State Of Fear

[Grahameeboy]

New garage last year....
Old one had downpipes onto the driveway, water flowed down the drive, across the pavement and into the gutter. No problem. Existing use.
New one...can't do that, must pipe it under the pavement to the gutter.
Why?
Because people might get their feet wet.
WTF? It's raining. If they don't want to get wet, they won't be out walking.
That's the rules. Won't be signing off the permit if not done.
Gah!!!

I thought it was illegal to run water across the path anyway.

Okay the reason given does sound petty, however, we all know how tight building / renovation regs are and should double check......

What if the guttering gets dirty / gungy over time and the water becomes gungy and creates a slippery service on the pavement.............doesn't matter how remote, someone could have an accident.

"It's raining. If they don't want to get wet, they won't be out walking"....isn't this impinging on peoples freedom?

[MacD]

Ah, DD...perhaps I wasn't clear enough. The ethos I refer to is that which many/most of us display is the disdain in which we hold the safety nazis etc, who if allowed to continue unfettered could end up controlling every inch of our lives....

Interesting perspective on the KB safety ethos. On one hand riding motorcycles is fundamentally a risky business, yet how many "All the gear all the time" threads are posted on here, or the "I saw somebody riding without gloves" threads? Personally I think there is a strong vein of disapproval regarding people who don't follow the received wisdom regarding safety gear on this site, to the point of threads suggesting boots, jackets and gloves should be made compulsory. I do sometimes wonder if it is a generational shift in perspective, that safety when riding is something that can be imposed from outside, or purchased from a dealer (the leather cocoon syndrome), rather than coming from your own decisions and behaviour?

[Grahameeboy]

Interesting perspective on the KB safety ethos. On one hand riding motorcycles is fundamentally a risky business, yet how many "All the gear all the time" threads are posted on here, or the "I saw somebody riding without gloves" threads? Personally I think there is a strong vein of disapproval regarding people who don't follow the received wisdom regarding safety gear on this site, to the point of threads suggesting boots, jackets and gloves should be made compulsory. I do sometimes wonder if it is a generational shift in perspective, that safety when riding is something that can be imposed from outside, or purchased from a dealer (the leather cocoon syndrome), rather than coming from your own decisions and behaviour?

Which is why I guess we do need the 'so called' Nazi rules.....we do not always know best eh.....and with MSTR and his garage issue, it could have been avoided...

[MSTRS:Me]

"It's raining. If they don't want to get wet, they won't be out walking"....isn't this impinging on peoples freedom?

Rubbish! Nothing stopping them walking, its their choice whether to get wet or not. Need a law banning rain? Watch this space......
If we want a sensible law about properties allowing (something) to exit across a public way, why not one that prevents paddock exits on corners? Have you seen the shit that gets dragged out on the road from those tractor tyres or from Farmer Brown's prize dairy herd? Do you want to corner on that stuff?

[Grahameeboy]

Rubbish! Nothing stopping them walking, its their choice whether to get wet or not. Need a law banning rain? Watch this space......
If we want a sensible law about properties allowing (something) to exit across a public way, why not one that prevents paddock exits on corners? Have you seen the shit that gets dragged out on the road from those tractor tyres or from Farmer Brown's prize dairy herd? Do you want to corner on that stuff?

Yeah but if there is a stream of water across the path they will get soaked feet, not just wet...anyway, it was just a small illustration to deal with your point that I quoted.....agree a cheap one but as you know anything goes with me..

I guess paddock exits are on quieter roads.....but again you can see the road conditions and slow down......

I once went around a corner in Remuera. It was dark and there were new houses being built and there was mud on road from trucks and it had rained...just a wiggle that was all......cannot lawgate everything.

Again, these things are not major

[MSTRS:Me]

.....cannot lawgate everything.

Give it enough time....

Again, these things are not major

Then why enshrine them in (by)law?

[MSTRS:Me]

Interesting perspective on the KB safety ethos. On one hand riding motorcycles is fundamentally a risky business, yet how many "All the gear all the time" threads are posted on here, or the "I saw somebody riding without gloves" threads? Personally I think there is a strong vein of disapproval regarding people who don't follow the received wisdom regarding safety gear on this site, to the point of threads suggesting boots, jackets and gloves should be made compulsory. I do sometimes wonder if it is a generational shift in perspective, that safety when riding is something that can be imposed from outside, or purchased from a dealer (the leather cocoon syndrome), rather than coming from your own decisions and behaviour?

Yes, but apart from the helmet thing, we still have the choice. It is the (increasing) removal of choice that irks me.

[Grahameeboy]

Give it enough time....

Silly

Then why enshrine them in (by)law?

That is the way it is so if it is silly, don't worry about it.

.....................

[Grahameeboy]

Yes, but apart from the helmet thing, we still have the choice. It is the (increasing) removal of choice that irks me.

Choiced is subjective. We still have choices in life and okay some maybe imposed on us but like I said, we then need to decide how it really does affect our daily lifes....like a scale of 1 - 10 and I think we would be surprised how small the issue really is.

I mean take bikes, we all speed knowing that we may get caught but in all probably we will not and if we do, well it's a pain but in 27 years I have spent $1,000 in fines which is not bad value for entertainment........thats about 20 Chelsea home games........

[MSTRS:Me]

If the issues really are that small, then why do we have laws that cover them?

[MSTRS:Me]

Anyway, one can argue the merits of particular laws, whether they are biggies or not. The original point of this thread was to highlight issues raised in the book I read, being that there are a plethora of laws and rules imposed on us by interest groups with an agenda which are not in the public interest and (like the 70kph learners thing) often in retrospect create unforeseen problems, which are worse than the original 'reason' for the law.

[Grahameeboy]

If the issues really are that small, then why do we have laws that cover them?

I agree so don't worry about them....

[Grahameeboy]

Anyway, one can argue the merits of particular laws, whether they are biggies or not. The original point of this thread was to highlight issues raised in the book I read, being that there are a plethora of laws and rules imposed on us by interest groups with an agenda which are not in the public interest and (like the 70kph learners thing) often in retrospect create unforeseen problems, which are worse than the original 'reason' for the law.

I agree the 70k limit is silly but at end of day we still have the choice to abide by it or not...for some they can handle and for some who cannot they will keep to it and no idea what the stats are on offences for breach but cannot be meany eh?

Never read books........another of my Dad's put offs...all his books are about moany things......

[MSTRS:Me]

I agree the 70k limit is silly but at end of day we still have the choice to abide by it or not...

And take the punishment if caught.
Like all laws can be ignored, but at a cost.
Man-made laws are often poorly researched, poorly received and serve little more than to make some interest group feel important.
I suggest you read the book to understand.

[oldrider]

And take the punishment if caught.
Like all laws can be ignored, but at a cost.
Man-made laws are often poorly researched, poorly received and serve little more than to make some interest group feel important.
I suggest you read the book to understand.

We do not need most of these stupid laws of which you speak, what we do need is less laws, more personal responsibility, more personal accountability and above all, an understanding of the consequences of our individual actions or behaviour.

The status quo, government and associated authorities are made up of special interest groups and make laws that punish the majority for the actions of a minority, typical of school teachers, unionists and broken down ministers of religion.

Just watch the way they "deal" to the boy racer fraternity and judge for yourselves. Bloody in my opinion. John.