Road rules

[swbarnett]

But it's the mentality of "what about the really crap drivers"

I've gotta ask - why is everybody worried about crap drivers under a scheme where you're forced to take responsibility for yourself? There are crap drivers on the roads now. Does that worry me? No. Why? Because I look after myself and, so far, have managed to handle a miriad of close calls caused by crap driving without any major cncequences.

The biggest problem with not only todays drivers but todays people is the lack of respect for each other. If that changed this sort of thing would be a breeze.

While I agree with your sentiment I'd like to point out that the reverse is also true. Implement a scheme that demands more respect for our fellow road users and that's what will result.

[dpex]

Mwahahaha, that's the funniest thing I've heard for..for yonks

Maybe, Scum, you have just spent too long gazing at the so-called magic wand of enforcement. But explain to us all how it is that during my five hours of travel last weekend, with not a cop is sight, I saw not one driver do anything stupid.

You and yours weren't out there, doing steely-eyed control. The traffic just flowed, happily.

Explain that, please.

Remember. This was a weekend day. Those are the days when the hopeless and inane take to th highways. Yet the hopeless and inane seemed to have adapted very well to the prevalent conditions, despite there being not a cop in sight.

Please explain how this could be if, in fact, most drivers are capable of simple self-regulation.

[dpex]

Things would change on the thrird day, mark my word.

(it IS New Zealand I'm talking about)

But surely, marking your word would fly in the face of the European experience.

Some small Dutch town started with the idea of leaving best-practice driving to the drivers. Suddenly, the concept blossomed and now at least seven more principalities have adopted the same strategy, and found the same results; ergo, the crash rate drops dramatically.

Is this just luck? Or is it an example of the very first shift away from the politically correct, nanny-state ethic of, "Do as we tell you or we'll visit you with an evil."?

Maybe this is a return to the ideal of saying to folk, 'Hey, cooperation is where it's at.'

I fully appreciate that in your job you confront far more evil than anyone else on this channel. But divide the number of evils which you daily confront, into the population, and you will find that evil is a relatively rare thing, whereas general decency is not.

If ever you get the time and interest, read up a bit on the concepts of anarchy. A concept which has been given a very bad name by the control-freaks. But anarchy is, in fact, the essential 'live and let live' ideal.

In fact the Ten Commandments are the essential ethos within which humans can live, given the opportunity. They propound a simple message. 'Live and let live.'

In my experience, over fifty years of driving and riding, most others I have met on the roads adhere to that concept.

Sure, there are arseholes, but they are few compared to the rest. But the rest do not appreciate being treated like arseholes. That's the bit the Dutch have realised and the bit which traffic-law enforcers in NZ have yet to catch up on.

And so, it seems that in the Dutch experience, when a non-arsehole comes across and arsehole, the non-arsehole is able to chill out and let the arsehole go. The non-arsehole is psychologically enabled to do this because he/she has suddenly been recognised as a person with a brain who can take responsibility, and not simply react; badly.

But hey, Scum, your job relies upon the concept that we arsehole need to be kept in line, so I guess you're reasonably biased.

[dpex]

I've gotta ask - why is everybody worried about crap drivers under a scheme where you're forced to take responsibility for yourself? There are crap drivers on the roads now. Does that worry me? No. Why? Because I look after myself and, so far, have managed to handle a miriad of close calls caused by crap driving without any major cncequences.


While I agree with your sentiment I'd like to point out that the reverse is also true. Implement a scheme that demands more respect for our fellow road users and that's what will result.

This is a bloody good post swbarnett! You nail it exactly. Good on ya, buddy. Keep up the good thinking.

[No FX]

Excellent post Dpex

[dpex]

Jesus H Christ but the concept isn't that hard to grasp. Two words. GIVE WAY.

Forget all the rules and regulations and forget the worst one. That one being 'I HAVE THE RIGHT OF WAY'! So fucking what?

The law says!!! You have the right of way in various circumstances. But why do you have to demand that at every turn of the way?

People; at the top end of intelligence we have men and women who are so far beyond the average brain as to be almost incomprehensible.

At the bottom end we have folk who would embarrass an ape.

So which one of those two is driving the vehicle about to, or capable of, move into your path?

But to our lives, each of these extremes of folk are necessary to us. At the top end they provide magic machines and heart bypasses, whereas at the bottom end they clean our public dunnies. We need each extreme, and all who fall in between.

But how do we pick them, as we ride along, demanding right of way cos the fucking law says we have it, but the dunny-cleaners haven't caught up with the plan.

How do we pick the drunk, or the woman on Prosac, or the guy about to have a heart attack, or the mother who just found her tot in the back seat choking on a string?

Any or all of these three might be to your left at a roundabout. You have right of way. But look! That driver is acting oddly.

