Benefits

[SimJen]

So how does the school leaver get steel fabrication experience?

the thing is, if we advertise for experienced people, then we get all the non-experienced ones applying.
It is difficult to get experience and you have to expect people to not want to train someone if they have a busy business and just need skilled help.
We have a young fella that comes in after school and gets experience, also we have just had a lad on a gateway course from the school thats worked with us for a few weeks.
These can lead on to apprenticeships if they are the right characters for it.
There are plenty of jobs available if they want to go looking, perhaps not enough for everybody on the benefit, but then a percentage are unemployable anyway!

[nodrog:Me]

I understand having to give money to those who cant work because they have had an accident, or need to stay at home and look after something that fell out of their vagina, or are black.

What I dont understand is why the fuck we have to give money to couples where one or both of them are working.

Your wages dont cover the cost of the next kid you want, or daycare? Toughshit, keep it in your pants then, or budget like everybody else who wants something.

[Str8 Jacket]

I understand having to give money to those who cant work because they have had an accident, or need to stay at home and look after something that fell out of their vagina, or are black.

What I dont understand is why the fuck we have to give money to couples where one or both of them are working.

Your wages dont cover the cost of the next kid you want, or daycare? Toughshit, keep it in your pants then, or budget like everybody else who wants something.

Common sense? Don't be so bloody stupid, that's been replaced by NCEA.....

[nodrog:Me]

Common sense? Don't be so bloody stupid, that's been replaced by NCEA.....

what the fuck has the space shuttle got to do with it?

[bogan]

I know a of people who just can't get work, very well presented uni graduates, applying for pretty much anything. One just got his first bit of work in over a year, teaching people how to use some new pay and display meters for two weeks (the interface is retarded ). If these guys are struggling, what hope is there for career beneficiaries who have been kicked off the dole? We won't have to pay for them anymore, but it doesn't solve anything, one could even argue crime could rise which would cost us more.

Slash minimum wage to encourage national production over exporting raw material and importing goods. Or if there are only a finite number of jobs to go around, implement some population control (sterilisation for criminals etc).

And stop the politicians selling NZ's future for a few election votes!

[Str8 Jacket]

what the fuck has the space shuttle got to do with it?

Hopefully we can use it to start transporting useless (dole bludging) citizens to outer space. Never to return.....

[nodrog:Me]

Hopefully we can use it to start transporting useless (dole bludging) citizens to outer space. Never to return.....

fucken space cadets

[avgas]

fucken spaced cadets

[Banditbandit]

Superannuation: (Yes I'm only a few years away from retiring age, so this affects me as well.) The universal superannuation was introduced when the average life span was 72 for men and 75 for women. It was collectable at age 65. This age was later dropped to 60, and then increased back to 65. The average age span is now 78 for men and 80 for women, so I would have no difficulty in seeing the age for universal superannuation raised to 67.

My undertanding was that supperannuation was originally for people who eeded it and it was means tested ... the growing middle class demanded as of right .. because they have been "paying taxes all my klife" ..

THis was trhe decision that made it unaffordable ... so MPs who retire on 80% of the their MPs salaries after three terms are also entitled to superannuation ... Don Brash is entitled to universal superannuation .. (what's his personal worth) Bob Jones is entitled to universal superannuation (what's his worth?) . Not picking on these peiople as such .. but people like that do not need universal super ...

return it to means testing ..

Unemployment: This was introduced so that a working man who for some reason is put off from his job would have a basic income while searching for a new job. It wasn't there as a wage for teenagers leaving school. So lets make this simple. No-one can apply for the dole until they have paid income tax. (ie they have been in paid employment). The amount of time they can be on the dole is limited to 10% of the amount of time that they have been in paid employment. This would stop anyone from coming straight out of school and onto the dole.

Sort of like this idea .. BUT ... When I left school (early 70s) there was a massive unemployment crisis in Godzone - 2,000 people were unemployed ... later it peaked around 200,000.

If we have more workers than jobs then the idea of not gettign the benefit until you've had a job is punative ... I'm more inclined to think the school leavers should be in training ... BUT the problem thee is that stduent allowance is less than the dole ... it should be the same .. at least then we are paying for productive labour designed to increase sklls and employability. At present we are paying a minmal amount for training and more for doing nothing ... that does not seem right to me ..

