Farking boy racers

[MisterD]

Topic still on compulsary insurance? cudn't be bothered reading the whole thing.
that won't physically stop them driving the cars.
its just another law to be broken.

Well if it was run like the uk...no insurance, no rego followed by no rego, no car - it's crushed. That'll physically stop em.

[The Pastor]

Boy racers love one thing just as much as burnouts, braking the law. They love bottling cops and fighting the system. Laws arnt going to stop them. Guns Will. Shoot the basterds.

[Grahameeboy]

Boy racers love one thing just as much as burnouts, braking the law. They love bottling cops and fighting the system. Laws arnt going to stop them. Guns Will. Shoot the basterds.

Yeah lets shoot bikers too......don't they love to speed so breaking the Law.........look shut up will you, it's my turn to speak......

[imdying]

Haven't read the thread, but compulsory insurance scares me. I've never seen it applied in a country where the insurance companies didn't use it as an excuse to rape the consumers.

I also have a desire to own a number of different bikes, I can see compulsory insurance making that an even harder goal.

I'm not sure how compulsory insurance would help? I mean, you need a license (in theory) to drive a car, but that doesn't seem to stop them... I admit that's an assumptution, but the number of boy racers the news report with 'over $10000 in fines', I find it hard to believe they've clocked up that many and still have a license.

All it will do is hurt society collectively, which is ironic given the opposite it supposed to happen. The only thing that will get boy racers off the road is taking their cars. Sure they'll get new cars, but eventually they'll run out of money, so at least they'll only be in cheap slow shit boxes and not 300hp 4wd race cars.

[Ocean1]

Haven't read the thread, but compulsory insurance scares me. I've never seen it applied in a country where the insurance companies didn't use it as an excuse to rape the consumers.

I also have a desire to own a number of different bikes, I can see compulsory insurance making that an even harder goal.

I'm not sure how compulsory insurance would help? I mean, you need a license (in theory) to drive a car, but that doesn't seem to stop them... I admit that's an assumptution, but the number of boy racers the news report with 'over $10000 in fines', I find it hard to believe they've clocked up that many and still have a license.

All it will do is hurt society collectively, which is ironic given the opposite it supposed to happen. The only thing that will get boy racers off the road is taking their cars. Sure they'll get new cars, but eventually they'll run out of money, so at least they'll only be in cheap slow shit boxes and not 300hp 4wd race cars.

Dude the reason overseas personal 3rd part insurance is so expensive isn't because the insurance outfits are creaming it, that's what it genuinely costs to indulge in any given particular activity. The fact that we pay much less in ACC levies is due entirely to the completely artificial market our government imposes. If you doubt the costs really are that high spend some time at your local ED.

Of course any reasonable law will work only if it's effectively enforced. We seem to be failing at enforcement and generating more and more complex legislation to compensate. As has been noted: make the consequences such that the behaviour will improve, anything else is "retaliation", not "correction".

[imdying]

Dude the reason overseas personal 3rd part insurance is so expensive isn't because the insurance outfits are creaming it, that's what it genuinely costs to indulge in any given particular activity. The fact that we pay much less in ACC levies is due entirely to the completely artificial market our government imposes. If you doubt the costs really are that high spend some time at your local ED.

I'm thick, could you please reiterate your point for me Are you saying that you think the cost of someone insuring their vehicle for 3rd party cover will remain the same amount even if it becomes compulsory?

[Ocean1]

I'm thick, could you please reiterate your point for me Are you saying that you think the cost of someone insuring their vehicle for 3rd party cover will remain the same amount even if it becomes compulsory?

Talking about personal insurance, the cost of the risk of damage to people.
The true cost of this risk has no relationship to what you pay by way of ACC coverage when you register a vehicle. The current government mandated ACC scheme is hugely inequitable, it insures an idiot in a WRX at the same cost as a nana in a Corolla. Fact is even the total ACC take from vehicle registration is nowhere near enough to cover automotive related medical costs. The difference is made up from corporate ACC charges and the general health budget.

Typical socialist dogma, there’s no point in taxing those who can’t pay so they tax those who can. Creates an an artificial market, as a consequences there's no link between poor behaviour and it's cost. Or good behaviour and it's rewards for that matter.

[imdying]

So we should get rid of ACC cover for vehicle related accidents as well as bringing in 3rd party cover? And remove the ACC levy from out registration?

[Ocean1]

So we should get rid of ACC cover for vehicle related accidents as well as bringing in 3rd party cover? And remove the ACC levy from out registration?

Should? First decide who should pay for the cost of poor behaviour, work the rest out yourself.

