
Resources/products valued by supply demand.

I've known that all along, and have mentioned it on a few occasions. Perhaps we can share that understanding NOW :killingme. It fits almost perfectly because it avoids financial shock.

bogan

29th May 2015, 19:22

I've known that all along, and have mentioned it on a few occasions. Perhaps we can share that understanding NOW :killingme. It fits almost perfectly because it avoids financial shock.

Better than that, it fits so well it can be 100% opt in, in fact that is a better option than forcing change through by majority vote. I still have issues with it so I won't be, but when are you going to opt in to it? or start one up so others can?

Brian d marge

29th May 2015, 19:23

Banks because it's far less work in the long run to earn money before you spend it. (Told you I wasn't a capitalist).

And artificial markets because by definition the provider and the client aren't free to agree the price without outside interference, the antithesis of a free market. Outside of charity I try to avoid paying for more than I receive.

We will be holding hands singing "hey non e nonny " if you keep this up

mashman

29th May 2015, 19:43

Better than that, it fits so well it can be 100% opt in, in fact that is a better option than forcing change through by majority vote. I still have issues with it so I won't be, but when are you going to opt in to it? or start one up so others can?

What's wrong with using a majority like you do? Ya know, that democracy thing? :killingme, that way there's no force and people get to make there own minds up as to how they would like to live in the future for a change... instead of questionable representatives. That, and not everyone would be able to afford to live in such a way.

bogan

29th May 2015, 19:49

What's wrong with using a majority like you do? Ya know, that democracy thing? :killingme, that way there's no force and people get to make there own minds up as to how they would like to live in the future for a change... instead of questionable representatives. That, and not everyone would be able to afford to live in such a way.

You mean besides obtaining one? Nothing I guess, there is still force with a majority though... Of course if you want to minimise force, you wouldn't change even if you did have a majority. All you need is people to agree to join. Re-evaluate your idea of the society's border, there is no reason it needs to be national.

mashman

29th May 2015, 20:38

You mean besides obtaining one? Nothing I guess, there is still force with a majority though... Of course if you want to minimise force, you wouldn't change even if you did have a majority. All you need is people to agree to join. Re-evaluate your idea of the society's border, there is no reason it needs to be national.

There is still force with a majority, especially an uninformed one (which we are). But I'm talking about using the democratic process as it is, ya know, electing representatives of the system to put in place what the majority wants i.e. asking people if they want to join. Given the current state of geo-political bolitics and the fact that society can be guided by a few with lots of money, and that you have given me no solid reason to re-evaluate the border, sorry, I can't grant you what you wish.

bogan

29th May 2015, 20:48

There is still force with a majority, especially an uninformed one (which we are). But I'm talking about using the democratic process as it is, ya know, electing representatives of the system to put in place what the majority wants i.e. asking people if they want to join. Given the current state of geo-political bolitics and the fact that society can be guided by a few with lots of money, and that you have given me no solid reason to re-evaluate the border, sorry, I can't grant you what you wish.

Don't you want to live in your society? The solid reason I give is you can live there when you get to 1% or less to just opt in, not the 51% majority to force it through.

mashman

29th May 2015, 21:48

Don't you want to live in your society? The solid reason I give is you can live there when you get to 1% or less to just opt in, not the 51% majority to force it through.

I do, yes... but "my" society involves "everyone" in the country. So I can't, and don't want to live there with just 1%.

bogan

29th May 2015, 21:51

I do, yes... but "my" society involves "everyone" in the country. So I can't, and don't want to live there with just 1%.

Why does it need everyone?

mashman

29th May 2015, 22:28

Why does it need everyone?

When I weigh up the pros and cons, an R.B.E. is most likely to stick if it is an entire country saying, fuck it, let's do it our way. Ubuntu. It takes a village to raise a child. Because I'd like to see science not be hamstrung by finance or indeed the brain drain of rocket sciency types into the banking sector. Because I'd like money not to be an incentive to falsify "evidence". Because I'd like to see every single kid educated to a level that would make Einstein look like an amoeba. Because every single person on this planet deserves better and what better way to prove an R.B.E. than on a countrywide level in order to have the world follow. Because there could be an education system in place that surpasses our wildest dreams as the next generation innovates upon our innovation. Because every single person deserves enough food, water, electrickery blah blah blah and a healthcare service that is built upon the prevention of illness of the individual. Because the old guy who got robbed for money got robbed for money. Because there is needless starvation given the tools we have. Because because because because because etc... money related bullshit.

It needs everyone because of all of those becauses.

bogan

29th May 2015, 22:35

When I weigh up the pros and cons, an R.B.E. is most likely to stick if it is an entire country saying, fuck it, let's do it our way. Ubuntu. It takes a village to raise a child. Because I'd like to see science not be hamstrung by finance or indeed the brain drain of rocket sciency types into the banking sector. Because I'd like money not to be an incentive to falsify "evidence". Because I'd like to see every single kid educated to a level that would make Einstein look like an amoeba. Because every single person on this planet deserves better and what better way to prove an R.B.E. than on a countrywide level in order to have the world follow. Because there could be an education system in place that surpasses our wildest dreams as the next generation innovates upon our innovation. Because every single person deserves enough food, water, electrickery blah blah blah and a healthcare service that is built upon the prevention of illness of the individual. Because the old guy who got robbed for money got robbed for money. Because there is needless starvation given the tools we have. Because because because because because etc... money related bullshit.

It needs everyone because of all of those becauses.

So why don't you want to live in a smaller version of your society until we all join you?

mashman

29th May 2015, 22:44

So why don't you want to live in a smaller version of your society until we all join you?

Because we are happy where we are, in the broad sense. There's no need for everyone's life to change. It's an education campaign, a lot of discussion, a political party, and a vote away. Why are you so keen to wait?

bogan

29th May 2015, 22:56

Because we are happy where we are, in the broad sense. There's no need for everyone's life to change. It's an education campaign, a lot of discussion, a political party, and a vote away. Why are you so keen to wait?

Seriously? all your negativity towards the financial system and you are happy where you are?

Keen to wait? I'm keen to do.

Brian d marge

29th May 2015, 23:00

Some stuff that might be worth time to watch.....
https://youtu.be/NjWOwa0IHBk

socialisim , news in the first 40 min , so jump to 41min if ya havent time

https://youtu.be/_WhZXhRS3F4

Greece explained

https://youtu.be/pcOooD1dM3g

What will happen ( Detroit )

and for Bogie san ;

The quote " apple flown to south africa and back to britain is from this woman.

http://www.unesco.org/new/fileadmin/...rberghodge.pdf (http://www.unesco.org/new/fileadmin/MULTIMEDIA/HQ/CLT/pdf/helenanorberghodge.pdf)

She has done quite a bit of work in this area ... shes quite well known .

I trust this source.

mashman

29th May 2015, 23:07

Seriously? all your negativity towards the financial system and you are happy where you are?

Keen to wait? I'm keen to do.

You still can't reconcile the two? I can tell you why though. Ditch the negative perception and try this one. If you can embrace an R.B.E. as an absolutely inevitability based on the fact that it is absolutely feasible, then you'll understand 1) why I've not actually been negative in my honest critique of the financial system and that you've read negativity (4 peeps and a bloke outside a pub, 2 say he negative, 2 say he not) in to it yourself, and 2) that my prevalent disposition is that of love and laughter... and that quite frankly, you fuckers are busting my calm on that front :laugh:

Awesome. So when it comes you'll vote for it without caring what the herd are gonna do?

bogan

29th May 2015, 23:13

The quote " apple flown to south africa and back to britain is from this woman.

http://www.unesco.org/new/fileadmin/...rberghodge.pdf (http://www.unesco.org/new/fileadmin/MULTIMEDIA/HQ/CLT/pdf/helenanorberghodge.pdf)

She has done quite a bit of work in this area ... shes quite well known .

I trust this source.

A trusted story-teller is still just a story teller though.

You still can't reconcile the two? I can tell you why though. Ditch the negative perception and try this one. If you can embrace an R.B.E. as an absolutely inevitability based on the fact that it is absolutely feasible, then you'll understand 1) why I've not actually been negative in my honest critique of the financial system and that you've read negativity (4 peeps and a bloke outside a pub, 2 say he negative, 2 say he not) in to it yourself, and 2) that my prevalent disposition is that of love and laughter... and that quite frankly, you fuckers are busting my calm on that front :laugh:

Awesome. So when it comes you'll vote for it without caring what the herd are gonna do?

An honest critique which comes to a negative conclusion is still negative. If it is inevitable, why? because it is better than the current system?

No, because I do not think your idea of an RBE is feasible.

Brian d marge

29th May 2015, 23:23

A trusted story-teller is still just a story teller though.

.

Hey , dont believe , your chance to prove me wrong .......Im sticking with her account until you come up with something better

good luck

Stephen

bogan

29th May 2015, 23:29

Hey , dont believe , your chance to prove me wrong .......Im sticking with her account until you come up with something better

good luck

Stephen

:laugh:

And there it is :facepalm:

mashman

29th May 2015, 23:53

An honest critique which comes to a negative conclusion is still negative. If it is inevitable, why? because it is better than the current system?

No, because I do not think your idea of an RBE is feasible.

What's negative about the realisation of Resource Based Economy? Yes it is better in just about every single way. See earlier because list and the fact that people really aren't that stupid.

Which is why you don't understand "my" idea of an R.B.E. You said it yourself, I described our system and then explained how a simple piece of computer software could convert human activity into the exact amount of money that is required at an exact point in time as it would in the normal life cycle of money. Well I know one of "our" R.B.E. ideas will be.

bogan

29th May 2015, 23:56

What's negative about the the realisation of Resource Based Economy? Yes, in just about every single way. See earlier because list and the fact that people really aren't that stupid.

Which is why you don't understand "my" idea of an R.B.E. You said it yourself, I described our system and then explained how a simple piece of computer software could convert human activity into the exact amount of money that is required at an exact point in time as it would in the normal life cycle of money. Well I know one of "our" R.B.E. ideas will be.

The negative is the evaluation result of the current system. In the same way that I see your system as a negative when compared to what we have now.

Wrong. I do understand it, we went over it, I know how you think it works. I also disagree with some of the fundamental assumptions you have made. That is all, we share an understanding of it, not the evaluation of it.

mashman

30th May 2015, 00:04

The negative is the evaluation result of the current system. In the same way that I see your system as a negative when compared to what we have now.

Wrong. I do understand it, we went over it, I know how you think it works. I also disagree with some of the fundamental assumptions you have made. That is all, we share an understanding of it, not the evaluation of it.

It was a less positive evaluation result than an R.B.E. then, which I also highlighted has some potential negatives. Take yer pick.

Ok.

Brian d marge

30th May 2015, 00:16

:laugh:

And there it is :facepalm:

well , are you going to , or write pages and pages of text?
Stephen

bogan

30th May 2015, 00:19

well , are you going to , or write pages and pages of text?
Stephen

What, prove a negative?

Not sure you are too familiar with this logic thing, but the onus is on the one who says a thing to prove it. Like if someone said you fuck goats, if you were unable to prove you didn't, would that make it true?

