The chance of a lifetime: You are asked to start a bike shop. How should it be done?

[T.W.R]

Pray tell then..........................

There were probably a number of factors involved but slow response, having to re-supply original requests and slow delivery of requested items made dealing with CKT difficult.
In your defence though our parts guy was as slow as a wet week and to his own misfortune had a limited knowledge of anything roadbike related.
One of the most difficult issues we had through CKT was sourcing a Ohlins steering damper for a KLX450F which we'd been informed about only weeks prior, then when the order was placed we were given the run around so due to time eventually told CKT where to stick said damper

[T.W.R]

Not really. I've just been banging on about the same thing, namely that if you don't put profit first, nothing else can follow, because you're effectively trading at a loss and therefore going out of business.

you should preach that to the wine industry who were on the news tonight none of them said oh hell there goes a loss for the year pack everything up we're done

Yeah... still not getting that thing I said about TRADING profit. Every single business begins day one selling it's product for more than the unit cost. i.e. Trading profit. This must be the fifth time I've now made this distinction.

yeah right

Non-profits are not businesses, they are charities.

Non profit orginisations ARE still businesses and quoted as such in literally all business education publications

[Scorp]

you should preach that to the wine industry who were on the news tonight none of them said oh hell there goes a loss for the year pack everything up we're done

All you're doing is demonstrating that you're still not getting the point I've been making from the beginning...

And anyway, I said nothing, at all, about packing up at the first sign of trouble. This is what's known as a straw man argument.

Non profit orginisations ARE still businesses and quoted as such in literally all business education publications

This is a complete red-herring. And you know it. This thread is about for-profit companies.

BTW: my business is actually writing fundraising copy for international non-profit orgs, so I know a thing or two about what they are and what they aren't. And they are not commercial businesses - i.e the subject of this thread.

[Robert Taylor]

There were probably a number of factors involved but slow response, having to re-supply original requests and slow delivery of requested items made dealing with CKT difficult.
In your defence though our parts guy was as slow as a wet week and to his own misfortune had a limited knowledge of anything roadbike related.
One of the most difficult issues we had through CKT was sourcing a Ohlins steering damper for a KLX450F which we'd been informed about only weeks prior, then when the order was placed we were given the run around so due to time eventually told CKT where to stick said damper

Heck I though it was going to be something really bad and totally indefensible.

Yes I agree with what you are saying to the first comment and it rather confirms my own grumblings about the difficulty of finding experienced knowledgable staff that are highly motivated and have a sense of urgency. This is a problem that affects a LOT of businesses, as you well know. Doubtless I would have been able to answer your questions more
readily, had I been available. Due to my own internal frustrations! In the end event I am personally doing more hours because of those very frustrations, it doesnt ''fix'' the problem but it responds to customers faster.

You say you were given the run around re a steering damper, in fact if you had enquired to any Ohlins reseller all over the world at that time they also were having the run around. Ohlins were rejecting every batch of steering damper main bodies ( made by a subcontractor ) for months on end because the material was not stable in dimensional accuracy with aging. In a wing type damper the tolerances have to be very tight and very precise. We were just as frustrated as every time we enquired ''where are they'' the delivery date kept being put back and back. Ohlins themselves were also very frustrated and unfortunately we didnt get the full story until very late in the peace.
So it made us and every other Ohlins distributor in the world look a little bit silly, through no fault of our own, In the absence of a plausible story i.e the truth of it it leads to comments such as ''given the run around''
Although the whole chain of events was unfortunate with that steering damper ( until the material quality problem was resolved ) I also applaud Ohlins for putting quality before supply.
Every manufacturer has issues like this from time to time and when supply is delayed its human nature for customers to scream. If many customers had a better understanding of supply chains for material ( somewhat lengthened given the amount of raw material that China is absorbing ) and lead times for manufacture then they might understand a whole lot better and that screaming is not always wholly justified.
Given also that many manufacturers and subcontractors to those manufacturers laid off lots of staff when the recession bit they have less capacity to produce goods quickly. Lead times are longer and thats going to be with us for quite some time. GET USED TO IT!!!

[Smifffy]

All you're doing is demonstrating that you're still not getting the point I've been making from the beginning...

And anyway, I said nothing, at all, about packing up at the first sign of trouble. This is what's known as a straw man argument.


