Slagging off partners or spouses or parents

[Mekk]

Ahh yes, but you did, because you used the phrase "old cunts".

I used it in quotes because it was The Stranger's phrasing, not mine.

Some "old cunts" find the phrase offensive when delivered by someone they've not ever met in real life (tm).

Do those same "old cunts" get offended by their own phrasing?

[Headbanger]

Why is it unreasonable to expect to be treated with decency and courtesy online?
It shouldn't be!

You can expect anything you like, Doesn't mean its going to work out that way, Or that your expectations are to govern everybody else. I'm sure my limits are different from many others, whose to say who should set the tone?

Well, The admins and moderators have the final say of course, But everyone is free to come and go as they please, There have been many many forums I have visited and then moved on as they were just not for me, I never considered staying and trying to force the place to my expectations of what it should be.

[SixPackBack]

Ahh yes, but you did, because you used the phrase "old cunts".

You also argued that "old cunts" should expect to be called tards and not get annoyed.

Some "old cunts" find the phrase offensive when delivered by someone they've not ever met in real life (tm).

Show me something more desirable and usefull than a cunt?

[Mekk]

I dont say anything on the internet that i wouldnt say to your face .. ask anyone thats met me

Look, I'm happy for you. Are you going to deny that there is a level of anonymity present on the internet?

And if there was a level of anonymity (pending your answer), that it would maybe affect the way people act and that it may even be different from face-to-face communication?

[Kickaha]

I only have one big sleep left before being able to access the treasury that is PD.

You'll fuck that up within a day or two though

[James Deuce]

Show me something more desirable and usefull than a cunt?

Good teeth.

[James Deuce]

Look, I'm happy for you. Are you going to deny that there is a level of anonymity present on the internet?

And if there was a level of anonymity (pending your answer), that it would maybe affect the way people act and that it may even be different from face-to-face communication?

That depends entirely on the individual undertaking the communication and the recipient of the communication. Anyone using the media as an excuse for poor behaviour is simply either immature or unpleasant.

If you are bereft of the cojones to say it to someone's face then don't type it. Especially on a biker forum site for a country with the population of a medium sized European city. 2 degrees of separation in NZ on a general basis. Every KB member will have a maximum degree of separation of 1. I've never understood the lippy psuedo-tough guy crap dished out on KB given that you may find that the person you just met and are now sharing a genial coffee in some tiny, open fire warmed cafe in middle of nowhere with might actually be the psycho dishing out small minded abuse about your family members from behind the "safety" of a keyboard.

The individual dishing out the abuse has a problem, not the "Internet" or a supposed Internet-wide culture of smack talk.

[James Deuce]

I used it in quotes because it was The Stranger's phrasing, not mine.

That isn't permission. The Stranger has earned that particular turn of phrase as a long-standing member of NZ Motorcycling in general. KB is a small part of what Noel contributes to NZ motorcyclists overall.

Do those same "old cunts" get offended by their own phrasing?

Dunno. Ask them. I certainly don't go out of my way to annoy them, citing my own disrespect as an excuse for hiding behind offensive patois.

[Mom]

Are you going to deny that there is a level of anonymity present on the internet?

Now that is a silly question. Of course there is anonymity on the world wide web. While this forum uses the www to exist, do not for one tiny moment think you have the same degree of anonymity on here as you might do on other forums/social networking sites. New Zealand is a tiny little country and KB is a tiny, little forum.


The stats show we have around 16000 members, with active members 4,554 in the past 60 days. Try telling me that is an anonymous place to hurl abuse from.

[Mekk]

Especially on a biker forum site for a country with the population of a medium sized European city. 2 degrees of separation in NZ on a general basis. Every KB member will have a maximum degree of separation of 1. I've never understood the lippy psuedo-tough guy crap dished out on KB given that you may find that the person you just met and are now sharing a genial coffee in some tiny, open fire warmed cafe in middle of nowhere with might actually be the psycho dishing out small minded abuse about your family members from behind the "safety" of a keyboard.

The fact that KB is not limited to people in New Zealand renders that irrelevant. New Zealand may be the size of a medium-sized European city but the internet is not.

The individual dishing out the abuse has a problem, not the "Internet" or a supposed Internet-wide culture of smack talk.

The nature of the internet makes it far easier for people like that to go about their attacks/abuse. It also allows people that wouldn't normally abuse people offline, the opportunity to be an asshole without consequence and thus it should be expected.