Brian d marge

30th May 2015, 00:23

What, prove a negative?

Not sure you are too familiar with this logic thing, but the onus is on the one who says a thing to prove it. Like if someone said you fuck goats, if you were unable to prove you didn't, would that make it true?
Well go on then

Youcried bullshyt

I posted my links

You dont like em

Soooooooooooooooo

Using your logic

Prove me wrong

bogan

30th May 2015, 00:32

Well go on then

Youcried bullshyt

I posted my links

You dont like em

Soooooooooooooooo

Using your logic

Prove me wrong

Logically, if enough people tell the same story, it does not make it true; more likely (up to a point), but not undoubtedly true.

It then follows, that a thing should not be believed (or retold) until it is shown to be true.

The logical conclusion of that, is to suspect bullshit when a story is told without showing any factual basis, especially when that story does not seem all that likely.

A further logical conclusion, is if the storyteller is asked to show some facts but cannot, the likelihood of it being bullshit goes up a few notches.

Given that logic, there is no need to prove you wrong at all ;)

bogan

30th May 2015, 00:35

It was a less positive evaluation result than an R.B.E. then, which I also highlighted has some potential negatives. Take yer pick.

Ok.

So why do you not want to live in the one with a more positive evaluation result NOW?

Brian d marge

30th May 2015, 00:59

Logically, if enough people tell the same story, it does not make it true; more likely (up to a point), but not undoubtedly true.

It then follows, that a thing should not be believed (or retold) until it is shown to be true.

The logical conclusion of that, is to suspect bullshit when a story is told without showing any factual basis, especially when that story does not seem all that likely.

A further logical conclusion, is if the storyteller is asked to show some facts but cannot, the likelihood of it being bullshit goes up a few notches.

Given that logic, there is no need to prove you wrong at all ;)
Thought so

Pages of text trying to justify yourself

The source is valid
If you dont like it . . .find another source

Then post it

As i said good luck

Brian d marge

30th May 2015, 02:10

The you tube version;

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/a-ukuUmTYLY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Stephen

mashman

30th May 2015, 08:39

So why do you not want to live in the one with a more positive evaluation result NOW?

I do..........

Ocean1

30th May 2015, 09:08

So why do you not want to live in the one with a more positive evaluation result NOW?

Because like any lazy cunt likely to benefit from changes giving lazy cunts more cargo he can't be fucked doing what it takes.

mashman

30th May 2015, 09:55

Because like any lazy cunt likely to benefit from changes giving lazy cunts more cargo he can't be fucked doing what it takes.

I already am.

mashman

30th May 2015, 10:16

Because like any lazy cunt likely to benefit from changes giving lazy cunts more cargo he can't be fucked doing what it takes.

Also, I thought you'd leap at the chance of a Resource Based Economy, as it gives everyone nothing to whinge about.

bogan

30th May 2015, 11:14

I do..........

The why wait for the majority, just do it with whoever you've got at the moment. There is nothing stopping you except the road-blocks of your own creation...

mashman

30th May 2015, 11:18

The why wait for the majority, just do it with whoever you've got at the moment. There is nothing stopping you except the road-blocks of your own creation...

I'm haven't waited for a majority. I'm not stopping myself. :facepalm:

bogan

30th May 2015, 11:29

I'm haven't waited for a majority. I'm not stopping myself. :facepalm:

If you aren't waiting, then why don't you want to live in a smaller version of your society until we all join you? Or do you want to, but are not capable of it?

mashman

30th May 2015, 11:43

If you aren't waiting, then why don't you want to live in a smaller version of your society until we all join you? Or do you want to, but are not capable of it?

:facepalm: and that is where you need to make your own leap of understanding as I'm not going to explain the myriad of reasons of why I think the way I choose to think about any given issue.

bogan

30th May 2015, 11:45

:facepalm: and that is where you need to make your own leap of understanding as I'm not going to explain the myriad of reasons of why I think the way I choose to think about any given issue.

The leap is but a small one, you promote an ideal as better, yet refuse to practice what you preach; while not offering any good reason to do so.

Snake Oil!

mashman

30th May 2015, 11:50

The leap is but a small one, you promote an ideal as better, yet refuse to practice what you preach; while not offering any good reason to do so.

Snake Oil!

Well I'm not out murdering people in their sleep. I don't have A single good reason. There are at bare minimum 7 billion.

A hurdle of your own making.

bogan

30th May 2015, 11:53

Well I'm not out murdering people in their sleep. I don't have A single good reason. There are at bare minimum 7 billion.

A hurdle of your own making.

But we established yours is so similar to the financial system that running within it is possible and even preferable. Stop putting up road blocks and give it a go.

Snake Oil.

mashman

30th May 2015, 12:22

But we established yours is so similar to the financial system that running within it is possible and even preferable. Stop putting up road blocks and give it a go.

Snake Oil.

No, you established yourself a preference that I did not. Not my problem you can't see past your own preference and the roadblocks you put up to stop yourself from gaining a higher understanding. The roadblocks certainly aren't mine.

Yet another hurdle of your own making.

bogan

30th May 2015, 12:59

No, you established yourself a preference that I did not. Not my problem you can't see past your own preference and the roadblocks you put up to stop yourself from gaining a higher understanding. The roadblocks certainly aren't mine.

Yet another hurdle of your own making.

We established a shared understanding of your system, we shared the understanding that the core principals behind both yours and the financial system were the same. You've created a road-block to achieving your utopia by arbitrarily assigning its borders to a whole country, I have not. I'm living my utopian system, you are not living in yours.

Snake oil.

mashman

30th May 2015, 13:22

We established a shared understanding of your system, we shared the understanding that the core principals behind both yours and the financial system were the same. You've created a road-block to achieving your utopia by arbitrarily assigning its borders to a whole country, I have not. I'm living my utopian system, you are not living in yours.

Snake oil.

No we didn't, because you're still asking questions and making false assumptions based on what you believe that I believe. You believe it is impossible outwith being able to grow it organically, I believe there is a more efficient manner i.e. offering to put in place something that will offer everyone single person the same options. As you say, there will likely those who self organise before the change. Good on them. But it's not my view of how it has to be. I said it would take a country to make it more likely to stick, not to restrict anything and also to prove to the world that it is possible on a large scale, so there are no roadblocks as it is still a natural progression.

:yawn:

bogan

30th May 2015, 13:26

No we didn't, because you're still asking questions and making false assumptions based on what you believe that I believe. You believe it is impossible outwith being able to grow it organically, I believe there is a more efficient manner i.e. offering to put in place something that will offer everyone single person the same options. As you say, there will likely those who self organise before the change. Good on them. But it's not my view of how it has to be. I said it would take a country to make it more likely to stick, not to restrict anything and also to prove to the world that it is possible on a large scale, so there are no roadblocks as it is still a natural progression.

:yawn:

Nothing has been shown to be false so far. No, I do not. Nor do I beleive you think that is how it has to be, we both just know that is how it could be. Given that point, why do you not live that way? why wait? why create your own roadblocks?

Snake Oil.

Ocean1

30th May 2015, 17:48

Also, I thought you'd leap at the chance of a Resource Based Economy, as it gives everyone nothing to whinge about.

Depends on the definition of "resource".

In your case it's obviously "whatever I say it means". And it changes from day to day.

In fact in the context of "economy", "resource" is a weasel word, coined by people who like to consider other people's "resources" as available for general consumption.

As always: you want it, you earn it.

Katman

30th May 2015, 17:56

As always: you want it, you earn it.

And where does 'want it' become greed?

Ocean1

30th May 2015, 18:06

And where does 'want it' become greed?

When it's available without earning it.

Brian d marge

30th May 2015, 19:08

When it's available without earning it.
Interest on money then

Ocean1

30th May 2015, 19:12

Interest on money then

Why would you expect to borrow money without earning it?

Brian d marge

30th May 2015, 21:13

Why would you expect to borrow money without earning it?
Is the interest on the loan earnt?

Eg i get given some money then i lend it to you at 18 percent . . .

Did i earn anything ????

I made money . . . .but I didnt work for it

Ocean1

30th May 2015, 21:37

Is the interest on the loan earnt?

Eg i get given some money then i lend it to you at 18 percent . . .

Did i earn anything ????

I made money . . . .but I didnt work for it

The customer says yes.

I don't borrow money at 18%.

No matter where the money came from it's the bank's liability, if the loan doesn't earn at least inflation level interest over a couple of decades or goes tits up in the meantime you've certainly lost rather a lot haven't you?

If you don't like either the cost or the source of the loan then you have the ultimate control over that situation: Don't borrow it.

Brian d marge

30th May 2015, 21:59

The customer says yes.

I don't borrow money at 18%.

No matter where the money came from it's the bank's liability, if the loan doesn't earn at least inflation level interest over a couple of decades or goes tits up in the meantime you've certainly lost rather a lot haven't you?

If you don't like either the cost or the source of the loan then you have the ultimate control over that situation: Don't borrow it.
Is the act of making money off a loan concidered working for it

Brian d marge

30th May 2015, 22:00

There ya go bogie

https://youtu.be/4r06_F2FIKM

Heres a face to the quote

Shes swedish and all

bogan

30th May 2015, 22:07

There ya go bogie

https://youtu.be/4r06_F2FIKM

Heres a face to the quote

Shes swedish and all

English problems again? I said fact, fact to the quote, not face. With a T. Got it? Good, now scurry off and try again.

Ocean1

30th May 2015, 22:08

Is the act of making money off a loan concidered working for it

Assuming there's supposed to be a question mark there: I don't think so.

Fact remains, those who lend money and those who borrow it both agree the facility has value. How much value is for them to decide.

Brian d marge

30th May 2015, 22:13

English problems again? I said fact, fact to the quote, not face. With a T. Got it? Good, now scurry off and try again.
Why dont you email her and call her out on her facts

Should be a laugh . .

Or shall I email her for you ( can i attach your posts as reference)

As I understand your busy and find it diificult to find time to google let alone email,

Brian d marge

30th May 2015, 22:15

Assuming there's supposed to be a question mark there: I don't think so.

Fact remains, those who lend money and those who borrow it both agree the facility has value. How much value is for them to decide.
Im worried about you lately

mashman

30th May 2015, 22:42

Depends on the definition of "resource".

In your case it's obviously "whatever I say it means". And it changes from day to day.

In fact in the context of "economy", "resource" is a weasel word, coined by people who like to consider other people's "resources" as available for general consumption.

As always: you want it, you earn it.

Everything is a resource.

No it's not a day to day change in the slightest, it's a continuous list. That everything is on it, given that everything is a resource, is no coincidence.

I agree, and I don't appreciate how badly my resources are being used.

I have.

Brian d marge

31st May 2015, 07:04

Hey bogie
how you doing with your fact finding mission .... ( apples ..helena ..strange hippie woman that you disagree with )

Do ya want me to Email for you , I can , Im good like that , always willing to help a fellow man

I will of course attach your Emails as a reference , you should be fine with that , the truth seeker that you are..

let me know ,,,,,,,

you willin friend

Mr B d marged .....