What do you do?

Assert, 'Fuck you!' or do you use the Dutch approach of shared space, and simply let the other person go, shake your head in wonder, yet survive?

It takes so little to give way even when you have right on your side.

Have you all ever noticed how, during heavy peak-hour traffic, so many drivers make a space for you to turn left or right? And not a cop in sight.

Why do they do that? They had the right of way!

It's simple cooperation. Take away the 'force' and humans get on.

Yeah. I know. There's always the "What about the...."? There will always be those. The trick is to identify and avoid them, not identify and demand they do right, because they never will.

Give way when you don't have to should be our national driving anthem.

[cheshirecat]

This is a bloody good post swbarnett! You nail it exactly. Good on ya, buddy. Keep up the good thinking.

Absolutely. We could start with driving test which encouraged pride in driving as opposed to treating us like potentially naughty 2 year olds and some road rules which prioritise coherently. like not crossing a centerline unless it is clear, A roads having priority over B roads and so forth. At present someone coming out of a minor donkey track has priority over those turning in from a major A road.

[dpex]

Absolutely. We could start with driving test which encouraged pride in driving as opposed to treating us like potentially naughty 2 year olds and some road rules which prioritise coherently. like not crossing a centerline unless it is clear, A roads having priority over B roads and so forth. At present someone coming out of a minor donkey track has priority over those turning in from a major A road.

It's an interesting posit, Chesh, but one which is a bit of the fifties, unless the gov picks up the gauntlet and allows personal responsibility to succeed.

Back in the fifties, when I was a kid, just owning a car meant you had to know how to repair everything in it. Our pride was not just in the driving, but knowing 'what' we were driving. How it worked. It's limitations, etc.

All that's gone now. Folk get into a mobile hush-puppy and not only expect but demand it works.

Folk have been disconnected from the mechanics of what they drive. They now just drive and expect.

So let's all assume that some/most/many of them haven't got a clue about the mechanics or dynamics of the hush-puppy in which they rave around the highways and byways.

What's wrong with assuming that and acting accordingly?

It's called intelligent cooperation.

[dpex]

Didja catch any fish?

Yeah, as a matter of fact. Caught about ten. Released eight and kept two, very healthy (till I whacked them) 4 pounders.

[scumdog]

Maybe, Scum, you have just spent too long gazing at the so-called magic wand of enforcement. But explain to us all how it is that during my five hours of travel last weekend, with not a cop is sight, I saw not one driver do anything stupid.

You and yours weren't out there, doing steely-eyed control. The traffic just flowed, happily.

Explain that, please.

Remember. This was a weekend day. Those are the days when the hopeless and inane take to th highways. Yet the hopeless and inane seemed to have adapted very well to the prevalent conditions, despite there being not a cop in sight.

Please explain how this could be if, in fact, most drivers are capable of simple self-regulation.

I bet all scientist are cringing at your long-term analysis of the problem.....

Look, I could also but won't tell you of the number of times that when I'm not on duty I've seen all manner of dangerous shit by all manner of people when there's no cop around - just the sight of a cop though smartens up the driving behaviour.

Or the time when taking off on a green light a twat in an old Corolla wagon ran a red "no-right-turn", cut across my bows and got ploughed into.

Or the time...

If the driver behaviour was as good as you say all the time *555 would be obsolete by now.




(Just in case other thought you were serious....)

[Katman]

'Nar! Not possible,' I hear the Katmans yell. 'All drivers are bad arses, just waiting to jump the ropes.

I truly wonder sometimes at the lack of comprehension skills that some KBers display.

[Drew]

I truly wonder sometimes at the lack of comprehension skills that some KBers display.

I have to post, to subscribe to this thread, so I'll jump on this comment.


Dont take shit personally on here for the love of god!

Perhaps if you approached it with an even tone, and treated people like they would understand, your message would be better recieved. Instead of shouting it at us dumb fucks because yours is the right way, we should all conform without understanding, because we cant.

[bogan]

'Nar! Not possible,' I hear the Katmans yell. 'All drivers are bad arses, just waiting to jump the ropes.

Katmans, you mean theres more than one everybody knows there can be only one Katman php server code dictates this

On topic though, It seems they hypotheticals are being thrown about quite happily, but the way i sees it. Theres only one NZ, we are of a unique demographic, so theres only one place where this system can be truly evaluated for us. It must be tried here to be properly evaluated, so the question becomes,
How can we get some small scale testing of these idea's implemented in new zealand?

[Katman]

Dont take shit personally on here for the love of god!

My apologies Drew.

It must have been the use of the word 'Katman' that confused me.

[MarkH]

I have to post, to subscribe to this thread

?????

Can't you just click on 'thread tools' near the top and then click on 'subscribe to this thread'?