This is a complete red-herring. And you know it. This thread is about for-profit companies.

BTW: my business is actually writing fundraising copy for international non-profit orgs, so I know a thing or two about what they are and what they aren't. And they are not commercial businesses - i.e the subject of this thread.

you should preach that to the wine industry who were on the news tonight none of them said oh hell there goes a loss for the year pack everything up we're done






yeah right




Non profit orginisations ARE still businesses and quoted as such in literally all business education publications

Flogging a dead horse is one thing, but now you're just whipping a stain on the ground where a dead horse used to be.

[PeeJay]

All you're doing is demonstrating that you're still not getting the point I've been making from the beginning...

And anyway, I said nothing, at all, about packing up at the first sign of trouble. This is what's known as a straw man argument.


This is a complete red-herring. And you know it. This thread is about for-profit companies.

BTW: my business is actually writing fundraising copy for international non-profit orgs, so I know a thing or two about what they are and what they aren't. And they are not commercial businesses - i.e the subject of this thread.

Scorp, you should stop digging and climb out of your hole before it starts raining.

[PeeJay]

Heck I though it was going to be something really bad and totally indefensible.

Yes I agree with what you are saying to the first comment and it rather confirms my own grumblings about the difficulty of finding experienced knowledgable staff that are highly motivated and have a sense of urgency. This is a problem that affects a LOT of businesses, as you well know. Doubtless I would have been able to answer your questions more
readily, had I been available. Due to my own internal frustrations! In the end event I am personally doing more hours because of those very frustrations, it doesnt ''fix'' the problem but it responds to customers faster.

You say you were given the run around re a steering damper, in fact if you had enquired to any Ohlins reseller all over the world at that time they also were having the run around. Ohlins were rejecting every batch of steering damper main bodies ( made by a subcontractor ) for months on end because the material was not stable in dimensional accuracy with aging. In a wing type damper the tolerances have to be very tight and very precise. We were just as frustrated as every time we enquired ''where are they'' the delivery date kept being put back and back. Ohlins themselves were also very frustrated and unfortunately we didnt get the full story until very late in the peace.
So it made us and every other Ohlins distributor in the world look a little bit silly, through no fault of our own, In the absence of a plausible story i.e the truth of it it leads to comments such as ''given the run around''
Although the whole chain of events was unfortunate with that steering damper ( until the material quality problem was resolved ) I also applaud Ohlins for putting quality before supply.
Every manufacturer has issues like this from time to time and when supply is delayed its human nature for customers to scream. If many customers had a better understanding of supply chains for material ( somewhat lengthened given the amount of raw material that China is absorbing ) and lead times for manufacture then they might understand a whole lot better and that screaming is not always wholly justified.
Given also that many manufacturers and subcontractors to those manufacturers laid off lots of staff when the recession bit they have less capacity to produce goods quickly. Lead times are longer and thats going to be with us for quite some time. GET USED TO IT!!!

All very well saying this now, a better idea would have been to say the same thing (well not all of it) to the customer before he got pissed off.

Saying it now looks like an excuse, "its not my fault its someone else"
Saying it before would still be an excuse but would be taken a lot better by the customer. At least he has some upfront information and can make a decision accordingly. He probably had a customer breathing down his neck who now thinks he is useless. Who has told his friends.
Lack of communication seems to be one of the biggest problems.
Simple thing like email the courier ticket # when you send something
A simple thing like that can nip so many potential problems in the bud before they escalate to "stick it, I want my money back"

Lack of communication, especially when things arent looking good, is a result of pride, people not wanting to look bad, hoping the problem will go away or sort it self out before the SHTF
You didnt want to admit Ohlins had a problem with supply because you think it makes you look bad. Not at all, Ohlins looks bad, and if a damper were to actually turn up you would look good.
Not saying anything has ended up with you looking bad. Even if a damper turned up you still wouldnt have looked great, you were too slow.
Not having a go at your business, just using this example.

[R-Soul]

you should preach that to the wine industry who were on the news tonight none of them said oh hell there goes a loss for the year pack everything up we're done

yeah right

Is that the slack jawed blink of non-understanding? Yes, companies sometimes make trading losses on a short term basis (i.e one, maybe two months - even over a year if they group together like the wine industry people- if they have cash reserves or loans to tide them over until they make profit again). And YES companies take loans - that that take up to three years to service. But you tell me this: Once you have taken a loan to strat a business, where are you going to get money to pay the loan off if you are not making any money in normal, everyday trade (i.e. trading profits)?