DPB: This was introduced to assist the mother who's husband had suddenly departed the marriage. It was to tide her over that difficult period where she couldn't work to support herself while staying home to raise the children. It wasn't designed to allow teenage girls to get pregnant and have the child's future paid for by the taxpayer. So lets make the DPB only payable in those cases where a women has already been in a form of marriage (or civil union) and that relationship has broken up. Sorry girls; if you are only 16 and get pregnant at high school, either put the baby up for adoption, or let your parents pay to raise the child.

Adoption is not the best answer .. and what happens if the parents refuse to support the child or the mother? And accidents do happen - to married peopel as well as unmarried people ... and what about de facto relationships? And it is most often men who create solo mothers by walking out - not women who deliberately get pregnant ...

And the other parents are expected to pay child support - have you seen the sise of child support payments still owed ? $1.8BILLION last year (http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/3882...-child-support) bet it's more now -Collecting that would go a long way to reducing our welfare budget. (Bet there's a few in this forum who owe payments ...)

Instead of hitting solo mothers what about the absent fathers who owe us, the tax payer, $1.8Billion +

And how then does the mother feed the child? Yes, I agree with a lot of what you say . but the benefit was to ensure the wealfare of the child was taken care off - not the wealthfare of the mother ..

oK. I'm ready for the flames.

SOrry to disappoint . but no flames ..

[Banditbandit]

I like that idea, maybe if more people realised that working was actually pretty good and wages were a hell of a lot better than the dole it would no longer be seen as an alternative to work. The problem is there aren't enough jobs, so does that mean kids leave school without any form of income?

WORK IS CRAP !!! Who's bright idea was that? What a stupid way to organise a society.

There is no diginity ion labour any more (well for a very few artisans and a couple of other professions there might be)

Mostly it was organised for the benefit of the capitalist class to exploit the others ... why the fuck should I value working for the man to make a profit and drive a Merc or Roller and pay me shit wages so I can barely survive ?????

[James Deuce]

Why should anybody be required to work? They're not your slaves. Who declared having a job and 'being productive' as the be all end all? What's wrong with being happy with smoking weed and hanging out with your loser mates? Who gets to label them losers in the first place? Breeders and go getters? Like they're any better?

Given those things... if society wants to build and play in their little holier than thou sand pit, they're required to support those who do not. Or they'll just take it anyway.

Who are you and wtf have you done with imdying?

[Jantar]

My undertanding was that supperannuation was originally for people who needed it and it was means tested ... .....

No. It was origionally a seperate payment made as a tax of 1/6d in the pound earned, and payable to everyone on retirement. Later that 1/6d in the pound was incorporated into the general tax take, but the super was still payable to everyone.

Means testing came in in later, and although the super was still paid to everone who retired, those who earned more than a certain sum paid an extra tax of 25% of their earnings until such time as the extra tax equalled their pension. This was later abandoned as those who did have extra income were also the ones most able to hide it in trusts etc.

[Blackshear]

Was on the dole for about 5 months looking for a job 3 years back, WINZ is seriously shit when it comes to helping people find jobs. You get a minimum of 2 jobs to choose from (And maximum as it turns out, they wouldn't let me pick more than 2 from a list of 80-100) every week, not including the 'I asked for a job at these places;' sheet.

I even had a confirmed and sealed arborist job in wellington, complete with transport and a room, but they wouldn't agree to a 2 week trial (my choice, moving down an entire country and leaving your mates/family behind etc) before I signed the dotted line. I ended up not taking it because they decided it also wasn't right for my bike to get re-reg'd and WOF'd at their expense so I could get off the dole and onto a 6-month minimum contract.

Including $70 per week rent, had to buy my own food etc, I was receiving a massive $126 to live on a week. That leaves me... Err... Well I could afford about 7 $1 soft drinks a week

[bluninja]

Not enough jobs? So why are there so many people working 48+ hours a week? If people weren't so greedy doing loads of overtime, there'd be enough working hours to go around.

[Blackshear]

Not enough jobs? So why are there so many people working 48+ hours a week? If people weren't so greedy doing loads of overtime, there'd be enough working hours to go around.

I'd be willing to bet a small amount of those doing OT would be the people who had no choice but to step down a financial rung, even further taking up more slots for school kiddies or young guys.

All I pretty much heard while hunting my ass off for a job was 'You look good, but the sad truth is that I have so many people with skills pouring out their asses, it would be illogical to not hire them.'