Police killing us again!

[miloking]

So just because the "witness" doesn't fit with how you'd like the facts to be you just slag him off? Were you in the vicinity yourself to verify that this "witness" is talking shit?

Well fuck me, another cop suck up KB member...read the fricking article, it clearly said that Mr.Wilkin the Motor racer (thus expert on fast vehicles) only heard the whole incident from his back yard but he dared to imply that bike was speeding purely from few seconds of sound!
SO tell me just be cause you hear sound of loud bike can you honestly tell me you know how fast its traveling?

[miloking]

Email sent to Joyce and Collins:


Dear Ministers

When will you ensure police officers have the skills and intelligence to drive safely on New Zealand roads and not just act like dogs that have spotted a rabbit?

Or will you just put up the ACC levy on motorcycle licenses to cover the cost of the motorcyclist killed by the police officer this weekend?

Yours sincerely

Pixie

+1 Well said sir, Can you PM the contact details, i would also like to chime in....

[Big Dave]

It's hardly surprising that the popular Media favours the Establishment rather than Bikers.

We'd get a better shake as a Racial minority rather than a transport one.

[miloking]

Actually, you can do exactly that! I have used the sonic doppler shift for speed measurements and it's surprisingly accurate. Note that it's not the exhaust note that matters - it's the change in the note as the emitter goes past.
It is not difficult to tell when the sound source is grossly exceeding a speed that one is accustomed to hearing

OK so whats your point? Nobody disputes that you can measure doppler shift but are you saying that Mr.Wilkin has correct equipment placed around his property to measure doppler efflect on a sound of vehicles going past?

[Bald Eagle]

+1 Well said sir, Can you PM the contact details, i would also like to chime in....

List of MP's contact details

[Crasherfromwayback]

OK so whats your point? Nobody disputes that you can measure doppler shift but are you saying that Mr.Wilkin has correct equipment placed around his property to measure doppler efflect on a sound of vehicles going past?

+1. The old geezer probably has a cop for a son or something! If he heard a CBR250RR going past doing 110kph at 12000RPM he'd shit himself. Think it was going 200kph. It was a stooopid thing to say in my opinion.

[Bass]

OK so whats your point? Nobody disputes that you can measure doppler shift but are you saying that Mr.Wilkin has correct equipment placed around his property to measure doppler efflect on a sound of vehicles going past?

Actually, yes!
Your ears are surprisingly effective in this situation, especially at detecting frequency change. It's one of the reasons we enjoy music.

A little test that you might like to try.................r
Go out into your back yard and listen to the traffic going past your front gate, i.e. put yourself in a set of circumstances that you are well used to.
Because it's the frequency CHANGE that matters, you will find that you can easily pick any vehicle that is grossly outside the norm of the speed going past your gate.
Please, don't take my word for it - go and check it out for yourself.

[terbang]

OMG, isn't the whole "ride as though you do NOT know what is just outside of your line of vision" thing being forgotten here? How often do we drive or ride (yes, those of us who ride are just as guilty of doing this) assuming that the road ahead, which we can't actually see, is clear of any obstacles. It only takes tiredness, distraction, cockiness, blinking to get a grain of dust outta ya eyes and all sorts of things can go down the toilet fast. Everyone is in the same boat; and if you're het up about the more serious consequences for bike riders, get off two wheels. (ps spearfish, that last comment wasn't aimed at you, it just happened to be in my reply following your qoute, not personal to you).

Generally with accidents there is not one single cause, but more a chain of errors or failures. Failures fall into two distinct category's, active and latent. Active failures include hazardous attitudes and unsafe acts. Latent failures tend to lie dormant for long periods and include topics like poor training and fallible management decisions. When we ride our bikes there are a series of defences in place, training, regulatory and also our own skill to name a few. With the last line of defence being the man on the spot (in this case our rider and the cop). When its all working properly then our risk is minimal.

Yes there is a possibility that the rider was speeding (active) and it is also well established that the policeman did a U turn on the brow of a hill (also active). However in the light of five previous "chase" accidents, the apparent myopia of the police management and training system over this trend easily falls into the category of latent failure. Thus leading to the hazardous attitude that our U turning plod displayed.

