Not allowed to hand out BikersAgainstACCLevies pamphlet at CHCH Biketoberfest

[Conquiztador]

Chris Elles

Hi Chris

Earlier in the piece I stated that I have never dealt with RT or your insurance mate. Nothing you have written has made me change my mind, in fact sofar you have made me very comfortable re my earlier decision. And why, you might ask, is that?

Here:
- A chap who is concerned re the proposed ACC levy increase did see an opportunity to spread the message at your "function" in his own time. And was told you did not want him there doing it. Does not make any sense to me. I would have thought that you, if you really agree with this stance, would have applauded his efforts. The only reason I could think is that you were concerned that it was taking away the focus from your customers.
- Sofar you have tried to get us to be symphatetic towards your business and all the hard work that has been done to run this event. Free advertising anyone?
- I sense an effort to try to talk your self out of a poorly handled situation. I have a better idea: Why not just admit that you fucked up and apologise? Takes a big man...
- I think you missjudged the size of this. And I think the reason for that is that you have been to busy thinking about the ones with the big wallets. And IF ACC is in bed with you then you really need to state what is going on.

The only thing I recon you can do is prove to us that you are serious about your stance here. Tell us, what are you doing about the issue?

But you can also do an ostrich and hope it all goes away...

[vstrom]

The holy er than thou Acc grizlers on this thread are probobly the sort of tossers that gate crash a party and want to put there own music on ,did not get to bike fest but well done rolling thunder and all the other dealers,clubs etc ,there is a minority on this site that hides behind the vale of animinty and throws a heap of shit, i mean whats danger barstards agender, get over yourself i reckon you must be one of them little hoody wearing pricks slouched in the front seat of a cage

[Hitcher]

At times there's no harm in admitting that one made a bad call and would do something differently if confronted with the same circumstances in the future.

At times there's no harm in apologising, if not for doing something wrong, then for upsetting people unnecessarily.

[cowboyz]

ok.. you posted while I was typing....

I can see your point about not involving the public on issues that are facing bikers today. I can see the reasoning behind not wanting to voice something that might upset some people.

Totally disagree. but can see your view.

On to the ... what was ACC role in bikefest? This is what I am really intereseted in as someone who pays far too much to ACC with no return.. I am very interested what they are spending their (hah ha my) money on.

[sleemanj]

If the dude was handing out on private property, then ok fair enough to ask him to move off the private property if you don't like it.

If he was also told not to do so on public property, that's pretty naff.

[Ixion]

Have a look at the Biketoberfest.co.nz website to get an idea of the list of businesses and clubs involved in the organization of the event.

We collectively decided that while ACC levies would likely be the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and last topic of conversation for motorcyclists on the day, b we created the event to celebrate motorcycling and to promote a positive image for motorcycling amongst the 99% non-riding community.

When I spoke with chch_zed he was just down from Casbolt's, next to the Trials Rider Display in Ross Galt's parking lot filled with lots of non-riding members of the public.

We asked him to stop........

We very carefully shared our concerns about what he was doing and specifically why as the organizers had discussed and agreed when faced with a situation....

We have a witness who can corroborate the story.....

We offered him the opportunity to move as a compromise......

Had he taken us up on the offer he would have been located right in the funnel thru which every motorcyclist had to pass to reach their bike....people who would be worth lobbying on the issue and seperate from the non-riding, and uninvolved "civilians" for lack of a better word.

When we spoke with him he was amongst a large group of non-riding "civilians" by our Trials Display.

So here we are 8 hours later....getting grilled because someone who chose a target poor environment at the time of the conversation, who didn't even have the courtesy to have a conversation with the organizers in regards to his intent, being offered a target rich environment away from the "civilians" that would be a win-win for everyone......instead going home to sulk and post some disparagement and half-truths on the internet.

OK

Now I have to talke issue with you. Not about the question of someone handing out leaflets, but about your understanding of what the ACC protest issue is about.

Firstly your comment "and while we strongly encourage motorcyclists to make their individual ACC submissions" sounds very like a cop out to me. You are part of the motorcycle industry. And your only response to a direct attack on motorcycling (and one that could put you out of business!) is to "strongly encourage motorcyclists to make individual submissions" ? You can't be bothered ,as a business , to do any more than that. To pass the buck back to the "individual motorcyclist" ?

If your apathetic attitude reflects that of the motorcycle industry in general (and I'm afraid to say that it seems that it does) then all I can say is that the sooner you go out of business and are replaced by someone with the interests of the motorcycling community at heart, the better. I am quite sure that Len Perry, Bill White, Bill Russell, Percy Coleman would have had a LOT more to say than "encourage individual motorcyclists to make submissions".

And your philosophy that the OP should have only approached motorcyclists and not "bothered" 'civilians' is way way of target.

The 'civilians' are EXCATLY those we want and need to approach. Motorcyclists already know what is going on . (any that don't are living under a rock and won't come out anyway) . They don't need telling. It is the general public that we need to approach and educate . The OP had EXACTLY the right strategy in concentrating on them

You are doing the ACC protest movement no favours with your tactics.

Indeed you are stabbing them in the back, fighting on behalf of ACC instead of the motorcyclists.

