ESE's works engine tuner

[Frits Overmars]

Aaaargh! I'm having big issues viewing this thread. I can look at anything else on KB but For several days now when I try to visit this thread I get an 'http500' error. Finally able to get on using my phone now but can't do it from either computer at home. Am I alone?? Any suggestions.

I had exactly the same problem for a couple of weeks. Everything is fine now, without me changing anything. No clue what caused it.

....With the exhaust appearing to gain its time area with its formidable width instead of its height. Does that mean the effective duration of its power stroke is of a much longer percentage of the stroke (I hope this makes sense). Or is this cancelled out but it being positioned higher in the cylinder? It may well be a silly question so apologies, if I missed that bit in translation.

Don't you pull my leg, Husaberg. All my contributions to pit-lane are written in English (or at least that is what I tried to do). You are not going to tell me that your native language is Swedish, as your nickname might suggest, huh? Well, in case you simply overlooked it, here is a link right to the answer you asked for:
http://www.pit-lane.biz/t117p333-gp125-caracteristiques-aprilia-rsa

I will also attach some pics of the 50 cc version of my cylinder, including a vertical journey through the model that shows the layout of the various ports and ducts and especially the cooling system.Try casting that!

EDIT: I just discovered I can't attach ZIP-files. The file I tried to upload contains 34 pictures; 2.27 MB in total. Any suggestions?

[Dutch Fisher]

You'd be better off registering here http://www.photobucket.com and placing the pictures there with a link

[Frits Overmars]

You'd be better off registering here http://www.photobucket.com and placing the pictures there with a link

Thanks Dutch, but there are some problems. First of all, I have seen pictures appear in the open, that could only have come from a restricted forum, where they were posted through photobucket. I want to have some control of who is getting what.
Secondly, the 'vertical journey through the model' I was talking about, would only function as it is supposed to when you can swiftly leaf through the pics instead of having to download them one at a time.

[husaberg]

I had exactly the same problem for a couple of weeks. Everything is fine now, without me changing anything. No clue what caused it.

Don't you pull my leg, Husaberg. All my contributions to pit-lane are written in English (or at least that is what I tried to do). You are not going to tell me that your native language is Swedish, as your nickname might suggest, huh? Well, in case you simply overlooked it, here is a link right to the answer you asked for:
http://www.pit-lane.biz/t117p333-gp125-caracteristiques-aprilia-rsa

Sorry Frits
My first language, indeed my only language is English (Although many years ago on occasion I have tried a little Swedish and attempted to get my tongue around the odd other euro .
I guess Its just I don't read that well.

I even had to read it another couple of times before I twigged to it and are still not sure I totally get it.
This says a lot more about my comprehension skills than your explanation though Frits.
I should possibly reread the whole forum again.
Yes my puns are pretty bad to. Much like my grammar and spelling and punctuation and capitalisation.

With regards to the forum The techy people have been making a lot of changes to it over the last couple of weeks which may account for your problems with logging on. With a bit of luck they may make it possible to insert larger images and files to the thread .

Hint hint to kiwibiker.

Either that all you could post them in pit-lane? with a link here leading to them?

[Buckets4Me]

Well I didn't let of any fireworks and I never made it to taupo
I did get very dirty
and I found a nice new 2 stroke I want KTM380


now I can see why people are going over to MX for fitness

[teriks]

Looks like a fun place to ride!
Only donwside with MX is the cleaning afterwards...

[Frits Overmars]

Here are some of the pictures. Most of them have not been shown on an open forum before.
Pictures 1 and 2 show development stages; both are several years old now.
Picture 3 shows doctor of physics Denis Klemm (left) and myself with the first 50 cc FOS cylinders. Denis was of vital importance in applying the Selective Laser Melting process that allowed me to produce the shapes I wanted.
Pictures 4, 5 and 6 show these cylinders from some different angles.

[gamma500]

Awesome cylinders, Frits!

Have you already tested those cylinders on dyno?

[Frits Overmars]

Awesome cylinders, Frits! . Have you already tested those cylinders on dyno?

Not yet, Gamma. I have deliberately postponed building crankcases until the cylinders were finished (otherwise you'll always find that you have to make unforseen changes).
At the moment we are working on ultralight, ultrashort pistons and conrod bearings that will stand the extreme rpm that the cylinder's angle*areas permit.
Other necessities, like piston pin plugs that prevent short-circuiting between transfer and exhaust ports, are being tested in other engines. So far so good.

[casal-fan]

Very interesting Frits.
Is this endeavour directed to a specific aplication, or is it just pushing the line on 2stroke alternative scavenging systems?