[imdying]

I've seen no figures to support a decision by myself either way, I'm just asking for your opinion.

[Ocean1]

I believe there's a middle ground, where there's room for private personal insurance for those who want or need it, professional drivers come to mind, they've got a higher exposure to risk which perhaps the general public shouldn't be expected to pay for. I also think a state owned or regulated insurance option has a place, both in setting a minimum basic standard and in keeping the private suppliers honest. Ethically whatever systems are made available they should more accurately place the costs of the risk of personal harm where it belongs.

[SPman]

I feel a sneeze coming on.... Ah...ahhhh.....aaahhhhhh....BULLSHIT!!!!!!!

Two words... "sustained' and "deliberate"....

Mum doing a little skiddie on her hillstart does not and never has applied...

Yes, but when it comes to bitter old prick looking out his windows at road, a car spinning its tyres is sure fire evidence of a HOON, whatever the circumstances and they're on the phone faster than a speeding Mitsi Chariot!

[bell]

Of course any reasonable law will work only if it's effectively enforced. We seem to be failing at enforcement and generating more and more complex legislation to compensate. As has been noted: make the consequences such that the behaviour will improve, anything else is "retaliation", not "correction".

This seems to be step in the right direction. Long-ish article, but relevant.

Mind you, I'd happily watch as these idiots were made to start the compactor that contains their vehicles. Oh yes, there would be tears and by golly, it'd be bloody sweet justice.

Hundreds of boy-racer cars seized

5:00AM Tuesday May 22, 2007
By Elizabeth Binning and Juliet Rowan

Scores of cars are being taken off the road from boy-racer hotspots as police crack down on illegal street racing.
Storage depots in the boy-racing meccas of South Auckland, Tauranga and Christchurch are crammed with cars impounded in swoops by police and other authorities.
South Auckland police say they have been seizing more than 50 cars a week since tougher legislation came into effect in May 2003.
The law gives police the power to automatically impound cars for 28 days if they are being driven with unnecessary speed or acceleration or are doing burnouts.
In the past week, Counties-Manukau police seized 76 vehicles. Most were not impounded under the 2003 legislation, but police say cars are often caught during the crackdown on boy-racers.
In Canterbury, police seized 30 vehicles during an operation on Friday and Saturday nights, and in Tauranga, police have made 798 prosecutions for "boy-racer offences" since January 2005.
The Waitemata police district, which covers North Shore, Henderson and Rodney, has impounded 933 vehicles - 46 a week - this year.
Police say the legislation is working well, despite criticism after the death of 20-year-old Scott Finn at an illegal car race in Tauranga on Saturday that not enough is being done.
Sergeant Stu Britnell, the officer in charge of vehicle impounding in Counties-Manukau, said that "up until last Sunday, we had 965 towed in this year".
Most cars were seized from people who drove while forbidden, disqualified or suspended.
Of the 76 vehicles impounded in the week to yesterday, only three were involved in illegal boy-racing.
But Mr Britnell said the law changes had given police more flexibility in getting people off the roads for offences less serious than the previous options of reckless or careless driving.
It also helped to make cars roadworthy, as drivers took necessary remedial action after having to "buy" their car out of the impound yard, he said.
Some cars had been taken in more than once and in one case, a family car had been impounded four times, Mr Britnell said.
Of the prosecutions in Tauranga, 274 were for unauthorised street or drag races, or "sustained loss of traction" - skids and burnouts.
More than 300 vehicles have been impounded.
A bylaw imposing rolling street curfews is expected to be adopted in Tauranga after the weekend death.
Bay of Plenty road policing manager Inspector Kevin Taylor said the boy-racer legislation was "a very effective tool" that police used often.
But they also supported the introduction of bylaws such as that being proposed in Tauranga.
"Under the boy-racer legislation, we have to wait until they've committed an offence, so we play cat and mouse," Mr Taylor said.
"With the bylaws restricting access to a place, we don't have to wait for them to do anything wrong - just being there is a breach of the rules and we can move them on."
Of the cars seized in Canterbury over the weekend, 26 were taken because of unpaid fines and the rest were involved in boy-racer offences.
Canterbury's road policing manager, Inspector Derek Erasmus, said his district had changed its focus on seizing cars in the past few months.
Instead of taking them for 28 days under boy-racer legislation, police took bailiffs with them on operations and if drivers had any outstanding court fines their cars were taken by the courts and later sold.
"A vehicle that's been seized for unpaid fines might also have been subject to a boy-racer offence, but we bow to the court and say, 'While we can seize this car for 28 days, we are going to let you have it because you are going to take it and sell it'."
Mr Erasmus said police had seized 200 cars for the courts in the past couple of months. That compared with 200 last year.
The head of Tauranga's strategic traffic unit, Senior Sergeant Ian Campion, said boy-racers would continue to feel the heat from police as long as they engaged in illegal behaviour. "There will be no let-up by police on this group of people."
He supported the bylaw, saying police needed more power than the boy-racer legislation gave them.
"The legislation is a good tool to use. We just need more tools in our toolbox."