[NONONO]

Did I REALLY read the words "Hearts and minds" in that post?
Would the dealers, and importers, (and, as if they gave a toss, the manufacturers, tell us HOW they are supporting their customers in this campaign?
Just for my own peace of mind, just so I know.
Just so I can make an informed choice about which brand, which dealer, I might want to buy my next bike from.
I mean I've already made that choice about which political party will get my next vote, or not. Surely i should have some information about who I will support with my purchasing dollar?
Not that it makes one iota of difference to the bike dealers or manufacturers, but my few thousand dollars means a lot to me.
What are you doing?
Let us know.

[cowboyz]

The holy er than thou Acc grizlers on this thread are probobly the sort of tossers that gate crash a party and want to put there own music on ,did not get to bike fest but well done rolling thunder and all the other dealers,clubs etc ,there is a minority on this site that hides behind the vale of animinty and throws a heap of shit, i mean whats danger barstards agender, get over yourself i reckon you must be one of them little hoody wearing pricks slouched in the front seat of a cage

this vale of animinty argument not only is invalid but really annoying.

Most of the posters, if not all over 2000posts anyhow will be very well known in real life. You come anywhere near the manawatu and ask who cowboyz is and someone will point you this way. The "vale" of animinty is was more transparent than the "vale of PR and whitewash responses"


BTW... Still dont know what the relationship between bikefest and ACC is???????

[riffer]

Oh dear. It appears that the man from Laconia has gone rather laconic on us.

[NONONO]

OK

Now I have to talke issue with you. Not about the question of someone handing out leaflets, but about your understanding of what the ACC protest issue is about.

Firstly your comment "and while we strongly encourage motorcyclists to make their individual ACC submissions" sounds very like a cop out to me. You are part of the motorcycle industry. And your only response to a direct attack on motorcycling (and one that could put you out of business!) is to "strongly encourage motorcyclists to make individual submissions" ? You can't be bothered ,as a business , to do any more than that. To pass the buck back to the "individual motorcyclist" ?

If your apathetic attitude reflects that of the motorcycle industry in general (and I'm afraid to say that it seems that it does) then all I can say is that the sooner you go out of business and are replaced by someone with the interests of the motorcycling community at heart, the better. I am quite sure that Len Perry, Bill White, Bill Russell, Percy Coleman would have had a LOT more to say than "encourage individual motorcyclists to make submissions".

And your philosophy that the OP should have only approached motorcyclists and not "bothered" 'civilians' is way way of target.

The 'civilians' are EXCATLY those we want and need to approach. Motorcyclists already know what is going on . (any that don't are living under a rock and won't come out anyway) . They don't need telling. It is the general public that we need to approach and educate . The OP had EXACTLY the right strategy in concentrating on them

You are doing the ACC protest movement no favours with your tactics.

Indeed you are stabbing them in the back, fighting on behalf of ACC instead of the motorcyclists.

My god man, you do battle honour!
You may make a suit look like a rubbish bag, but I for one will follow you to the gates of hell! Or at least Wellington.

[kave]

As far as I can tell, chch_zed has accused biketober fest of not supporting motorcyclists in what is probably the biggest issue we have faced in the last decade, and lakedaemonian is essentially saying that this is correct, but that bikers were being screwed democratically by all the stall-holders there. I am really failing to see how that makes it less disappointing.

I cannot see why the stakeholders in the motorcycle industry are bending over so easily. We all know we are about to be raped by the government, but I am going to fight it as best I can.

As far as I am concerned, if I walk into a shop related in any way to the motorcycle industry and they dont have posters/flyers for protests and aren't taking an active role in protesting this levy hike I will never shop there again. Simple really, take our money elsewhere and give it to those who support us. If we all decided to do this then the industry might wake up.

[cowboyz]

If the dude was handing out on private property, then ok fair enough to ask him to move off the private property if you don't like it.

If he was also told not to do so on public property, that's pretty naff.

You have a bike shop (apparently in collabration with ACC) holding an event for bikers and the public. An issue very close to all bikers at the momnet is not being publically supported by the event organisers. Sure, legally, if it was on private land then he has every right to not support the concerns of bikers and ask whatever he would like to happen or not happen.

The real question is....

Does Bike Thunder support the biking community or does it take the path of least resistance? Cant go upsetting the sponsers? Oh,, and what is ACC role in bikefest?

OK
Firstly your comment "and while we strongly encourage motorcyclists to make their individual ACC submissions" sounds very like a cop out to me. You are part of the motorcycle industry. And your only response to a direct attack on motorcycling (and one that could put you out of business!) is to "strongly encourage motorcyclists to make individual submissions" ? You can't be bothered ,as a business , to do any more than that. To pass the buck back to the "individual motorcyclist" ?

couldnt have said it better myself! Totally on the same page as Ixion on this one.

[Hitcher]

vale of animinty

Veil of anonymity. I'm presuming.

[Molly]

This thread is just going to run and run until an argument gets out of hand and it's closed down.

As an aside, I listened to a bloke whinge about some trivial issue with the dealership today whilst helping himself to their hospitality. I swear I wouldn't have the patience ...

[cowboyz]

hey... Id just be happy to find out the relationship between ACC and bikefest?