Old doddery couple or give way rule.

**george formby** · 3rd February 2011, 16:09

Originally Posted by That looks like fun

Is it reasonable to crash into an idiot?

What the driver of the red car did was not excusable in anyway shape or form. Totally in the wrong

So what did he do? He (assuming its not some Wendy driving

) moved into the merging (or whatever it is thingy) gave way to the first vehicle then merged with the traffic. What did he do wrong? Never saw the bike? Never accelerated fast enough? didn't wait for a large enough gap to carry out the merge safely?

Biker down and possibly out, shaken Wendy late for work.

Actions I saw in Video, rider realized car had pulled out in front of him, moved left and braked (correct me if there was more)

Camera clearly shows red car sitting in intersection, first alarm rings!!!!!, plan action, check traffic behind, prepare to carry out plan. Assess all risk,s escape paths etc. Truck blocking left side of road, make sure moving left wasn't part of your plan

car starts to move forward slowly, put plan in action, slow down merge in behind car

. Breath in, Breath out .......... repeat. Simple as that.

Which was indicating right & started to move as the rider came up on the red car. I would not be suprised if the driver of the car was paying far more attention to that truck than the rider, possibly causing their error in pulling out at that time or being waved out. Either way, not a nice situation for the OP & definitely a case of slowing right down & maintaining space.

Glad i live in the country, not sure if my nerves would cope with a commute like that at my age.
T'was a good result though, no harm done.

**george formby** · 3rd February 2011, 16:14

Originally Posted by george formby

Which was indicating right & started to move as the rider came up on the red car. I would not be suprised if the driver of the car was paying far more attention to that truck than the rider, possibly causing their error in pulling out at that time or being waved out. Either way, not a nice situation for the OP & definitely a case of slowing right down & maintaining space.

Glad i live in the country, not sure if my nerves would cope with a commute like that at my age.
T'was a good result though, no harm done.

I'm talking out me date, no indicator & no movement but still a big distraction.
Best I keep my training wheels on.

**KiWiP** · 3rd February 2011, 17:22

Originally Posted by Timmeh:P

Looking at the aerial, it could be considered a merge lane, but it is a VERY short one at that.

Road code: Merging
Sometimes on a road, two lanes will merge into one lane.

The lanes merge where the broken lane lines stop. It's important to make sure that all vehicles from both lanes have plenty of space in which to merge safely.

From the image the broken lines do not stop therefore it isn't a merge lane. (I think it's shit road marking and should have a stop marking so you go across and stop before pulling into the traffic.)

Road code:
Important
Giving way means that the road user you're giving way to (whether they are a driver, cyclist, pedestrian or any other kind of road user) doesn't need to stop, brake or slow down, swerve or take any other evasive action to avoid you.

Road code:
What are the Give Way rules?
If you are turning at an intersection, give way to all vehicles not turning.

They were in the wrong (IMHO)

**Berries** · 3rd February 2011, 20:44

Originally Posted by javawocky

Old doddery couple or give way rule........

........you asked. The former. Old people don't have the neck movement to see you at that angle. Any car stopped like that is waiting for a gap. Assume they won't see you and cover the brakes, as you did.

The car is clearly in the wrong, it is an intersection, not a merge area. You'd be in the right if you did get bowled but that is no consolation when your leg bends where it shouldn't. Your co-workers need educating.

**DangerMouseNZ** · 4th February 2011, 01:31

Originally Posted by Banditbandit

I disagree ... the gap was not "reasonable" the bike was way too close when the car moved ... the bike is at the end of the white line from the intersection when the car moves ... that's really close ... the driver was chancing it on the assumption that the rider would not want to hit the car and would brake ...

I would agree! I am guessing its the same here as in the UK.. a resonable gap is defined by being able to pull out without causing another road user to stamp on the brakes... definately not the case here!

**davebullet** · 4th February 2011, 07:21

Similar to a pet peeve of mine, is drivers who brake when driving onto a motorway on ramp. Why the fuck do they do that and make the speed differential greater which makes it even harder to merge.

Full license driving tests should be done in peak our traffic to test the mettle and awareness of the driver.

