Are we at the end of the era for motorcycling?

[ellipsis]

...I generally avoid the place, like the plague...I only go in there in my Landcruiser with a reinforced roof...just in case a building falls on me and I keep my eyes closed. so that I dont have to see the scooter riders playing dodgem with parked cars in jandals , shorts and t-shirts...and I try to be behind locked doors by 8.30 pm...

[swbarnett]

There was a decline in motorcycling in NZ in the late 80s. This was brought about by the advent of cheap Jap import cars. Like all things motorcycling will rise and fall in popularity. Maybe we're heading back to "rebel" image you see in 50s movies (part of me kind of likes that idea).

Fewer bikes on the road will not be all bad. Fewer bike will mean less police focus. Hell, I remember when you could do 150kph on the motorway and the worst you would get is a friendly chat.

[shrub]

It was either Neil Chivas or Dave Hiscock (maybe even Neville)who said something very similar about the GSX1100 of the early eighties

and it was Ken McIntosh in the early 80s who told me that the Japanese engines were fine but needed to be liquid cooled to get any real power and that Japanese frames were stuck in the 1950s technologically and were basically the same design as a Norton Featherbed.

Consider the improvements from the revolutionary and state of the art 1969 Honda 750 four to the 1973 kwakka 900 to the 1980 GSX1100 then the 1984 GPZ900. Every 4 - 6 years there was a quantam leap in technology and performance and the GPz900 is as big a jump on the GSX1100 (I've owned both) as the Kwakka 900 was from the CB750 (I've owned several CB750s but sadly never a Kwakka 9).


Now compare the first generation R1 and Gixxer 1000s to the latest crop. In 10 years the power has increased from far too much for 99% of (road) riders to far too much for 99.9% of riders and handling and braking have improved incrementally (for road riders). The only significant improvement for most road riders is the ability to change your fuel mapping.

I remember when I had my first CB750. Even then I knew the handling and braking were crap and the power was only slightly better than the 71 Bonnie I had before it, so i fitted aftermarket shocks, an extra disc, big bore kit, hot cam, high comp pistons etc etc, and while it was now faster than my mate's GS1000s, Z1000s etc, it still handled like crap and had no brakes.

When I had my GSX1100 I knew full well the frame flexed, the brakes were wooden etc, even though it was still a pretty crash hot bike for the day. What changes would you have to make to a 5 year old Gixxer 1000 to make it a half way rideable bike? Major changes, or minor tweaks?

My argument is that the latest and greatest of 2011 are little different (for real-world road riders) than the greatest from 2000 and that there have been no quantum leaps since the Gixxer1100.

[Scuba_Steve]

There was a decline in motorcycling in NZ in the late 80s. This was brought about by the advent of cheap Jap import cars. Like all things motorcycling will rise and fall in popularity. Maybe we're heading back to "rebel" image you see in 50s movies (part of me kind of likes that idea).

ahh 80's I was 1 decade out

[shrub]

Get yourself a Rocket 111 Roadster and see it all out on a high mate

probably my next bike. having had the pleasure of a few thousand kms on Rocket 3s in a previous life as a triumph salesman I know how bloody addictive the things are.

[mike n]

really nice to read an article and not have a big arguement over it... Quite different here in the States.. Seems like nothing being posted has been spared from ridicule or just plain name calling... So once again nice to read different opinions being shared... Way to go folks...

Biker Mike

[Kickaha]

When I had my GSX1100 I knew full well the frame flexed

Most so called "frame flex" on those earlier bikes was cured by decent swingarm bearings/bushes and decent rear suspension

I'd still rather have an early GSX1100 over a late GSXR1000 any day of the week

[Spearfish]

and it was Ken McIntosh in the early 80s who told me that the Japanese engines were fine but needed to be liquid cooled to get any real power and that Japanese frames were stuck in the 1950s technologically and were basically the same design as a Norton Featherbed.

Consider the improvements from the revolutionary and state of the art 1969 Honda 750 four to the 1973 kwakka 900 to the 1980 GSX1100 then the 1984 GPZ900. Every 4 - 6 years there was a quantam leap in technology and performance and the GPz900 is as big a jump on the GSX1100 (I've owned both) as the Kwakka 900 was from the CB750 (I've owned several CB750s but sadly never a Kwakka 9).