Their reasons for participating in flame wars/abuse are their own but it cannot be denied that it is made easier by the internet.

[Mekk]

That isn't permission. The Stranger has earned that particular turn of phrase as a long-standing member of NZ Motorcycling in general. KB is a small part of what Noel contributes to NZ motorcyclists overall.

I wasn't looking for "permission", I was linking his terms to my ideas while remaining detached from the actual words in case they distracted from my argument.

Now that is a silly question. Of course there is anonymity on the world wide web. While this forum uses the www to exist, do not for one tiny moment think you have the same degree of anonymity on here as you might do on other forums/social networking sites. New Zealand is a tiny little country and KB is a tiny, little forum.

Of course it was a silly question, SARGE seemed to think that because he talks the same way online as he does offline, that everybody does.

Don't be naive. What proof do you have that I am even in New Zealand? Sure, smart guys can check my IP and whatnot, but what difference would that make if I was in Spain?

[Hans]

If you slag your partner in public, the first question I'll be asking myself will be ''so why are you with them?'' My old man taught me not to ever complain about my dog or my wife. Your partner is supposed to be the person closest to you, right? Why should I be friends with someone who doesn't show loyalty to their partner? Do you think they'll be loyal to their friends?

[Bass]

The fact that KB is not limited to people in New Zealand renders that irrelevant.

I disagree. You are of course technically correct but the fact remains that the vast majority of KB members do actually reside in NZ and so all the comments that have been made about the likelihood of face to face encounters with someone that has been "slagged off" are correct for all practical purposes.

The nature of the internet makes it far easier for people like that to go about their attacks/abuse. It also allows people that wouldn't normally abuse people offline, the opportunity to be an asshole without consequence and thus it should be expected.

Their reasons for participating in flame wars/abuse are their own but it cannot be denied that it is made easier by the internet.

Again, I guess that you are technically correct. However, what rubs me up the wrong way is your inference is that because it is commonplace, it is therefore acceptable. (I grant that you have not said this explicitly, but it is definitely inferred.)
To many of us (perhaps even most) it simply is not acceptable.
Burglary and sexual assault are also commonplace in NZ. Sexual assault in particular has about the same risk of consequences as slagging someone on the net, if the stats are reliable.
I don't imagine that you would argue that they should be acceptable.

[The Stranger:Me]

We're seeing hordes of people "just discovering" the internet thanks to the likes of youtube and facebook.

Most of the older userbase are trying to establish order or expect to be treated the same as they would offline. They haven't grown up with it or gone through the early phases so they are having a hard time coming to grips with what people will say and do when they can be anonymous.

It's a lolocaust.

Because there's the element of anonymity as well as distance from the people you're interacting with. People can say what they like without the same consequences of the real world (ie, a slap).

The problem with enforcing strict politeness policies and whatnot, you risk interfering with the very attraction and "essence" of the internet.

Gotsta find a balance!

If a lot of people say you are wrong, does this make you wrong?
Of course not. But it does raise 2 possibilities that you should consider.
1) You are wrong
2) You really fucked up on the communication of your ideas.
On that basis.

I would guess that what you were trying to say in the first quote is actually what you said in the second one.
If so see 2 above, if not see 1 above




"The problem with enforcing strict politeness policies and whatnot, you risk interfering with the very attraction and "essence" of the internet."

And the downside would be?
KB operates on a set of rules and this has caused what problems?

[Mekk]

I disagree. You are of course technically correct but the fact remains that the vast majority of KB members do actually reside in NZ and so all the comments that have been made about the likelihood of face to face encounters with someone that has been "slagged off" are correct for all practical purposes.

Well we're not talking about the vast majority of users slagging people off, are we?

There's nothing to stop you from maintaining an anonymous profile on here even if you do reside in New Zealand. You don't have to know someone here and you don't even have to like bikes to join.

This is largely a digression anyway, the point is that it is easier to say without consequence and thus should be expected.

I don't imagine that you would argue that they should be acceptable.

The inference is misplaced. I am arguing that you shouldn't jump up and down about it when there are easy ways to ignore it/block it that have been in place for years.

Why get upset about what an anonymous person/bot says about you or your family? Nobody gets upset about spam e-mails telling them to enlarge their cock, do they?

Trolling thrives on attention, you're only adding fuel to the fire.