But if, after paying for salaries and new stock and other trading costs (that you have to pay for on a day to day trading basis) you have no additonal money (trading profit) to pay the loan, how do you ever get it paid off, and once its paid off and you are not making any profit, then why would you bother running a business at all? And if you canot pay it off, th bank forcloses on you and starts tking teh clothes offfyour back.

At least if you are an employee you dont have the stress and dont take a much risk (well I suppose you do take the risk of buinesses failing, because you can lose your job, but at least you dont have to stand personal surety for loans). As scorp said: profit is king. If you aint gonna make any, then dont bother.

Non profit orginisations ARE still businesses and quoted as such in literally all business education publications

No they are ORGANISATIONS (hence not "non-profit businesses"). They are run for a purpose, which does not incolude making profit. They do not have shareholders or owners profit. Their accounting procedures are similar yes, to establish whether they are i n fact makig profit or not, but the basis of these businesses is the idea of doing good for others (philanthropy) and the fact that some people are prepared to start and manage them for little to no reward other than a sense of welllbeing. these organisations are not expected to grow or expand much either.

They have to servce their loans yes, but nobody (generally) starts one for anything other than a philanthropic purpose. And as far as I am aware, nobody has (yet) started a "non-profit bike part supply organisation. Because why would they?

And even if these organisations wanted to expand they would need to have donations, or trading profit. The classic business model EXPECTS a business to expand and grow, and to produce sustainable profits in order to to do so.

[T.W.R]

All you're doing is demonstrating that you're still not getting the point I've been making from the beginning...

And anyway, I said nothing, at all, about packing up at the first sign of trouble. This is what's known as a straw man argument.


This is a complete red-herring. And you know it. This thread is about for-profit companies.

BTW: my business is actually writing fundraising copy for international non-profit orgs, so I know a thing or two about what they are and what they aren't. And they are not commercial businesses - i.e the subject of this thread.

All you've done is take a tact of running around in a circle and choosing to see what you want to see and turn to selective arguement attacks sunshine

so you're working for the Girl Guides or the Salvation Army huh
figures though as your business ideals are sounding thoroughly designed from business educational styles of the 70s

[Scorp]

Scorp, you should stop digging and climb out of your hole before it starts raining.

:slap: What! I'm not digging a hole. I'm just mathematically and logically right. This feels like trying to explain multiplication to someone who counts on their fingers.

I hereby give up.

If anyone out there wants to go into business with anything other than profit as their number one priority, good luck. It will, ultimately, be your loss. Literally.

My final comment will be to re-labour the point that I'm not talking about mine or anyone else's personal philosophy, politics or passions in life here. I'm talking about the basic essential imperative for successful commercial enterprise. And that's profitability. For without that, nothing else you want to achieve is possible, including the survival of your business.

[T.W.R]

There is a fundimental business saying that you should be aware of: The Business of Business is Business

also Arrogance is the shortfall to failure

[Scorp]

so you're working for the Girl Guides or the Salvation Army huh
figures though as your business ideals are sounding thoroughly designed from business educational styles of the 70s

No I write fundraising direct marketing campaigns for major non-profits, working with some of the most respected people in the field. Over the last three years the campaigns I've written have raised more than NZ$24 million for those charities.

But I'm sure you'll still contrive some way to convince yourself I don't know shit.

[T.W.R]

No I write fundraising direct marketing campaigns for major non-profits, working with some of the most respected people in the field. Over the last three years the campaigns I've written have raised more than NZ$24 million for those charities.

But I'm sure you'll still contrive some way to convince yourself I don't know shit.

Second sentence in my last post is appropriate

[Scorp]

Second sentence in my last post is appropriate

No, that's just a regurgitated second-hand aphorism yo dug up, which in light of the actual content of my last post is the opposite of appropriate.

[T.W.R]

No, that's just a regurgitated second-hand aphorism yo dug up, which in light of the actual content of my last post is the opposite of appropriate.

If the jacket fits, wear it sunshine

do a check of what arrogant means