Brian d marge

31st May 2015, 08:52

https://youtu.be/myhnAZFR1po

Brian d marge

31st May 2015, 08:53

Or . .
https://youtu.be/e4Ao-iNPPUc

Brian d marge

31st May 2015, 09:10

being awfully sensible now ,....

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/PtCTWn6HCSI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

honest gov ......not a drop

Ocean1

31st May 2015, 09:15

Everything is a resource.

No it's not a day to day change in the slightest, it's a continuous list. That everything is on it, given that everything is a resource, is no coincidence.

I agree, and I don't appreciate how badly my resources are being used.

I have.

Resource: "a stock or supply of money, materials, staff, and other assets that can be drawn on by a person or organization". Which falls somewhat short of "everything", because it ignores ownership. You're particular brand of cargo cult communism, considering everything available for everyone is no different to all the communist efforts before it. They all failed because "everything" wasn't all of a sudden available to "everyone", just a select few committee members who in fact had earned fuck all.

So there you have it. By all means consider "everything" to be "your resource", but don't be all surprised if those who earned those "resources" laugh in your face and suggest that you fuck off and earn your own shit.

mashman

31st May 2015, 09:18

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4lYJW3ZfFo

Brian d marge

31st May 2015, 09:21

Resource: "a stock or supply of money, materials, staff, and other assets that can be drawn on by a person or organization". Which falls somewhat short of "everything", because it ignores ownership. You're particular brand of cargo cult communism, considering everything available for everyone is no different to all the communist efforts before it. They all failed because "everything" wasn't all of a sudden available to "everyone", just a select few committee members who in fact had earned fuck all.

So there you have it. By all means consider "everything" to be "your resource", but don't be all surprised if those who earned those "resources" laugh in your face and suggest that you fuck off and earn your own shit.
Heh non ne nonie ,

Dude i am really worried about u

This is the ocean we all know and love?

Yes you are right but do you know why you are right .

Please dont mess with the equilibration and keep a poor man sane

mashman

31st May 2015, 09:24

Resource: "a stock or supply of money, materials, staff, and other assets that can be drawn on by a person or organization". Which falls somewhat short of "everything", because it ignores ownership. You're particular brand of cargo cult communism, considering everything available for everyone is no different to all the communist efforts before it. They all failed because "everything" wasn't all of a sudden available to "everyone", just a select few committee members who in fact had earned fuck all.

So there you have it. By all means consider "everything" to be "your resource", but don't be all surprised if those who earned those "resources" laugh in your face and suggest that you fuck off and earn your own shit.

You can kiss my particular brand of that which you really don't understand. Go on, air rage, it'll be good for ya.

Thanks for the lulz, but you're so far off base it's almost getting embarrassing to read.

Ocean1

31st May 2015, 09:48

You can kiss my particular brand of that which you really don't understand. Go on, air rage, it'll be good for ya.

Thanks for the lulz, but you're so far off base it's almost getting embarrassing to read.

I understand perfectly, you want control over everything:

Everything is a resource.

and I don't appreciate how badly my resources are being used.

There's nothing ambiguous about those quotes, they clearly show your agenda, so your usual "you don't understand" trick when confronted with your own statements all of a sudden no looking too attractive is childish, at best.

Seriously, nobody's interested in your bullshit, it's so full of holes it you have no credibility whatsoever.

mashman

31st May 2015, 09:56

I understand perfectly, you want control over everything:

There's nothing ambiguous about those quotes, they clearly show your agenda, so your usual "you don't understand" trick when confronted with your own statements all of a sudden no looking too attractive is childish, at best.

Seriously, nobody's interested in your bullshit, it's so full of holes it you have no credibility whatsoever.

You quite obviously don't understand, let alone know what I want and why I want it. The idea stands in its own right. If you're too mesmerised by my new age moves when offering information, then you're missing the idea. Is that all you have? Because if it is, well.

Brian d marge

31st May 2015, 09:58

I understand perfectly, you want control over everything:

There's nothing ambiguous about those quotes, they clearly show your agenda, so your usual "you don't understand" trick when confronted with your own statements all of a sudden no looking too attractive is childish, at best.

Seriously, nobody's interested in your bullshit, it's so full of holes it you have no credibility whatsoever.

Thank fk for that . . Theres me thinking we would have to hold hands and sing kombuayaa . .
Or hey nonie nonie nonie

Mashies utopia beats your #ilovemywindmill neocon orgasim everytime

Come on me dear show us ur

https://youtu.be/LPn0KFlbqX8

mashman

31st May 2015, 10:00

The Deeply Tragic Sentencing of Ross Ulbricht (http://tucker.liberty.me/the-deeply-tragic-jailing-of-ross-ulbricht/)... Money!

bogan

31st May 2015, 11:42

Well it's a good thing I understand mashy's thingo, I'll take it from here...

Resource: "a stock or supply of money, materials, staff, and other assets that can be drawn on by a person or organization". Which falls somewhat short of "everything", because it ignores ownership. You're particular brand of cargo cult communism, considering everything available for everyone is no different to all the communist efforts before it. They all failed because "everything" wasn't all of a sudden available to "everyone", just a select few committee members who in fact had earned fuck all.

So there you have it. By all means consider "everything" to be "your resource", but don't be all surprised if those who earned those "resources" laugh in your face and suggest that you fuck off and earn your own shit.

The can be drawn on in the important bit, with a consensus anything can be drawn on for the greater good. Forced donation to the society ensure all resources are always available.

I understand perfectly, you want control over everything:

There's nothing ambiguous about those quotes, they clearly show your agenda, so your usual "you don't understand" trick when confronted with your own statements all of a sudden no looking too attractive is childish, at best.

Seriously, nobody's interested in your bullshit, it's so full of holes it you have no credibility whatsoever.

It will be good control over everything though, and not any single persons control but a combination of market forces, consensus, and computer programs.

So obviously you understand too. The main difference between it and communism, is this one can be tried at any time, with any number of people; and anyone not just trying to sell snake oil would go right ahead and be that change they wish others to be...

mashman

31st May 2015, 11:45

Benefits cap could push 40,000 children into poverty, claims leaked DWP memo (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/leaked-memo-claims-benefits-cut-could-plunge-another-40000-children-into-poverty-10286303.html)... Wrong direction

Brian d marge

31st May 2015, 16:44

butter ,,,,,must spread the legs

Stephen

mashman

1st June 2015, 11:59

Maybe you'll believe Morgan lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRSxQBy2sDY&app=desktop

mashman

1st June 2015, 13:30

"What a pussy" bwaaaaaaaaaa ha ha ha ha ha ha ha haaaaa... it is awful, but I like it. Option d) maybe NOW :wari:

In a nut shell... positive pun intended.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5NAxSYF1SAk&feature=youtu.be&app=desktop

mashman

2nd June 2015, 16:19

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q90NeRkqHcI&feature=youtu.be

Katman

8th June 2015, 16:41

bogan

8th June 2015, 17:13

http://www.filmsforaction.org/articles/welcome-to-marinaleda-the-spanish-anticapitalist-town-with-equal-wage-full-employment-and-19-housing/

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/oct/20/marinaleda-spanish-communist-village-utopia

Interesting, further reading does cause me to question its resource dependency/stability though...

mashman

8th June 2015, 19:17

mashman

9th June 2015, 18:39

http://www.ora.tv/offthegrid/real-life-vigilante-peter-joseph-0_2h2j2rsyy084

Brian d marge

10th June 2015, 00:54

http://www.ora.tv/offthegrid/real-life-vigilante-peter-joseph-0_2h2j2rsyy084

cant watch , NSA eaves dropping it slowing web and site drops out

Stephen

mashman

10th June 2015, 09:37

Akzle

10th June 2015, 09:40

mashman

10th June 2015, 09:57

novopay not good enough?

Not lesson enough likely lol.

oldrider

10th June 2015, 09:57

Got to get ready for the implementation of TPPA when we finally get to be another little star on "Old Glory" by any other name! :shifty: What a crock of shit! :buggerd:

mashman

10th June 2015, 09:58

Corporate Media Blacks Out Coverage of Bill to Overturn Corporate Personhood (http://wallstreetonparade.com/2015/05/corporate-media-blacks-out-coverage-of-bill-to-overturn-corporate-personhood/)

"Last Wednesday, the grassroots organization, Move to Amend, held a press conference at the National Press Club to announce that six members of the U.S. House of Representatives were introducing legislation to overturn Citizens United v FEC to make free speech and all other rights guaranteed under the U.S. Constitution available only to “natural persons,” not corporations or limited liability companies. The legislation would also give Federal, state and local governments the ability to limit political contributions to “ensure all citizens, regardless of their economic status, have access to the political process.”"

Akzle

11th June 2015, 07:52

“ensure all citizens, regardless of their economic status, have access to the political process.”"

huh. well, that's exactly what i want <_<

mashman

11th June 2015, 10:13

huh. well, that's exactly what i want <_<

lol, as does everyone... according to some think tank somewhere.

Brian d marge

11th June 2015, 12:02

bogan

11th June 2015, 18:04

Company to overhaul tax system named (https://nz.news.yahoo.com/top-stories/a/28373877/company-to-overhaul-tax-system-named/)

"US firm Fast Enterprises has been charged with designing the technology behind the $1 billion-plus overhaul of New Zealand's tax system." :killingme

Corporate Media Blacks Out Coverage of Bill to Overturn Corporate Personhood (http://wallstreetonparade.com/2015/05/corporate-media-blacks-out-coverage-of-bill-to-overturn-corporate-personhood/)

"Last Wednesday, the grassroots organization, Move to Amend, held a press conference at the National Press Club to announce that six members of the U.S. House of Representatives were introducing legislation to overturn Citizens United v FEC to make free speech and all other rights guaranteed under the U.S. Constitution available only to “natural persons,” not corporations or limited liability companies. The legislation would also give Federal, state and local governments the ability to limit political contributions to “ensure all citizens, regardless of their economic status, have access to the political process.”"

Both those thing highlight great news. Our tax system needs such an update to bring it in line with modern tech (like xero), and while a media story about media not covering what the media story briefly covered might confuse you, the story is also great news.

mashman

11th June 2015, 19:00

Both those thing highlight great news. Our tax system needs such an update to bring it in line with modern tech (like xero), and while a media story about media not covering what the media story briefly covered might confuse you, the story is also great news.

You don't find $1 billion a little excessive for design and configuration of a system that is already documented?

bogan

11th June 2015, 19:04

You don't find $1 billion a little excessive for design and configuration of a system that is already documented?

Not really, be a shit-tonne of work in it.

mashman

11th June 2015, 19:53

Not really, be a shit-tonne of work in it.

To get it complete yes, but shit-tonne of money to accomplish that?

It also highlighted just how ridiculously convoluted our world is. An intentional action.

bogan

11th June 2015, 19:56

To get it complete yes, but shit-tonne of money to accomplish that?

It also highlighted just how ridiculously convoluted our world is. An intentional action.

Yeh, one generally follows the other.