Now compare the first generation R1 and Gixxer 1000s to the latest crop. In 10 years the power has increased from far too much for 99% of (road) riders to far too much for 99.9% of riders and handling and braking have improved incrementally (for road riders). The only significant improvement for most road riders is the ability to change your fuel mapping.

I remember when I had my first CB750. Even then I knew the handling and braking were crap and the power was only slightly better than the 71 Bonnie I had before it, so i fitted aftermarket shocks, an extra disc, big bore kit, hot cam, high comp pistons etc etc, and while it was now faster than my mate's GS1000s, Z1000s etc, it still handled like crap and had no brakes.

When I had my GSX1100 I knew full well the frame flexed, the brakes were wooden etc, even though it was still a pretty crash hot bike for the day. What changes would you have to make to a 5 year old Gixxer 1000 to make it a half way rideable bike? Major changes, or minor tweaks?

My argument is that the latest and greatest of 2011 are little different (for real-world road riders) than the greatest from 2000 and that there have been no quantum leaps since the Gixxer1100.

Its interesting reading.
Would it be fair to say any improvements now on could go down the path of making the average rider more able to use more of the bikes potential artificially?
Like traction control, abs, managed power delivery etc etc

[Gibbo89]

Have you been living in a cave lately? Go around the central city in the weekends at night and you'll see more taxis than 'boy racers'. Cruising around in cars causing trouble has gone out of fashion in Christchurch.

There is less, but I don't believe they have all been sold to other parts of the country etc.

Last week down blenheim road a skyline and a gt legacy were dragging each other, the skyline almost lost control too... Wish it had...

If Chch ever loses it's boy racers, it will be a fuckin' miracle and whoever stopped them should receive a medal.

[SMOKEU]

There is less, but I don't believe they have all been sold to other parts of the country etc.

Last week down blenheim road a skyline and a gt legacy were dragging each other, the skyline almost lost control too... Wish it had...

If Chch ever loses it's boy racers, it will be a fuckin' miracle and whoever stopped them should receive a medal.

What you have to realise is that an out of control bike can kill an innocent bystander just as quickly as a car. It's a lot easier to bin a bike than it is to crash a cage, and I've seen many bikers (usually the ones on sports bikes) riding like complete muppets at well over double the speed limit. If you're on one of those group rides and someone tries to show off by popping a big wheelie and crashes into you then what do you think is going to happen?

Too many people on KB say "I hate boy racers, but my GSXR1000 does close to 300kmh". There's not much difference in the attitude of many people who ride bikes and those who drive performance cars. You might have more in common than you think.

I've been on KB rides before with some of the litre bike boys, and it often turns into a "Race you to the finish, loser has to shout a round of beer at the pub" kind of situation.

[awa355]

[QUOTE=SMOKEU;1129946 and it often turns into a "Race you to the finish, loser has to shout a round of beer at the pub" kind of situation.[/QUOTE]

Nothing has changed in the last 40 years.

[SMOKEU]

Nothing has changed in the last 40 years.

NZ law does not differentiate going 150kmh in a cage to going 150kmh on a bike. In other words, you're just as much of a criminal for speeding on a bike as you are for speeding in a cage.

Just because someone prefers riding a bike fast compared to someone to likes to drive fast does not make them a better person, contrary to popular belief.

[schrodingers cat]

End of an era?

[shrub]

Most so called "frame flex" on those earlier bikes was cured by decent swingarm bearings/bushes and decent rear suspension

I'd still rather have an early GSX1100 over a late GSXR1000 any day of the week

So Mr Hiscock was right then? The GSX1100 was the pinnacle of motorcycle engineering. Personally I'd rather have modern brakes and suspension over what we endured in the 80s, but I'm sure you have a good reason for preferring the old technology.

[baptist]

Pinnacle of technology? Don't think I agree. Stuff like ABS, traction control and electronic suspension adjustment are somewhat in their infancy. Does it add or subtract from riding? That's a personal thing, but more technology will keep coming.

I think you are right, but only as long as there are enough people buying the machines, no profit = no investment.

Where is going is up to us, I believe we are the masters of our own destiny...
Then there are the thousands of riders who commute all year round and see their bikes as a relevant alternative to public transport...
Its a long way from dead but we are writing the script of our own relevance.

To true, I use my little bike to commute and go everywhere and while I would like a bigger one one day, the price of petrol and my fuel ecconomy keep hauling me back to reality ... which is keep the little one

Made like this one Building the Triumph Rocket

Now that is a great clip A+