Ultimately, the measure of how effective our road safety programmes and policing is (sadly) the road death toll. And that has been drawing a lot of attention of late as the toll seems to be getting worse. So the current road safety isn't working as well as we would like.

I believe its time for all NZers to provoke/encourage a realistic rethink in the dizzy and well paid heights of the upper echelon of our police force.

[Pixie]

Scumdog seems to come across as a person with a police record then a police officer.

I have a police record:The Laughing Policeman by Charles Jolly

[miloking]

+1. The old geezer probably has a cop for a son or something! If he heard a CBR250RR going past doing 110kph at 12000RPM he'd shit himself. Think it was going 200kph. It was a stooopid thing to say in my opinion.

You are right, thats exactly what i was getting at...and of course only reason why Mr.Wilkin is mentioned as motor racer is to give some credibility to his "expert" opinion. I get the feeling media is trying to taint this whole "unbiased" investigation yet again.
Its almost like they are on a NZ Police pay roll! (just like some KB members, "chipping" in on this discussion with their expert opinions)

[Swoop]

...they interviewed a "motoring expert" local resident who claims the motorcycle was speeding by his hearing where TV3 tried to spin it as biker again at fault.
Formal complaint on the way you fuckers.

I wasn't too impressed with the old geezer saying 'I heard a bike go past and thought shit thats going fast!', heard??? You can not say definitively from noise that he was speeding.

Well fuck me, another cop suck up KB member...read the fricking article, it clearly said that Mr.Wilkin the Motor racer (thus expert on fast vehicles) only heard the whole incident from his back yard but he dared to imply that bike was speeding purely from few seconds of sound!
SO tell me just be cause you hear sound of loud bike can you honestly tell me you know how fast its traveling?

+1. The old geezer probably has a cop for a son or something! If he heard a CBR250RR going past doing 110kph at 12000RPM he'd shit himself. Think it was going 200kph. It was a stooopid thing to say in my opinion.

Quite so. The person with the "calibrated hearing" (Frank Wilkin) has also stated that "The back of the police vehicle was "virtually torn off"".
Not sure about you, but the photo clearly shows a large dent in the left rear of the police car but is certainly not "virtually torn off".

[miloking]

Actually, yes!
Your ears are surprisingly effective in this situation, especially at detecting frequency change. It's one of the reasons we enjoy music.

A little test that you might like to try.................r
Go out into your back yard and listen to the traffic going past your front gate, i.e. put yourself in a set of circumstances that you are well used to.
Because it's the frequency CHANGE that matters, you will find that you can easily pick any vehicle that is grossly outside the norm of the speed going past your gate.
Please, don't take my word for it - go and check it out for yourself.

I believe you and agree with what you are saying, but my point is i would not dare to judge speed of a vehicle involved in fatal or any other inccident from hearing alone.
I could "guesstimate" that it was probably fast but i would have no clue if it was 100 or 120k/m and even so i believe its very bad manners to comment to media... "bad mouthing" and throwing guilt at someone who just died 5 minutes ago few meters away from me.
As i said dont people have any respect anymore?

[Crasherfromwayback]

Quite so. The person with the "calibrated hearing" (Frank Wilkin) has also stated that "The back of the police vehicle was "virtually torn off"".
Not sure about you, but the photo clearly shows a large dent in the left rear of the police car but is certainly not "virtually torn off".

+10. Years ago whilst out test riding a Z1R Kawasaki, I went through a stop sign I hadn't seen and buried it into the side of a car at around 120kph. It fucking near cut the car in half!

The damage done to the rear of the police car was nothing compared to what I did to one. Different cars etc I know...but still...

[Pixie]

I'm sure the fact that the police car appears to have been shunted around by about 90 degrees will be given due consideration.

Position of police car can be related to whether the cop tried to get out of the rider's way and accelerated

[terbang]

I agree, except the view that most have of motorcyclists. Sadly a lot see us as a lower form of life and are very quick to condemn us.