Street Races... and modern hay bales

[Frenchy]

Ditto with Wyndham - the reason the bales are different every year is that where we perceive that there was a problem, we fix it. I understand that the bales used since the first meeting were baled "soft", in an effort to provide the "cushioning" effect riders need. Softer std bales are placed in probable impact areas for the obvious reasons ...... I'm positive that the Good Folks of Wyndham will be working together with the Southland Club to improve AGAIN next time - thats how it works.

At Wyndham why dont the put the bales back 10m or so at turn 1? there is no kurb poles or fence.... just a big truck they park there and then put bails in front of it on the edge of the road!

[Grumph]

The small original style bales were adequate for relatively light slow bikes in the 60's and 70's but when you realise the kinetic energy of a modern 1000 - and factor in sidecars as well....IMO the big bales may even be too light...
The problem is stopping a bike going through bales while providing enough cushioning for a rider too.
Street circuits will never be as safe as permanent circuits - that's a given.
Yes organising clubs do their best with what resources they can source or afford but as I said before spectator safety has to take first priority. At the planning/approval level, no guarantee of spectator safety, no meeting, period. And being realistic, no spectators, no money into the town , no reason for the essential local support to continue

re whether you're happy riding street circuits....i like Shaun's attitude - I won't ride there unless I'm paid - totally justifiable and understandable. No one's twisting your arm to ride. Wanganui was eased out of the Nat series as a lot of people felt it was no longer justifiable to force riders to go for points on a street circuit - any street circuit.

[jellywrestler]

In the South island we're looking at a total of 6 street races within the next year perhaps if the organisers pooled resources something like airfence would be affordable,

have you priced air fencing? have you priced the transport of air fencing?
Paeroa were offered Wanganui's air fencing last year but turned it down due to the transport costs, from Hampton Downs, and you know how much money Paeroa turns over.

[TonyB]

I can tell you that the issues are being looked at, alternatives are being considered, and that the bales DO perform two functions - crowd protection and rider protection.

The real issue is that the requirements are decidedly different. As one involved at Methven last year, I can say I'm sure things will be better this time round.

Ditto with Wyndham - the reason the bales are different every year is that where we perceive that there was a problem, we fix it. I understand that the bales used since the first meeting were baled "soft", in an effort to provide the "cushioning" effect riders need. Softer std bales are placed in probable impact areas for the obvious reasons ...... I'm positive that the Good Folks of Wyndham will be working together with the Southland Club to improve AGAIN next time - thats how it works.

Budda, how does it work?

• are you guys working to some sort of MNZ guideline?
• are you working with other street race committes?
• or is each group working it out individually by trial and error?

[steve74]

On one trip to Greymouth about nine years ago I was walking around as a spectator and I was pissed off to see after having a look in one wool bale to find (GET THIS) not the plastic milk bottles but the H crates they carry the milk bottles in. Now that to me is putting the riders in danger big time imagine one of those splintering and entering your body on impact!!!!!!!! I hope like hell they have stopped using them now.

Im not suggesting that you are incorrect as it is possible, but i think you will find this is a one off find. We have not used hay bales in greymouth for over 15 years. Most were Moss filled wool bales which we found went rotten after being stacked away wet one year. We then had them filled with plastic milk bottles which were in plentiful supply from a local milk factory that went bust. I have made dozens of these bales myself and have never seen a milk crate yet? It is a concern that you have mentioned it though. In recent times each bag has been packed by hand and are filled with only 1 and 2 litre bottles which are washed out before bagging. There are some which contain smaller cream sized bottles but we found that if the bale tears open they spread onto the track which is not ideal.

steve

[wharfy]

Perhaps WE should start our own airfence fund since some organisers and spectators don't value our lives very much.

Perhaps MNZ should buy some air fences and loan them out to the organizers of meetings ?
I have no clue how much they cost, but I'd be prepared to pay a small additional levy to support it

Slightly off topic rant (as long as it was kept separate and didn't go into the general funds like our petrol taxes that are supposed to be used on roading do )

After all They take our license fees to make motorcycling "Safe,Fun and Fair"

If ALL racers took more interest and got involved in the running of MNZ we wouldn't need to start our own air fence fund !

[steve74]

I was astonished when racing in Paeroa and wanganui (the year that craig flood crashed and set fire to them) that hay bales were a prominent feature of these circuits as they are well established and high profile events. Call me soft but it sure changed my riding style for the day. As has been pointed out, im sure it comes down to cost and what each club can afford to make things as safe as possible.Yes, air fences are the ultimate but if MNZ made airbags mandatory at every street meet then im sure it would put an end to it. When the greymouth street race was set up in 1989 MNZ issued a set of guidelines and a "check list" for the set up of a street circuit. I have read this original document and found it mostly relevant to modern requirements but maybe it is time that they came to a set criteria for all circuits? Im not sure if MNZ issued a similar criteria for newer circuits like windam and methven but im agreed that there should be a set standard. The worst case scenario is that they could put it in the too hard basket and pull the pin on street racing altogether, i hope not.