Nah, it is just another positive example of how well our system work. Depend how positively or negatively you wish to, and chose to see things I guess...

mashman

11th June 2015, 20:10

Nah, it is just another positive example of how well our system work. Depend how positively or negatively you wish to, and chose to see things I guess...

Difference is, I have something tangible to make such a judgement as to which is a more negative approach to managing the planet and it's bits n pieces (us inc) than you :bleh:. So, I know better when I see it :wari: Shame you choose to twist it toward a more negative bent.

bogan

11th June 2015, 20:13

Difference is, I have something tangible to make such a judgement as to which is a more negative approach to managing the planet and it's bits n pieces (us inc) than you :bleh:. So, I know better when I see it :wari: Shame you choose to twist it toward a more negative bent.

What tangible thing is that? All I've seen from you is the negative characterization of a system extremely similar to the one you would propose, simply so your system looks more positive; yet you negatively create roadblocks so you can fail to take tangible steps towards living in your system...

Snake oil.

Akzle

11th June 2015, 20:45

Snake oil.

i keep hearing this..

But.. Can you smoke it?.

bogan

11th June 2015, 20:50

i keep hearing this..

But.. Can you smoke it?.

Depends entirely if you ask a seller, or a buyer...

Brian d marge

11th June 2015, 22:18

i keep hearing this..

But.. Can you smoke it?.
Hell yes

I also have some chilean magic cheese available

Sent from my SC-01F using Tapatalk

mashman

12th June 2015, 10:14

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEh1nJ_YmzM

Brian d marge

12th June 2015, 16:12

snip

So if a 13 year old girl can explain it , ..........

Stephen

( would explain the inept lies excuses about weapons of mass destruction ..and 911 ..... Im listening to a report on 911 and its very entertaining , Im pissing me self ...the presenter is a bit of a sarcastic sod !!!)

Snip
We got around to the subject of war again and I said that, contrary to his attitude, I did not think that the common people are very thankful for leaders who bring them war and destruction.

"Why, of course, the people don't want war," Goering shrugged. "Why would some poor slob on a farm want to risk his life in a war when the best that he can get out of it is to come back to his farm in one piece. Naturally, the common people don't want war; neither in Russia nor in England nor in America, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy or a fascist dictatorship or a Parliament or a Communist dictatorship."

"There is one difference," I pointed out. "In a democracy the people have some say in the matter through their elected representatives, and in the United States only Congress can declare wars."

"Oh, that is all well and good, but, voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."

mashman

12th June 2015, 16:51

So if a 13 year old girl can explain it , ..........

Stephen

( would explain the inept lies excuses about weapons of mass destruction ..and 911 ..... Im listening to a report on 911 and its very entertaining , Im pissing me self ...the presenter is a bit of a sarcastic sod !!!)

... imagine what she'll come out with when she's aware of what a Resource Based Economy is :blip:

Nasty business. Keeps 'em busy mind :shifty:

We got around to the subject of war again and I said that, contrary to his attitude, I did not think that the common people are very thankful for leaders who bring them war and destruction.

"Why, of course, the people don't want war," Goering shrugged. "Why would some poor slob on a farm want to risk his life in a war when the best that he can get out of it is to come back to his farm in one piece. Naturally, the common people don't want war; neither in Russia nor in England nor in America, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy or a fascist dictatorship or a Parliament or a Communist dictatorship."

"There is one difference," I pointed out. "In a democracy the people have some say in the matter through their elected representatives, and in the United States only Congress can declare wars."

"Oh, that is all well and good, but, voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."

Smart fella.

mashman

23rd June 2015, 08:01

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXm5hklbBsA

mashman

25th June 2015, 08:02

http://in5d.com/all-world-debt-to-be-paid-off-by-august-17th-2015-or-else/ (http://in5d.com/prosperity-fund-payments-to-be-released-by-august-17-2015/)

mashman

1st July 2015, 10:39

Jim Rickards: "The Fed and Treasury are the greatest threats to national security." (http://pro.moneymappress.com/MMRBS495LG/PMMRR629/?iris=381823&ad=b1-jrdoc-rd&h=true)

mashman

2nd July 2015, 21:49

Meet the 15-year-old hero who just gave the U.N. some real talk about the future of his generation. (http://www.upworthy.com/meet-the-15-year-old-hero-who-just-gave-the-un-some-real-talk-about-the-future-of-his-generation?c=ufb1)

Akzle

2nd July 2015, 22:06

mashman

10th July 2015, 12:06

The Budget: '13m Families To Lose Average Of £260' (https://uk.news.yahoo.com/budget-living-wage-could-cost-60-000-jobs-062803101.html#IWUupFn)

Osborne: Budget To Put Economic Security First (https://uk.news.yahoo.com/budget-slow-pace-welfare-cuts-sky-sources-183703852.html)

Australian heads to Greece to help crying pensioner in photo (https://uk.news.yahoo.com/australian-heads-greece-help-crying-pensioner-photo-052552676.html#wkHTRsK)

All money problems perpetuated by morons.

Brian d marge

10th July 2015, 18:38

mashman

11th July 2015, 00:37

Smart people actually, who have no, if any, empathy ...... ( the ones that created the problem ,not the pensioner)

Stephen

Makes them not smart in my book... coz if they were that smart, these things wouldn't happen. Logic doesn't require empathy... but having the latter certainly helps compensate for a lack of the former... although I haven't seen any links with peer reviewed evidence to guarantee such findings... so I'll wait forever on the fence before committing to anything that I might regret later in life.

Brian d marge

11th July 2015, 01:43

Makes them not smart in my book... coz if they were that smart, these things wouldn't happen. Logic doesn't require empathy... but having the latter certainly helps compensate for a lack of the former... although I haven't seen any links with peer reviewed evidence to guarantee such findings... so I'll wait forever on the fence before committing to anything that I might regret later in life.
oh they are smart aright ....if you have an agenda , and you are pretty sure folks wont like it ....

you use ya smarts , going from the back door and get the people to believe its good for em , or ,,something like the big scary turban wearing man will eat their children when they sleep

after that its a piece of cake

As for waiting on the fence, Ive never needed peer reviewed evidence before committing to something I would regret later in life , ...... except that young thang in Bangkok a few years back ....

Stephen

Ocean1

11th July 2015, 10:02

mashman

11th July 2015, 16:13

oh they are smart aright ....if you have an agenda , and you are pretty sure folks wont like it ....

you use ya smarts , going from the back door and get the people to believe its good for em , or ,,something like the big scary turban wearing man will eat their children when they sleep

after that its a piece of cake

As for waiting on the fence, Ive never needed peer reviewed evidence before committing to something I would regret later in life , ...... except that young thang in Bangkok a few years back ....

Stephen

It's not hard to look smart when you own the rigged game though is it. If you had their knowledge would it really make you any smarter?

bwaaaaaaa ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha haaaaaaaaa... gotta jump in at some point.

https://raindropsandcoffeestains.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/img_0640.jpg

mashman

11th July 2015, 16:24

My, you catch on quick. Yes indeedy, morons who fail to contribute cause problems for everyone.

Nobody can afford them, not the world's wealthiest countries, and certainly not the world's most indebted.

Only because you have to pay them in order for them to be able to live. Ditch the financial element to that equation and I wouldn't give a shit if they contribute or not, because they are no longer a hindrance. Mankind can use whatever resources they like for whatever purpose*. No need for the lazy to "acquire" money in ways that the financial system deems illegal and that causes people harm. I do wish you would re-consider your position in regards to a Resource Based Economy, because it looks as though victory has defeated you (batman line, meh).

*Technology, Education, Rockets, Etheric dwellings, Healthcare par excellence, less reasons to be a criminal, more reasons to get stuck in, Flying cars, every structure reinforced with concrete, colonisation of the moon/mars/wherever etc... there are no limits when you have unlimited money by virtue of it not existing. Believe. I know it sounds like a cat poster (lego movie line, meh).

Brian d marge

11th July 2015, 16:43

It's not hard to look smart when you own the rigged game though is it. If you had their knowledge would it really make you any smarter?

bwaaaaaaa ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha haaaaaaaaa... gotta jump in at some point.

https://raindropsandcoffeestains.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/img_0640.jpg
No Id have all that knowledge and still go down pub

Wake up on monday morning having screwed up a rigged game that was in my favor and a dead cert

Im still waiting for shergar to win rhe grand national so I can cash out of my investment

Sent from my SC-01F using Tapatalk

mashman

11th July 2015, 17:04

No Id have all that knowledge and still go down pub

Wake up on monday morning having screwed up a rigged game that was in my favor and a dead cert

Im still waiting for shergar to win rhe grand national so I can cash out of my investment

Sent from my SC-01F using Tapatalk

bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaa ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha haaaaaaaaaaaa... at least you'll have fueled the economy... likely entitling you to a Peace Prize or sommink.

Good horse shergar, sound investment mate.

Ocean1

11th July 2015, 17:48

Only because you have to pay them in order for them to be able to live. Ditch the financial element to that equation and I wouldn't give a shit if they contribute or not, because they are no longer a hindrance. Mankind can use whatever resources they like for whatever purpose*. No need for the lazy to "acquire" money in ways that the financial system deems illegal and that causes people harm. I do wish you would re-consider your position in regards to a Resource Based Economy, because it looks as though victory has defeated you (batman line, meh).

*Technology, Education, Rockets, Etheric dwellings, Healthcare par excellence, less reasons to be a criminal, more reasons to get stuck in, Flying cars, every structure reinforced with concrete, colonisation of the moon/mars/wherever etc... there are no limits when you have unlimited money by virtue of it not existing. Believe. I know it sounds like a cat poster (lego movie line, meh).

Ditching money does not make resources infinite. Nor does the lack of money make them available to people that don't either create them or earn them.

In the meantime, what resources exist can be and are most effectively traded by those who do create and earn them by the use of agreed value units called money.

The single attraction in forgoing the use of money is the fact that without it your lazy non-contributor would be removed from the gene pool. Having not created or earned anything he's got nothing to contribute to any exchange, unless his peers see him as a charity case why would they give him anything?

FJRider

11th July 2015, 18:11

In the meantime, what resources exist can be and are most effectively traded by those who do create and earn them by the use of agreed value units called money.

ANY resourse or item that can be created or supplied ... can be traded. Effective "Value" would be entirely up to those that have an actual/percieved demand/requirement for such ...

The single attraction in forgoing the use of money is the fact that without it your lazy non-contributor would be removed from the gene pool. Having not created or earned anything he's got nothing to contribute to any exchange, unless his peers see him as a charity case why would they give him anything?

As such ... it would be stupid to remove money from the system ...

mashman

11th July 2015, 18:45

Ditching money does not make resources infinite. Nor does the lack of money make them available to people that don't either create them or earn them.

In the meantime, what resources exist can be and are most effectively traded by those who do create and earn them by the use of agreed value units called money.

The single attraction in forgoing the use of money is the fact that without it your lazy non-contributor would be removed from the gene pool. Having not created or earned anything he's got nothing to contribute to any exchange, unless his peers see him as a charity case why would they give him anything?