**Scuba_Steve** · 4th February 2011, 07:29

Originally Posted by davebullet

Similar to a pet peeve of mine, is drivers who brake when driving onto a motorway on ramp. Why the fuck do they do that and make the speed differential greater which makes it even harder to merge.

Full license driving tests should be done in peak our traffic to test the mettle and awareness of the driver.

Im with you on that people should know how to merge, If I had it my way that would be a major part of you licence test any major hesitation/slow down or attempt to give way would be an instant fail

**sinfull** · 4th February 2011, 07:34

Originally Posted by Katman

The only trouble was, they did it at Grandad pace.

+1 is what a gas pedal is for ! But then again M/C was gaining on car ahead of it and more than likely had a large gap behind it by then, so (add an ASS out of U and ME here) the old diddy prob never saw no grille coming and thought he/she had the road !

Originally Posted by buellbabe

Oh no ,wait a minute that implies that the driver SAW you oops! my mistake!

+2 No way that driver saw him i recon !!! The bike didn't have a fuck off grille to look for !

Originally Posted by Banditbandit

If I was here on a motorbike doing 50 kph

Ya really thunk he was doing 50 lol sure he wasn't racing reclessly through there or he'd of been fucked, but 50?

Originally Posted by Banditbandit

Sure he saw the car from that distance - but it is reasonable to ass out of u and me

Lol loved the first reaction, to flick left (arrrrg big twuck) Hmmm mabey not, then on the piks ! Driver Prob still had no idea OP was there by then or for sometime after !

**Katman** · 4th February 2011, 07:35

All this "it was clearly the old fuckers fault" misses the point somewhat.

These things happen and it's our responsibility to ensure that we are able to compensate for them. (As was the case in this instance).

**Tunahunter** · 4th February 2011, 08:00

[QUOTE=Banditbandit;1129974480]What he said ...

I disagree ... the gap was not "reasonable" the bike was way too close when the car moved ... the bike is at the end of the white line from the intersection when the car moves ... that's really close ... the driver was chancing it on the assumption that the rider would not want to hit the car and would brake ...

You are right of course BUT, to avoid accidents one needs to drive defensively, and Javawocky did that pretty well.

I contend that if the joker in the car was signalling, there was a good chance that he would go - christ, this situation occurs every day and unless you are in a huge hurry to get somewhere why make a big deal out of it. Get on a four-lane roundabout in Jakarta - cars signal and the car behind them expect them to jump in - its crazy but it works

**MSTRS:Me** · 4th February 2011, 08:06

Originally Posted by Katman

All this "it was clearly the old fuckers fault" misses the point somewhat.

These things happen and it's our responsibility to ensure that we are able to compensate for them. (As was the case in this instance).

Actually, it's every motorists responsibility to be able to compensate for shit like this...just the stakes are higher for 'us' to do so.

**javawocky** · 4th February 2011, 10:05

Originally Posted by sinfull

Lol loved the first reaction, to flick left (arrrrg big twuck) Hmmm mabey not, then on the piks ! ...

Exactly what went through my mind. First instinct give yourself room to react - flick left - then brake as needed. But yes I had a little adjustment to make when a truck was blocking my escape route.

The guy in the office who raised this point took a video of the intersection this morning on his phone showing a few dodgy moves, he seams reluctant to give me the vid to post though, will keep leaning on him.

**DangerMouseNZ** · 4th February 2011, 11:02

Originally Posted by davebullet

Similar to a pet peeve of mine, is drivers who brake when driving onto a motorway on ramp. Why the fuck do they do that and make the speed differential greater which makes it even harder to merge.

Full license driving tests should be done in peak our traffic to test the mettle and awareness of the driver.

One of the most annoying things ever.. Why o why do people feel it i safer to join a motorway going slower than all the other traffic around them

**Banditbandit** · 4th February 2011, 11:23

Originally Posted by Katman

All this "it was clearly the old fuckers fault" misses the point somewhat.

These things happen and it's our responsibility to ensure that we are able to compensate for them. (As was the case in this instance).

No. It's exactly the point! The questions were asked "who has the right of way? Who is in the wrong". The answer The Red Car is exactly on the point.

I agree with you - it's our responsibility to look after our own safety - and from teh video the rider did just that ... don't highjack threads to make them about motorcycle safety ...