[Ocean1]

Dumb question. I’ve often wondered why most street races are held either in a town itself or on the fringes of an industrial area? I'm tolerably sure there's usually fewer roadside obstacles a block or two outside town, easier to protect riders if there’s less poles and wider margins.

Less disruption, more room for complimentary activities and better parking. You’d think there’d be fewer consent issues, fewer issues all round.

Or is I just plain ignorant?

[Kickaha]

22.9 STREET CIRCUIT APPROVAL. Where a club is proposing to hold a street circuit road race meeting, a fully detailed plan of the circuit, clearly describing catch fencing and spectator safety barriers must be submitted to the MNZ Office no later than 3 months prior to the intended date of the meeting.

If necessary the Commissioner will arrange for an inspection of the circuit prior to the
issue of the permit to ensure that the proposed safety requirements are adequate.

This is the criteria for getting approval to get a a permit for a street meeting, obviously MNZ are happy with the current safety aspects of the existing street circuits or they wouldn't be issuing the permits

Going by the numbers entering the events the riders aren't to concerned either

[ynot slow]

Large hay bales are to heavy,what about trying straw bales,either conventional or medium,the medium straw bales are lighter than hay for sure.Also what about wood shavings in wool bales,maybe half to 3/4 full,can be stacked on top if required.

[TonyB]

Large hay bales are to heavy,what about trying straw bales,either conventional or medium,the medium straw bales are lighter than hay for sure.Also what about wood shavings in wool bales,maybe half to 3/4 full,can be stacked on top if required.

Thats a good idea- saw mills have trouble dealing with their sawdust- from memory its now regarded as a toxic substance. They'd probably be happy to give it away. Heavier than bags of plastic milk bottles too.

Was talking to my dad when they were shearing recently, he was complaining (as farmers do) about the crap price of wool. That'd go well LOOSELY packed into bales (not compressed into a 180-200kg bale). Or you could use bags of dags...then when you're sliding towards them and yelling "SHIIIIT" ...you'd be right

Seriously though, some of you are missing the point- the big bales I'm concerned about are being used in the runoff/impact/(what ever you want to call it) area on corners. At events I've raced in or spectated at, spectators aren't allowed to stand behind those bales- the areas behind them are of limits. So the bales are NOT there to protect spactators- they are there to stop/protect riders. At Nelson, they have hay bales, then a decent gap, then they have shipping containers to stop the bike if it makes it through the hay. In this situation, I believe using a 250kg big bale is going to hurt the rider unnecessarily. Thats the area I'm concerned about.

[Kickaha]

Seriously though, some of you are missing the point- the big bales I'm concerned about are being used in the runoff/impact/(what ever you want to call it) area on corners. At events I've raced in or spectated at, spectators aren't allowed to stand behind those bales- the areas behind them are of limits. So the bales are NOT there to protect spactators- they are there to stop/protect riders.

That wasn't the case at Methven as I was standing on the outside of two different corners behind them

[FJRider]

Dumb question. I’ve often wondered why most street races are held either in a town itself or on the fringes of an industrial area? I'm tolerably sure there's usually fewer roadside obstacles a block or two outside town, easier to protect riders if there’s less poles and wider margins.

Less disruption, more room for complimentary activities and better parking. You’d think there’d be fewer consent issues, fewer issues all round.

Or is I just plain ignorant?

Fewer pubs, shops, toilets, business's that may profit from the event ... if they dont need to go into town ... often they wont.

[Ocean1]

Fewer pubs, shops, toilets, business's that may profit from the event ... if they dont need to go into town ... often they wont.

Yeah, I'd sort of assumed that until I thought about it.

Over the last few years I haven't noticed many permanent resident business open for trade at the ones I've been to. The odd dairy, a pub I wasn't allowed to buy from, (apparently 'cause it was Sunday... In fact I'm struggling to get more than a handfull that were open at Paeroa, Wanganui or Wyndham combined. Never seen a toilet available to the public other than porta-loos and motels and camping grounds wouldn't be affected one way or another if the track was a mile away.

[Billy]

Seriously though, some of you are missing the point- the big bales I'm concerned about are being used in the runoff/impact/(what ever you want to call it) area on corners. At events I've raced in or spectated at, spectators aren't allowed to stand behind those bales- the areas behind them are of limits. So the bales are NOT there to protect spactators- they are there to stop/protect riders. At Nelson, they have hay bales, then a decent gap, then they have shipping containers to stop the bike if it makes it through the hay. In this situation, I believe using a 250kg big bale is going to hurt the rider unnecessarily. Thats the area I'm concerned about.

Exactl,So therefore something can be done to improve the safety at street circuits without it costing an arm and a leg,Simple commonsense and Im sure the likes of Budda and Johnny Hepburn will be on the case too make it as safe as is practical.

What if we didnt get out of bed or if you dont like it dont enter are just plain disrespectful statements to all that compete at any motorsport events