I agree, but it will allow for weapons materials to be put to a more productive usage... plus getting rid of barbie dolls and other superfluous shit will go a long way towards making resource much more available, and precious. I get the whole no free lunch thing... but a Resource Based Economy is a much better shit sandwich. Some will create, some will be lazy. Why let that stop creation? Give it time and education and creation will be much more prevalent in society than it is today.

Ammunition and effective use do not compute. Neither does the production of barbie dolls. Nor cheap shit that'll die in less than 20 years. Shit matters coz "dead" resource, as you say, dead resource... so much of it really needn't have been "wasted". V's a Resource Based Economy, the financial system creates way too many problems in order to try to be "fair". When it really isn't. Again, needlessly so in too many places.

Fuck 'em. Let 'em do what they choose to do. If they're cunt enough to take advantage, then they'll do that irrespective of economy. An R.B.E. removes the need for the cunt to immorally violate another to finance that lifestyle. Seriously, ignore them i.e. food, water etc... and they're not going to be an issue. Why let their existence prevent the rest from moving forwards at break neck speed? Too many bankers/people are trained to do things there aren't enough jobs for or are too expensive. Degrees students in Maccas paying their dues is not my idea of an effective use of training. Not to mention the "bullshit" jobs for jobs sake. All very doable and relatively easy to implement (under an RBE)... especially if you consider, for your own entertainment perhaps, the effects of a Resource Based Economy on things like IP and internet security. Sigh... heh.

mashman

14th July 2015, 08:58

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcwJt4bcnXs

Brian d marge

14th July 2015, 15:12

The IMF put it like this in a review of the Greek programme in 2011: "The asset transfer [in other words privatisation] would create a basis for new investment and growth; indeed the state enterprises involved already represent about 15% of total Greek investment and 2-3% of value added, and new owners would have an incentive to make them more productive

Or you could use asset stripping such as the americans use

Me , Im thinking rice might be a good currency

Have a bag of it at home

Sent from my SC-01F using Tapatalk

mashman

14th July 2015, 20:11

Children miss out on free doctor visits (https://nz.news.yahoo.com/top-stories/a/28787338/children-miss-out-on-free-doctor-visits/)

"He said he was "stunned" by the uptake level.". Kids are sick dude. What did he expect? That no one out there was sick and that everyone can afford to find that extra $ to get their kid to the doctor? And when it's a false alarm you can't get it back. Not much out of touch... only completely. Proof that it's a financial problem for far too many.

mashman

15th July 2015, 20:50

https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/10404232_863057920416881_6825647191821193250_n.jpg ?oh=aa1ab4d616b3106d1d64ba21db9efbea&oe=565C96ED&__gda__=1448267655_66ef1663e8268e6491e2ff82a406e2a f

Ocean1

15th July 2015, 21:00

Brian d marge

15th July 2015, 21:09

And this is the official letterhead, is it? Except nothing

Fixed it for you

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bogan

15th July 2015, 21:09

And this is the official letterhead, is it? Except nothing less?

That's gotta be sponsored by the bankers, shirley...

mashman

15th July 2015, 22:03

And this is the official letterhead, is it? Except nothing less?

That's just one of them silly. They'll all have their catchy chunes. In theory we could end up with 121 different Resource Based Economy making up parliament.

mashman

18th July 2015, 15:47

Ocean1

18th July 2015, 16:00

Lines go silent in Finnish town of Salo as Microsoft shuts Nokia phone unit (https://nz.news.yahoo.com/technology/a/28836085/lines-go-silent-in-finnish-town-of-salo-as-microsoft-shuts-nokia-phone-unit/)... yet more unaffordable brains.

Never mind, Finland has invested several billion euro in Greek bonds, when that lot falls due they'll be on the pig's back. :shifty:

Brian d marge

18th July 2015, 16:19

Seems like relying on the current system for the basic may not be a good idea . ,rice anyone

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bogan

22nd July 2015, 14:36

http://www.cnbc.com/2015/07/21/paypal-ceo-time-to-democratize-the-banking-system-commentary.html

Worth a read perhaps...

mashman

22nd July 2015, 14:45

http://www.cnbc.com/2015/07/21/paypal-ceo-time-to-democratize-the-banking-system-commentary.html

Worth a read perhaps...

Excellent laugh thanks. Those 3 principles aren't.

"Working through all of the technical, economic and regulatory barriers to make this all possible will require clarity of purpose and an unusual degree of public and private collaboration across the financial and business sectors.

But it can be done — and the effort will be worth it. "

Still not getting it after 40k years of failure huh... indoctrination at its finest.

bogan

22nd July 2015, 14:49

Still not getting it after 40k years of failure huh...

Still on the negative vibe eh.

mashman

22nd July 2015, 14:52

Still on the negative vibe eh.

Nope... that's just the way you see what I'm saying.

Greek banks reopen but cash limits remain; taxes soar (https://nz.finance.yahoo.com/news/greek-banks-reopen-cash-limits-105901462.html)

"Though the daily cash withdrawal limit stayed at 60 euros ($65), the government has given individuals a new weekly limit of 420 euros ($455) from this coming Sunday so they don't need to trudge to the ATM every day."

"Sales taxes have risen from 13 percent to 23 percent on many basic goods — including some meats, cooking oils, coffee, tea, cocoa, vinegar, salt, flowers, firewood, fertilizer, insecticides, sanitary towels and condoms."

Money money money for screwing people into the ground... in fact in this day and age you can control how much money an entire population is allowed to have per day.

And we're told that we're free :killingme

bogan

22nd July 2015, 14:57

Nope... that's just the way you see what I'm saying.

Yeh but that is also just the way you see what I'm saying as negative things about what you are saying :facepalm: grow a spine buddy

mashman

22nd July 2015, 15:56

Yeh but that is also just the way you see what I'm saying as negative things about what you are saying :facepalm: grow a spine buddy

Ok.............

scumdog

22nd July 2015, 21:23

.. in fact in this day and age you can control how much money an entire population is allowed to have per day.

Only if they've stored their money in somebody elses building...

mashman

22nd July 2015, 21:25

Only if they've stored their money in somebody elses building...

THEIR money? lol... how quaint ;).

Brian d marge

22nd July 2015, 21:48

Only if they've stored their money in somebody elses building...
Its all digital now . . .come on baggy get with the beat of the modern age

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scumdog

22nd July 2015, 21:49

THEIR money? lol... how quaint ;).

Well if it's in their hand - it's theirs.
if it's elsewhere then maybe it might not be.

Seems straightforwards to me...

mashman

22nd July 2015, 21:54

Well if it's in their hand - it's theirs.
if it's elsewhere then maybe it might not be.

Seems straightforwards to me...

If you don't print it, then the owner can legally seek the return of their property whenever they choose... or in Greece's case, and Cyprus before them, be allowed to remove as much of it as they are allowed by the owner of the money. After all, they have their name on the money too ;).

I agree, it is straightforwards... just not in the same way as you :laugh:

mashman

23rd July 2015, 08:52

Still on the negative vibe eh.

Maybe you'll believe this guy when he explains why our success is a failure.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YMDu3JdQ8Ow

From here (http://www.collective-evolution.com/2015/03/21/what-is-wrong-with-our-culture-alan-watts/), for context ;).

Akzle

23rd July 2015, 08:58

Seems straightforwards to me...

yes but to be fair, you're a moron.

bogan

23rd July 2015, 09:18

Maybe you'll believe this guy when he explains why our success is a failure.

Still on the negative vibe then eh.

Our success is a motherfucking success; motorcycles and shit yo, whiney pie-in-the sky ifs and could have beens don't change that.

mashman

23rd July 2015, 09:26

Still on the negative vibe then eh.

Our success is a motherfucking success; motorcycles and shit yo, whiney pie-in-the sky ifs and could have beens don't change that.

So what you're saying is, you didn't watch the video. I shoulda left it at Ok.............

bogan

23rd July 2015, 09:30

So what you're saying is, you didn't watch the video. I shoulda left it at Ok.............

Was it relevant? Your vibe is negative whether the video justifies it or not.

mashman

23rd July 2015, 09:42

Was it relevant? Your vibe is negative whether the video justifies it or not.

Yes, I believe that the words in the video are more relevant today than they were when the were spoken. It's not justification :facepalm:.

bogan

23rd July 2015, 09:46

It's not justification :facepalm:.

Excellent, so we agree your glass is proclaimed to be a little empty. I prefer mine to be twice as big as it needs to be.

These might be more your speed anyway (and good for a laugh for us other people)

http://cheezburger.com/575493/funny-memes-political-ideologies

mashman

23rd July 2015, 10:02

Excellent, so we agree your glass is proclaimed to be a little empty. I prefer mine to be twice as big as it needs to be.

These might be more your speed anyway (and good for a laugh for us other people)

http://cheezburger.com/575493/funny-memes-political-ideologies

See, this is why it's pointless... I have no glass.

They were great.

bogan

23rd July 2015, 10:04

See, this is why it's pointless... I have no glass.

It's a common metaphor, dummy. You don't need to have an actual glass at hand.

mashman

23rd July 2015, 11:03

It's a common metaphor, dummy. You don't need to have an actual glass at hand.

I know. Enjoy your bigger glass.

mashman

27th July 2015, 12:39

The Ascent of Money. An excellent series I watched a few years ago. Iffen ye get keen and get through a few, have a listen out for the bit on John Law (Episode 3) and the things he got up to :yes: ... a modern day trail blazer from the 17th Century.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1sjFHEl5GI

Brian d marge

27th July 2015, 13:23

Keep going back until ya hit venice. . .naughty naughty

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mashman

31st July 2015, 10:10

It's a much older game than people are aware of...

https://alwaysquestionauthority.files.wordpress.com/2014/12/9471_10152925110284655_6416547429188965665_n.png

Ocean1

31st July 2015, 15:56

It's a much older game than people are aware of...

Bitching about banks?

About as old as there've been people borrowing money from them.

mashman

31st July 2015, 16:38

Bitching about banks?

Nope.........

Brian d marge

31st July 2015, 18:20

Bitching about banks?

About as old as there've been people borrowing money from them.
Ever since they sat on the bench if front of the temple changing money

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mashman

6th August 2015, 18:03

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-4R_QxsoFSwU/U8TYhj1H0JI/AAAAAAAAAj8/Kl168qOEz0Q/s1600/eugene%2Bdebs%2Bquote.jpg

scumdog

9th August 2015, 13:26

Obviously that one man was a shit-load smarter than the millions of poor minnions.

Good on him, Im jealous!

Voltaire

9th August 2015, 15:22

Sounds like that bloke who " made" his money with Merril Lynch by gambling others money and can't even bang a nail in?:rolleyes:

Brian d marge

9th August 2015, 15:56

Sounds like that bloke who " made" his money with Merril Lynch by gambling others money and can't even bang a nail in?:rolleyes:
But he can pull a ponytail

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Edbear

9th August 2015, 16:23

Obviously that one man was a shit-load smarter than the millions of poor minnions.

Good on him, Im jealous!

Even a wage worker can amass a fortune by applying a few monetary principles. One noted wealthy person said that if you want to be rich, save 10% of what you earn.

Problem is, most people can't wait for tomorrow to come and spend everything they earn plus a bit.