...and another one re CTP insurance: http://www.stuff.co.nz/4068676a10.ht...ories_20070522

[SPman]

I like this take on it -

"See I think that young men and speed have always been a problem, whether it was cars, horses, competitive hot air balloon racing – see there is a little risk taking circuit inbuilt within us all that forces us as a species to take risks, that’s why we are at the top of the evolutionary tree, it is within our nature to take risks, and we take the most amount of risks when we are young, because that’s what we do as human beings, we make mistakes as teenagers – THAT’S HOW WE LEARN. Now that is in no way a defense for young men to smash up public space or crash or kill people, but it is an explanation of the problem we face, and if we are determined to change the problem we have to understand why it happens. It’s all so painfully simple, and this is where the debate needs to start – with that understanding, not the usual ‘bloody boy racers’ nonsense. Exacerbating this truth of human teenage nature are 5 things:

1: Cheap Cars
Young men can get finance at the drop of a hat, they are sucked into the credit culture right from the beginning, probably following mum and dad into credit card debt. With 80% of the population earning less than $30 000, we are an incredibly low wage society with first world consumer addictions. This culture of debt brings with it loan sharks and things can get real ugly at that level of the debt chain. We want to start turning the issue around, crack down on easy cheap money with inanely high interest rates for teenagers.

2: Access to pop culture
We live in a 24/7 digital world, 8 year old kids can watch the fast and the furious, play computer games and generally desensitize reality. We have to accept the massive influences that can swamp young people, I’m not suggesting we attempt to ban the internet or force censorship, with an on line world, Pandora is well and truly out of the box and has moved down the road, happily married with 12 children. What we need to recognize is that parents have to from a very early age explain the clear difference between reality and fiction, which slides nicely into the third exacerbating factor…

3: Father and Son
Dads need to talk to their sons. They have to talk about how to handle those sudden surges and desires and anger and show their sons through their own behaviour. Fathers have to show their sons how to be men by preparing them for those moments where the brain switches off and the hormones take over.

4: Booze
Another exacerbating factor is our insanely accessible booze culture, the problem isn’t lowering the drinking age to 18, it’s that we now sell booze at every dairy corner and supermarket in the country and we don’t police those venders whatsoever. Every year community groups catch out over half the local venders not asking for age ID when a young person buys booze! We have turned on all the taps of accessibility by liberalizing our alcohol laws to a country with an obvious drinking problem and then can’t understand why our teenagers are drink driving.

5: Police
Which brings me to the final exacerbating factor, Police powers. Clayton Cosgrove, that Labour party Union thug who should be in the National Party (they have Police looking thugs) passed a knee jerk bullshit ‘boy racer’ law giving cops extraordinary powers of judge, jury and executioner. Generally speaking liberal western democracies steer clear of letting the separation of powers merge into one, and the resulting immediate roadside impoundment based on the non-challengeable discretion of the police has nothing whatsoever to do with police chases that end miraculously seconds prior to crashes from spooked teenagers attempting to out run an impoundment, and anyone who says otherwise is a communist.

But all that debate didn’t surface at all from John or Paul last night, they seemed much happier to whip the boy racer debate until it became frothy, neither wanted to understand why boy racers raced, they both wanted to be the voice of angry suburban NZ who are awoken at night to the alpha male muffler mating call of the late night neighborhood tom cats, partly worried it is their daughters they are prowling for, partly worried at what that sound might mean to their property valuations.

Meanwhile, the parents of the teenager killed this week buried their dead son"
Bomber
http://tumeke.blogspot.com/

[Grahameeboy]

At end of say we make our own choices in life.

Boy racers do it, so do Bikers.....there is not a lot of difference. Yet here is a thead complaining about the antics of boy racers, like we are angels?

Does not matter how good parenting is, peer pressure is often greater..........but we are really talking about a minority....that is often the way.

I remember posts moaning that the Govt is trying to push Bikers off the road blah blah......seems we are not picked on......

Yes it is sad that this guy died. He knew the risks, like we do riding our bikes...........how many of our parents dissaproved of us when we started riding bikes.....they were not bad parents, we just made our choice.