Awsome thread. A must read for all 2stroke fans.
Big thanks to all intervenants.

[wobbly]

Rob,re the Ignitech curve "issue".
As I said the correction factor was put into the program to allow a split to be setup in a twin cylinder engine that fires off a single trigger, as thats what I asked for.
But say if you have 15* of base advance with a curve that ramps up to say 30*, then drops to 15* at full noise.
Apply 15* of minus correction, you will still see 15-30-15 on the graph, but the actual timing seen by the engine will be 0-15-0, so what was the point of having a graphical interface
showing what the timing curve looked like in the first place.
If you need 15* of negative correction, then this is the same as having 30* of base timing ( adding 15* to the original 15*), as increasing base advance in effect retards the timing.
You see this when programming 15* base, but the strobe says its advanced by say 1*, apply 16* base and the real timing will drop back to the correct number you are looking for.
But using 30* of base timing isnt a good idea, as this is the "starting" timing seen by the engine.
It will "work" and will start with that timing - I have used the max of 39* on a RS250, as I couldnt move the lobe or recut the keyway), but it was very prone to kicking back, and
was all but impossible to push start and needed a roller.
It kicked back during practice and started in reverse at Bonneville, very embarrassing when he dropped the clutch and it shot of backwards, dropping it on the salt.
I think the Race unit only allows 30* but the normal P2 allows 40* max base advance.
One small point is that in the area off the pipe, I have found that the engine will not make much if any more power, as shown by the dyno load it will pull, but by adding a heap more timing, it will for sure
operate much , much better on part throttle response, on track.
Here is a 125 kart engine curve that made 50RWHp,and won 3 back to back 125 National titles easily.
This thing would deto like mad on part throttle at 6000 if held there, but on track it would pull out of 1st gear hairpins hard enough to spin the tyres on full throttle from the same
rpm, then rev out to 14200.
A TPS and a 3D map would achieve a better result, but I didnt have a RS125 Honda carb at the time.

[Frits Overmars]

Very interesting Frits. Is this endeavour directed to a specific aplication, or is it just pushing the line on 2stroke alternative scavenging systems?
Awsome thread. A must read for all 2stroke fans. Big thanks to all intervenants.

I did not intend to go alternative; I was just looking for a way to increase the angle*areas. And I had planned to build a 125 cc roadracer because if you want to show what you're worth, go for the strongest competion.
Alas, Dorna killed the 125 cc GP-class, so I decided to scale the design down to 50 cc.
It was the easiest conversion I ever performed: I just told SolidWorks to multiply all dimensions by 0.737 .

[dmcca]

Not sure with your setup, as you should always be firing off the lobe trailing edge ( a dropping voltage) as rising edges are prone to read
spikes ( ie noise) as a control signal.

The CR250 race file attached is the advance the engine actually sees, as soon as you apply correction what you read, on screen isnt what you get.
The base advance firing of the lobe trailing edge is the timing seen at kickover ( up to 300rpm),then the map takes effect.
Thus its advisable to have a base advance that is in the range of 10 to 20* for easy starting, and then smooth idle.

A couple of questions about the ignitech...

When you referred to firing off the trailing edge... is that set by the check boxes circled in red in the setup window below? What is the Max Advance for? Should both of these be set to second edge? I have a CR250 that im setting up with an ignitech and have been having some issues with kickback at startup so my setup must be wrong... im wondering if its to do with this synchronisation window... there is no explanation of this setting in the manual.




Also the CR250 map you posted, is that for a kart engine? heavily modified or not? Looks like its revving out a decent amount.

[wobbly]

The tick box for start advance means the trailing edge of the lobe is used for triggering, and is the advance used at first kick up to 300rpm.
If you tick the maximum advance box above, the most advance you get is the base advance PLUS the lobe length, no matter what the curve says.
This isnt normally needed, but is a safety where you have alot of noise giving false triggering.

Kicking back at startup usually means you have too much advance initially.
I try to get no more than 15* of base timing, and even retard from that after 300rpm - up to say 1500rpm, before ramping up if kickback is an issue.
If you are reversing the trigger polarity, I would go back and change the wires on the ecu, and delete the software reversal.
The ECU works better this way by using a real dropping voltage to detect the lobe trailing edge and it is more reliable.

The CR250 curve is a nearly 65Hp on PumpGas engine for an open kart and revs to 11,000 + all day - then blows to pieces.

[kiwifruit]

Rather than start a new thread i thought i'd just ask in here:

Sleeving down a water cooled TZR125 to 100cc. Anyone got any experience doing this? Any advise / direction etc gratefully received.