By thinking and consulting, you can turn a negative situation into a positive one.

mashman

9th August 2015, 16:43

Even a wage worker can amass a fortune by applying a few monetary principles. One noted wealthy person said that if you want to be rich, save 10% of what you earn.

Problem is, most people can't wait for tomorrow to come and spend everything they earn plus a bit.

By thinking and consulting, you can turn a negative situation into a positive one.

A comparative fortune?

Or those who do save it have to spend it on a Dr or WOF or Insurance or rent increase or for more expensive food or electricity to keep the house from being damp etc... Spin it how ya like but having no money is fucked up when the choice you're left with is nappies or electricity for cooking. 10% of minimum wage is feck all given the rapid increase in prices. Comfort shopping ain't on the agenda for many of the most you seem to be alluding to.

Very true... so long as you have something to invest.

Edbear

9th August 2015, 17:24

A comparative fortune?

Or those who do save it have to spend it on a Dr or WOF or Insurance or rent increase or for more expensive food or electricity to keep the house from being damp etc... Spin it how ya like but having no money is fucked up when the choice you're left with is nappies or electricity for cooking. 10% of minimum wage is feck all given the rapid increase in prices. Comfort shopping ain't on the agenda for many of the most you seem to be alluding to.

Very true... so long as you have something to invest.

That's because the problem is generationarily endemic. Sadly, few parents have, or even can, teach their children while growing up about fiscal responsibility and how to make the right choices. I was one of those children who didn't have the right example to follow nor the right advice and training. So now in my late 50's I have had to basically start over from scratch and try to build assets that will be able to support me and my wife into retirement.

Unfortunately, for many young ones, they tend to ignore sage advice and have also to learn the hard way. By then they are often deeply in debt and missed out on gaining the skills and qualifications they needed, too.

Shame, but our Welfare System should be providing budgeting advice along with offering courses and finding jobs as part of its mandate.

Brian d marge

9th August 2015, 18:36

Edbear

9th August 2015, 19:20

Assuming one can save at a rate greater than the real rate of inflation

And that one has enough to save at the 10 percent of earnings

Since 1971 the old ways were relegated to the back seat

Sorry

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I think that for many it's too late and they are stuck in that trap. The fortunate may get a bailout and the opportunity to advance but there's a reason it's called the poverty trap.

I still believe that if guided from the start as regards education and monetary training one can overcome a disadvantaged beginning, but it has to be from the start of schooling.

Voltaire

9th August 2015, 19:54

I remember the school ASB savings account, the Home Loan account. Fat lot of good they ever were.
Getting your wages in cash, and everything being closed from 12 on a Saturday till 8 on Monday.
Then all those crooked companies came along in the 80's that sucked people in to investing on the share market.....
Seems to have been down hill since then.

Some old house up the road that looks to be in need of total renovation just sold for 1.18 million....:shit:
Man things are totally going off the rails.

fridayflash

9th August 2015, 20:03

school bank account with ASB? bloody free market capitalist! we were 'post office' all the way :rolleyes:

Voltaire

9th August 2015, 20:43

school bank account with ASB? bloody free market capitalist! we were 'post office' all the way :rolleyes:

That was when ASB said things like " you own a bank" ...then it became Australian owned.

I did my apprenticeship with the Post Office, knew where every pub in Auckland was.

mashman

9th August 2015, 20:47

That's because the problem is generationarily endemic. Sadly, few parents have, or even can, teach their children while growing up about fiscal responsibility and how to make the right choices. I was one of those children who didn't have the right example to follow nor the right advice and training. So now in my late 50's I have had to basically start over from scratch and try to build assets that will be able to support me and my wife into retirement.

Unfortunately, for many young ones, they tend to ignore sage advice and have also to learn the hard way. By then they are often deeply in debt and missed out on gaining the skills and qualifications they needed, too.

Shame, but our Welfare System should be providing budgeting advice along with offering courses and finding jobs as part of its mandate.

Oh I dunno about kids not learning the value of money from their olds... not saying it doesn't happen, but kids grow up to make up their own minds in regards to what they "want" and what they are prepared to do to get it.

The problem endemic though, but it is engineered to be so. Quite simply put you have finite jobs that pay a finite amount of money. Where I become the CEO of an existing company, the existing CEO becomes unemployed... similarly for doctors, labourers etc... all paid, and as many jobs available, to budget. Unfortunately, as ocean is so happy at crowing, 55% of the population are negative net tax contributors and that in itself screams what the problem is loud and clear, money!

The "problem" really is that simple. There isn't enough money to pay people well enough, and there isn't enough money to ensure REAL full-employment, and not the 80% shite that's accepted as full-employment. Wages/Job value is driven down based on some fucked up notion of value and the outcome is poor paying jobs, welfare, crime, unemployment and all of the useless money related nonsense that goes with it.

So whilst I agree to an extent, we have failed our young by allowing such bullshit to not only exist but to become an excepted norm. Time to change the norm and arse money out of the door as it's nought more than just another social engineering tool. Sad, but absolutely true without a shadow of a doubt. It is "this" way on purpose, it is no accident, else our education institutions would have financial nouse as a core component of the curriculum. It's doesn't for a reason! It's engineered to be so! Kicking the young for a perceived lack of effort/financial acumen is fuckin pathetic, but that's something we adults carry the can for as we allow it... well, those of us who aren't an island.

It'll all change soon enough!

Voltaire

9th August 2015, 20:55

It'll all change soon enough!
http://img.deusm.com/eetimes/2014/09/1323917/3pi-dab-0047-02.jpg

Current system seems to have survived at least 2 world wars and at least one major depression, whats going to kick off change?

scumdog

9th August 2015, 21:03

Unfortunately, as ocean is so happy at crowing, 55% of the population are negative net tax contributors and that in itself screams what the problem is loud and clear, money!

The "problem" really is that simple. There isn't enough money to pay people well enough, and there isn't enough money to ensure REAL full-employment, and not the 80% shite that's accepted as full-employment. Wages/Job value is driven down based on some fucked up notion of value and the outcome is poor paying jobs, welfare, crime, unemployment and all of the useless money related nonsense that goes with it.

It'll all change soon enough!

Wot 'e sez - 'cept maybe the last line, the jury is out with that one.

mashman

9th August 2015, 21:10

End of the world is nigh...

Current system seems to have survived at least 2 world wars and at least one major depression, whats going to kick off change?

The thing that has changed... the peeps... and they've already started :D

Wot 'e sez - 'cept maybe the last line, the jury is out with that one.

Back away from the bong... well it worked for me ;).

Brian d marge

9th August 2015, 21:52

Current system seems to have survived at least 2 world wars and at least one major depression, whats going to kick off change?

Interest rate rises in September ( me thinks )

If amerika raises those rates ...things might get interesting !

Stephen

Akzle

9th August 2015, 22:02

Current system seems to have survived at least 2 world wars and at least one major depression, whats going to kick off change?

caused* .

Voltaire

10th August 2015, 07:00

caused* .

Oh come on, you can do better than that.
Was that Serbian bloke Princip employed by a Jooish/Merican/Rothschild /Rokafella..etc

mashman

10th August 2015, 08:37

oldrider

10th August 2015, 10:22

Looting Sweeps Venezuela as Hunger Takes Over (http://panampost.com/sabrina-martin/2015/08/06/looting-sweeps-venezuela-as-hunger-takes-over/#.VcatkT1ts9F.facebook)... food shortages in a world of abundance?

Might be happening here soon - thanks to sanctions on Russia and the dairy glut - TPPA might be the final nail in the lid! :scratch:

Ocean1

10th August 2015, 11:07

Looting Sweeps Venezuela as Hunger Takes Over (http://panampost.com/sabrina-martin/2015/08/06/looting-sweeps-venezuela-as-hunger-takes-over/#.VcatkT1ts9F.facebook)... food shortages in a world of abundance?

No surprise there, only a communist state could fail in a world where everyone else is eating more than ever.

mashman

10th August 2015, 11:18

Might be happening here soon - thanks to sanctions on Russia and the dairy glut - TPPA might be the final nail in the lid! :scratch:

Yeah the brits n frogs ain't too happy about the dairy rort. According to t' news, a farmer walked 2 cows through the aisles of a supermarket to make a point. Fun times ahead eh... all scrambling to restore market confidence using the old ways, ironically using communistic ways :killingme

Banditbandit

10th August 2015, 11:18

No surprise there, only a communist state could fail in a world where everyone else is eating more than ever.

COme on .. that is so patently untrue ...

Sure the western world is eating more than ever .. but the rest of the world is not ..

Voltaire

10th August 2015, 12:27

COme on .. that is so patently untrue ...

Sure the western world is eating more than ever .. but the rest of the world is not ..

is it lack of food or lack of money to pay for it?

mashman

10th August 2015, 13:16

is it lack of food or lack of money to pay for it?

I'll take option B Bob...

The economy of Venezuela is largely based on the petroleum sector and manufacturing.[16] Revenue from petroleum exports accounts for more than 50% of the country's GDP and roughly 95% of total exports (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Venezuela)

Saudi Arabia may go broke before the US oil industry buckles (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/oilprices/11768136/Saudi-Arabia-may-go-broke-before-the-US-oil-industry-buckles.html)

Economic warfare limits the $ that a country can earn in order to buy the food it needs. The production of food hasn't changed, just the value.

Brian d marge

10th August 2015, 14:39

Didnt I point this out , like ages ago ...

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/140713-Stupid-World?p=1130880736#post1130880736

and NZ is going to tell U .S.A to go and take a running jump

Yeah right

When yellen put those interest rates up , thing should get interesting ! me thinks

Not time to start packing for me move to the hills , but its time to figure out which hills one should run to !

Stephen

oldrider

10th August 2015, 14:53

I'll take option B Bob...

The economy of Venezuela is largely based on the petroleum sector and manufacturing.[16] Revenue from petroleum exports accounts for more than 50% of the country's GDP and roughly 95% of total exports (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Venezuela)

Saudi Arabia may go broke before the US oil industry buckles (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/oilprices/11768136/Saudi-Arabia-may-go-broke-before-the-US-oil-industry-buckles.html)

Economic warfare limits the $ that a country can earn in order to buy the food it needs. The production of food hasn't changed, just the value.

Like the value of dairy produce - but they still keep right on producing milk - at a loss ffs - sooner rather than later this is gonna hurt! :eek:

Dear Mr Putin - we have these tonnes of milk powder to trade with you but Mr Obama says we must not deal with you - fuck Obama the lying cunt! - lets deal! :niceone:

Brian d marge

10th August 2015, 14:56

Like the value of dairy produce - but they still keep right on producing milk - at a loss ffs - sooner rather than later this is gonna hurt! :eek:

Dear Mr Putin - we have these tonnes of milk powder to trade with you but Mr Obama says we must not deal with you - fuck Obama the lying cunt! - lets deal! :niceone:
We used to do that

I had a lada 4wd from the last time we shipped some milk

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Ocean1

10th August 2015, 15:13

COme on .. that is so patently untrue ...

Sure the western world is eating more than ever .. but the rest of the world is not ..

And the prevalence of socialism/communism in the western world is?

Ocean1

10th August 2015, 15:19

COme on .. that is so patently untrue ...

Sure the western world is eating more than ever .. but the rest of the world is not ..

is it lack of food or lack of money to pay for it?

Wherever there's a modicum of market freedom it's the same thing.

I'll take option B Bob...

The economy of Venezuela is largely based on the petroleum sector and manufacturing.[16] Revenue from petroleum exports accounts for more than 50% of the country's GDP and roughly 95% of total exports (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Venezuela)

Saudi Arabia may go broke before the US oil industry buckles (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/oilprices/11768136/Saudi-Arabia-may-go-broke-before-the-US-oil-industry-buckles.html)

Economic warfare limits the $ that a country can earn in order to buy the food it needs. The production of food hasn't changed, just the value.

Actually, the production of food has never been higher, and the number of hungry has plummeted over the last few years: http://ourworldindata.org/data/food-agriculture/hunger-and-undernourishment/

What's changed is the price of the exports Venezuela relies on. If there's a lesson there for us it's "don't put all of your revenue eggs into one commodity basket".

That, and keep the state's sticky fingers out of businesses responsible for the national revenue stream.

Ocean1

10th August 2015, 15:24

Didnt I point this out , like ages ago ...

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/140713-Stupid-World?p=1130880736#post1130880736

And here was me thinking you were pointing out the fuckwitedness of borrowing money you don't intend to repay and blowing it all on booze and hookers... Repeatedly.

mashman

10th August 2015, 16:44

That, and keep the state's sticky fingers out of businesses responsible for the national revenue stream.

:killingme :crybaby: :killingme responsible business :killingme :crybaby: :killingme

Brian d marge

10th August 2015, 18:09

And here was me thinking you were pointing out the fuckwitedness of borrowing money you don't intend to repay and blowing it all on booze and hookers... Repeatedly.
Ya busted me

Fair cop guv

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Brian d marge

10th August 2015, 18:11

And the prevalence of socialism/communism in the western world is?
Quite common

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Brian d marge

10th August 2015, 18:15

Wherever there's a modicum of market freedom it's the same thing.

Actually, the production of food has never been higher, and the number of hungry has plummeted over the last few years: http://ourworldindata.org/data/food-agriculture/hunger-and-undernourishment/

What's changed is the price of the exports Venezuela relies on. If there's a lesson there for us it's "don't put all of your revenue eggs into one commodity basket".

That, and keep the state's sticky fingers out of businesses responsible for the national revenue stream.

Nothing to do with Exxon and the manipulation of those markets

But you are right about this bit

A diversified market . .society is a lot stonger and healthier

Hows aucklands super city going these days

Snip
lesson there for us it's "don't put all of your revenue eggs into one commodity basket".

That, and keep the state's sticky fingers out of businesses responsible for the national revenue stream.

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Ocean1

10th August 2015, 19:02

Quite common

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Not convinced. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_socialist_states

Brian d marge

10th August 2015, 19:42

Not convinced. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_socialist_states
You do know what a socialist is . . .

Not the ones that called themselves socialist
but have a glorious leader such as UNZUD

Now not saying that someone has been saying something along the lines of the following for some time and I dont want him to get too excited but . . .

Snip, . . In political and social sciences, communism (from Latin communis – common, universal)[1][2] is a social, political, and economic ideology and movement whose ultimate goal is the establishment of the communist society, which is a socioeconomic order structured upon the common ownership of the means of production, absence of social classes, money,[3][4] and the state.[5][6]

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Ocean1

10th August 2015, 19:44

You do know what a socialist is . . .

Aye. Synonymous with Fuckwit.

Brian d marge

10th August 2015, 19:49

Aye. Synonymous with Fuckwit.
David Cameron is a socialist

Damn I never knew

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Voltaire

10th August 2015, 20:31

Hows aucklands super city going these days

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Pretty good, I've used the electric trains a few times to go to the office in town from home.
Lots of good food places around the old Chief Post Office, used to work there in the early 80's now its a train station.
I've gone from a $200K house to a $800K without moving, its still a horrible un-insulated 50's bungalow. Rates are now $2500 a year, but hey Len needs it to fund his underground.
Once Sh16 tunnel is finished there will be an extra couple of hundred car spaces on the roads.
Thanks for asking.<_<

Brian d marge

10th August 2015, 21:13

Pretty good, I've used the electric trains a few times to go to the office in town from home.
Lots of good food places around the old Chief Post Office, used to work there in the early 80's now its a train station.
I've gone from a $200K house to a $800K without moving, its still a horrible un-insulated 50's bungalow. Rates are now $2500 a year, but hey Len needs it to fund his underground.
Once Sh16 tunnel is finished there will be an extra couple of hundred car spaces on the roads.
Thanks for asking.<_<
See the employed the same city/social planner then
Icarus son of Daedalus

All should be fine then

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oldrider

10th August 2015, 21:21

Pretty good, I've used the electric trains a few times to go to the office in town from home.
Lots of good food places around the old Chief Post Office, used to work there in the early 80's now its a train station.
I've gone from a $200K house to a $800K without moving, its still a horrible un-insulated 50's bungalow. Rates are now $2500 a year, but hey Len needs it to fund his underground.
Once Sh16 tunnel is finished there will be an extra couple of hundred car spaces on the roads.
Thanks for asking.<_<

I was based in Auckland during the late 1950's/early 60's - Then Mayor, Sir Dovemyer Robinson was trying to implement plans to counter Auckland's problems then!

That's how backward Aucklanders are - only just catching up now - and dragging their arse as usual! - Nice area though - spoiled by too many self interest people!

Voltaire

10th August 2015, 21:24

See the employed the same city/social planner then
Icarus son of Daedalus

All should be fine then

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Oh and NZ's first 'dry' bar opened a few weeks back, closed last weekend due to lack of patronage.

Voltaire

10th August 2015, 21:32

I was based in Auckland during the late 1950's/early 60's - Then Mayor, Sir Dovemyer Robinson was trying to implement plans to counter Auckland's problems then!

That's how backward Aucklanders are - only just catching up now - and dragging their arse as usual! - Nice area though - spoiled by too many self interest people!

Was reading in the paper..well the screen, that there is a drift of head offices to Auckland from Wellington, with the average house now nearing a million who would move here?

Still when China has its 1929 things will change.

Brian d marge

10th August 2015, 21:41

Oh and NZ's first 'dry' bar opened a few weeks back, closed last weekend due to lack of patronage.
It was fire bombed I hope

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Brian d marge

10th August 2015, 22:31

Was reading in the paper..well the screen, that there is a drift of head offices to Auckland from Wellington, with the average house now nearing a million who would move here?

Still when China has its 1929 things will change.
That called urban drift

Jim Mora on national radio had a guest on about it a few years ago
Basically the computer has made info easier to crunch and theres a lot more of it so that tends to consentrate people . . Which then snowballs and you get tokyo london but not Ranfurly
So you see the hollowing out of countries

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oldrider

10th August 2015, 23:00

When the big drift North occurred I got a bit lost and drifted South - male female ratio suited my needs and I got married - been here ever since! :love:

Brian d marge

11th August 2015, 00:35

Oh and NZ's first 'dry' bar opened a few weeks back, closed last weekend due to lack of patronage.
http://metro.co.uk/2015/08/10/new-zealands-first-booze-free-bar-forced-to-close-after-just-five-weeks-because-no-one-showed-up-5334958/

Silly silly people

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bogan

11th August 2015, 08:02

http://metro.co.uk/2015/08/10/new-zealands-first-booze-free-bar-forced-to-close-after-just-five-weeks-because-no-one-showed-up-5334958/

Silly silly people

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$15 cover seems a little steep.

mashman

11th August 2015, 11:48

"the next generation of social movements will be a hybrid between a social movement and a political party. " - Micah White.

Sounds like a smart fulla.

Voltaire

11th August 2015, 12:52

"the next generation of social movements will be a hybrid between a social movement and a political party. " - Micah White.

Sounds like a smart fulla.

Sort of like how Lenin started off, bit of rioting, bit of crowd pleasing, bit of overseas funding and viola.

I like the idea rather than the current system of Party Hacks getting to run the country by a process of boring meetings, and public apathy.

Banditbandit

11th August 2015, 12:57

"the next generation of social movements will be a hybrid between a social movement and a political party. " - Micah White.

Sounds like a smart fulla.

Sounds like pseudo-sociological bullshit ...

Currently social movements tend to morph into lobby groups, whch then tend to set up political parties ..

mashman

11th August 2015, 13:10

Sort of like how Lenin started off, bit of rioting, bit of crowd pleasing, bit of overseas funding and viola.

I like the idea rather than the current system of Party Hacks getting to run the country by a process of boring meetings, and public apathy.

Could be, don't really care too much for how they did things in the past coz it's a brave new world today.

heh, I doubt it'd be that much different in the short term as playing the system against itself means playing the system under the same rules. Which whilst a bugga, democracy could actually win in the end ;).

Sounds like pseudo-sociological bullshit ...

Currently social movements tend to morph into lobby groups, which then tend to set up political parties ..

lol... well him and his mate Kalle are the originators of Occupy and they have a realistic take on its effectiveness, so whilst it may look like bullshit, he seems to have touched upon something that people want.

I thought that was the point he was making?

Ocean1

11th August 2015, 13:18

oldrider

11th August 2015, 13:20

lol... well him and his mate Kalle are the originators of Occupy and they have a realistic take on its effectiveness, so whilst it may look like bullshit, he seems to have touched upon something that people want.

Well they were claiming to represent the 99% - sounds like a majority to me - but was that a true claim? - it appears they got the 1% right! :baby:

mashman

11th August 2015, 13:20

But... apathy is a resource, innit?

Yes it is... and it comes with a fuckload of population control methods and mechanisms too, all of which can be used for the power of good for a change.

mashman

11th August 2015, 13:23

Well they were claiming to represent the 99% - sounds like a majority to me - but was that a true claim? - it appears they got the 1% right! :baby:

heh, it was a catchy slogan and it gave birth to some stunning enterprises that help mercans from debt write-offs to reclaiming houses to disaster relief etc... something awoke a few anyway.

oldrider

11th August 2015, 14:15

heh, it was a catchy slogan and it gave birth to some stunning enterprises that help mercans from debt write-offs to reclaiming houses to disaster relief etc... something awoke a few anyway.

There are lots of people calling for an awakening but nobody seems to ever listen: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xv8XB3qE8JM - (at least worth a listen).

Listening is for free and while we can still decide for ourselves what is true - it can be fun! - The alternative to free thinking might be closer than we know? :shifty:

That old 1% just keeps on keeping on popping up everywhere - little changes here and there but the core theme remains true - need greed and control. :yes:

The other 99% of us just keep on complaining and passively resisting and generally doing exactly what the 1% want us to do = nothing! :wacko: A perfect plan indeed!

mashman

11th August 2015, 14:25

There are lots of people calling for an awakening but nobody seems to ever listen: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xv8XB3qE8JM - (at least worth a listen).

Listening is for free and while we can still decide for ourselves what is true - it can be fun! - The alternative to free thinking might be closer than we know? :shifty:

That old 1% just keeps on keeping on popping up everywhere - little changes here and there but the core theme remains true - need greed and control. :yes:

The other 99% of us just keep on complaining and passively resisting and generally doing exactly what the 1% want us to do = nothing! :wacko: A perfect plan indeed!

All very disappointingly true... yet that people are ready and calling for some form change means that all they need is something that offers that change. I know, yes know, that they're waiting for a Resource Based Economy whether they know it or not yet. I know this, because I've been waiting too with similar aspirations and hesitations... and NOW, heh, that I know, it's time to pass it on :wari:. Time to find out for sure :D

Voltaire

11th August 2015, 14:37

But... apathy is a resource, innit?

It probably the greatest resource for politics.
I remember being at a stop work meeting once in Sydney and the Union Delegate waffled on and on and on till a lot of the workers got bored and went home/to the pub and then held the vote which the hard core passed.

Unlike Mashmash I don't see any radical social change on the horizon, usually need a large war for that.

mashman

11th August 2015, 14:48

Unlike Mashmash I don't see any radical social change on the horizon, usually need a large war for that.

Jeremy Corbyn romping to Labour leadership victory, says new poll (https://uk.news.yahoo.com/jeremy-corbyn-labour-victory-car-crash-says-alastair-170043633.html#ZaEmaRs)

"The latest signs of a serious challenge by Mr Corbyn came after Tony Blair's former spin doctor Alastair Campbell warned victory for the one-time rank outsider would be a "car crash"." :blip:

oldrider

11th August 2015, 15:19

Brian d marge

11th August 2015, 15:27

coz it's a brave new world today.

?

I still do it the old fashioned way and if the test tube broke

You could do yourself an injury [emoji33]

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Voltaire

11th August 2015, 15:54

Jeremy Corbyn romping to Labour leadership victory, says new poll (https://uk.news.yahoo.com/jeremy-corbyn-labour-victory-car-crash-says-alastair-170043633.html#ZaEmaRs)

"The latest signs of a serious challenge by Mr Corbyn came after Tony Blair's former spin doctor Alastair Campbell warned victory for the one-time rank outsider would be a "car crash"." :blip:

I haven't bothered keeping up with British Politics since the election but one of the comments was pretty goo.

Jonathan • 12 hours ago Report Abuse

Politics should be about doing the right things for the whole country, not about picking the right person to help get a party into power. Good objective policies should rule and parties and personalities should simply be judged on how they choose and deliver those policies. British politics could be better with some tweaks - like no unbalanced lobbying or payments to parties for a start. Too many hidden or vested interests in the system. A healthy perfect market based economy that does not build up huge imbalances like before the credit crunch, requires perfect information and reactions. Basic A-level economics. Shame most of the political leaders Blair, Brown etc. didn't have that qualification. Also all the institutions were in cahoots and had their noses too deep in the trough to see or want to see the impending tidal wave of debt, that we are now lumbered with for the next 50-100 yrs. Cannot believe they all got off so lightly and no one was imprisoned or punished properly for wilful recklessness. Makes a mockery and ensures it will happen again. We must be a bunch of zombified sheep to accept this.

Shame thats how politics works, just look at the Donald Trump palava , all that money being spent and the idiots who think he would make a good Pressie...
I'd vote for that lady he was giving a hard time .

Brian d marge

11th August 2015, 16:48

I haven't bothered keeping up with British Politics since the election but one of the comments was pretty goo.

Shame thats how politics works, just look at the Donald Trump palava , all that money being spent and the idiots who think he would make a good Pressie...
I'd vote for that lady he was giving a hard time .
Donald trump

Self funded

There is a chance he may not have any puppet masters behind him

Sad but . . .

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Tazz

11th August 2015, 17:03

Donald trump

Self funded

There is a chance he may not have any puppet masters behind him

Sad but . . .

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I think he's the type of guy you'd hope had someone smarter pulling strings in the background....

oldrider

11th August 2015, 17:06

I think he's the type of guy you'd hope had someone smarter pulling strings in the background....

Like "all" the rest have! :lol:

mashman

11th August 2015, 17:10

That will be as exciting and fruitful as the exchange of Obama (first black man) and Hillary Clinton (first woman) as president of the USA! (Israel and the world) :wait:

Thing is, if the come from nowhere can become PM, so can anyone with aspirations of changing things ;). Shame it's another 5 years away.

I still do it the old fashioned way and if the test tube broke

You could do yourself an injury [emoji33]

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I don't like the sounds of that.

I haven't bothered keeping up with British Politics since the election but one of the comments was pretty goo.

Shame thats how politics works, just look at the Donald Trump palava , all that money being spent and the idiots who think he would make a good Pressie...
I'd vote for that lady he was giving a hard time .

I only do it to see what's in store for NZ 5/10 years down the track.

Ach I'm hoping Donald wins it, if for no other reason than similarly to the one mentioned to oldrider above. But yeah, nothing's changed in regards to the outcomes of an election as that guy says and unfortunately I reckon we've heard the same thing for far too long. Would really really love to find out how many others have heard it all before way too many times and wouldn't mind considering something different for a change.
I'm sure those words would have her chucking up quite violently... but agreed, she's might purdy and likely has a sex tape somewhere.

Voltaire

11th August 2015, 17:52

I think he's the type of guy you'd hope had someone smarter pulling strings in the background....

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Tazz again.:lol:

Banditbandit

12th August 2015, 11:12

Ach I'm hoping Donald wins it,

Fuck Me ... he is scarey ... he's crazy enough to push the Big Button and send us all into Nuclear Holocaust ...

mashman

12th August 2015, 12:41

Fuck Me ... he is scarey ... he's crazy enough to push the Big Button and send us all into Nuclear Holocaust ...

heh... I call it cutting to the chase :laugh:

Akzle

12th August 2015, 20:11

Unlike Mashmash I don't see any radical social change on the horizon, usually need a large war for that.

errr.... take your pick eh? arabs, china?, the sheepulation.... all are at war, whether they know it or not.

Laava

12th August 2015, 20:17

Ash I'm hoping Donald wins it.

Funnily enough, here is the only clown NOT running for the job!
http://images.vectorhq.com/images/previews/649/ronald-mcdonald-psd-449458.png

Voltaire

12th August 2015, 21:08

errr.... take your pick eh? arabs, china?, the sheepulation.... all are at war, whether they know it or not.

No I meant proper wars like dubbya dubba 2, Arab ones are just proxy wars to keep the arms industries ticking over and oil prices down.

mashman

12th August 2015, 23:49

Funnily enough, here is the only clown NOT running for the job!
Ronald Maccas

Donald and Ronald. Sounds awesome, but they've already had a clown (could be the same guy, excellent actor) called Ronald as pres before... peeps'd never fall for the same thing twice.

mashman

14th August 2015, 21:35

Camila Batmanghelidgh is right - it’s time to see the child and change the system (https://www.thersa.org/discover/publications-and-articles/rsa-blogs/2015/08/kids-company/)

mashman

18th August 2015, 17:34

Oh dear... something I always wanted :wari:

http://kapimananews.realviewdigital.com/#folio=1

Brian d marge

18th August 2015, 18:25

http://kapimananews.realviewdigital.com/global/mobilesite/mobilearticle.aspx?iid=126035#story-item

These should be expanded

If it was jk idea then more power to him
The ones in korea are bloody fanstastic
NZ being better than korea scenery wise imho

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mashman

29th August 2015, 10:09

Most excellent talk covering, well, lots of things.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UtvrYosMS6U

husaberg

29th August 2015, 10:22

Most excellent talk covering, well, lots of things.

I opened it but didn't watch, its bloody over 2 hours Mashy. I have no doubt it covers a lot of things in 2 bloody hours.
Do a poll asking if people will it though a Youtube video over 2 hours without some tatytays

mashman

29th August 2015, 16:48

I opened it but didn't watch, its bloody over 2 hours Mashy. I have no doubt it covers a lot of things in 2 bloody hours.
Do a poll asking if people will it though a Youtube video over 2 hours without some tatytays

Like I said, there's lots covered ;).

husaberg

29th August 2015, 17:34

Like I said, there's lots covered ;).

If there was at least cleavage, it would need to be only semi covered. If there was taytays there would need to be no dialog at all.:rolleyes:

Brian d marge

29th August 2015, 19:45

If there was at least cleavage, it would need to be only semi covered. If there was taytays there would need to be no dialog at all.:rolleyes:
Everything is better when titties are about

Even the weather

I watched said video and yes lots of good stuff

And if you look carefully a slightly older pair of jubblies can be seen in the background

The video reminded me . . Dont quote but isnt the american tax a volantary payment . . .?

You try not paying it and see what happens

As the vid says its all a giant ponzi scheme and we is being scammed big time

at least with amway the dishwashing liquid is qood value

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husaberg

29th August 2015, 20:24

Everything is better when titties are about

. . Dont quote but isnt the american tax a volantary payment . . .?

See what I did there

Brian d marge

29th August 2015, 21:38

See what I did there

from whom would you like a tax demand from

exhibit a: 315293

or
Exhibit b:
315294

Stephen

btw , Both are Russian

Akzle

30th August 2015, 08:33

from whom would you like a tax demand from

or
Exhibit b:
315294

do i have to declare my motorboat?

Brian d marge

30th August 2015, 15:18

do i have to declare my motorboat?
No but there are subsidies on viagra

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Akzle

30th August 2015, 17:43

No but there are subsidies on viagra

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Viagra is an odd name for a russian lass...

Brian d marge

30th August 2015, 20:54

Viagra is an odd name for a russian lass...
Aunty via will see u right . . .

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mashman

16th September 2015, 07:49

Don’t be fooled by “Inclusive Capitalism” It’s still a disaster! (http://www.rt.com/op-edge/315390-capitalism-inclusive-inequality-economy/)

"The 2015 Conference recently ended with a whimper. So much for “Inclusive Capitalism.” They are having these meetings because they sense their weakness. They are the ones who introduced disaster capitalism to the world; they know that a revolution in the way the masses think and behave could topple them. Now is the time for us to demand systemic change - that is, deep, transformational, second-order change.".

All change...

mashman

20th September 2015, 10:17

Capitalism is a glorious failure

“Lebanon is perhaps one of the most capitalist countries on earth. There is almost nothing public, nothing socialist left here, anymore. And the savage capitalism (always prescribed by the Western ‘partners’ for its client states) in Lebanon, as everywhere in the world, simply does not work. … There is plenty of cash in individual’s pockets and in their bank accounts, but almost no money for basic public services. Lamborghinis and Ferraris are racing at night along Cornish, and the Zaitunay Bay Marina puts its counterpart in Abu Dhabi to shame. But most of the city is polluted, crumbling, and desperate.” (http://www.mintpressnews.com/youstink-lebanese-rise-up-against-the-capitalist-dream-of-privatization/209616/)

"But whether in the name of nationalism or against capitalism, Lebanese, like so many across the region, ambition to live in dignity, free to think, work and pray."... Amen.