Why it's important not to have other road users lift their game

[Clockwork]

No mate.... Us Wellington drivers and "mature" riders were already ahead of the curve.... the rest just started to close the gap, is all.

[scumdog]

No where near 95% of drivers are "good" drivers. All too often I see bad driving:

1. People don't know how to even use their indicators properly at a roundabout.

2. Braking during, rather than before a corner.

3. Failing to keep within their own lane while cornering, cutting corners around a blind corner.

4. Failing to keep in the left lane on a multi laned road where reasonably possible.

5. Driving at 80-90kmh in a 100kmh zone, then slowing down to 70kmh in a 50kmh zone or 50kmh in a 30kmh zone when they come across a small town or road works.

6. Driving slowly and refusing to pull over to let other people past.

7. Driving at 90kmh on the open road, then increasing their speed to 110kmh in a passing lane.

The fact remains that in general, NZ drivers are bad drivers. There is no requirement for learners to be taught by a professional driving instructor, so they pick up bad habits from whichever idiot teaches them to drive.

Sadly the above fits the description of a great majority of drivers - except if I (or my workmates) is visible to them.

Add:

Rolling through stop signs

Barely slowing going through give-ways

Cutting corners when making a right-turn in town

Turn first THEN indicate.

And you've really summed up most drivers.

And dead right about crap driving standards passed on by siblings/parents teaching them to 'drive' - (more like "How to get the car moving, not to hit anything and bring it to a stop most of the time")

[neels]

"How to get the car moving, not to hit anything and bring it to a stop most of the time")

Like most things in life, there are a large number of people who are happy to meet the minimum required standard.

[caspernz]

That's the key. We are solely responsible for making it to the stage where we're too old and decrepit to ride a bike, and the fact that a significant proportion of other road users are twats is in our favour because it keeps us sharp in the same way the Taleban are such cunts to fight - they've been fighting all their lives, and usually with the odds stacked against them.

The fact that every day we face retards on the road means we constantly practice the techniques we need to stay alive to the point where they're instinctive, but I reckon 6 months of riding in a low risk environment would dull anyone's edge.

It's funny how some posters chose to focus on the percentages you used... But in essence I agree that practice makes perfect, reduce the dickhead count on the road and you may gradually relax to the point where you miss the signs of the one that could kill you.

Another approach is that riding enough clicks, ie two wheeled time on the road, in itself keeps you sharp.

Returning riders are a problem though. One of my colleagues fits into this category, with at least 15 years since road riding. Talking with him about some of the challenges he admits he's having...his approach is all wrong yet he doesn't see any need for some refresher training. Oh well, I've been open about having done some Prorider training, taken some ribbing for it (as if I care) and yet this dude is only gonna admit he needs help once he's in a hospital bed?

The average Kiwi driver (and rider) are quite poor, but also impatient, combative and talk about indecision running rife! To a point this makes them predictable, or I should say that once you've driven/ridden a few million kilometres, so you can just about see what's gonna happen before it actually does.

[Clockwork]

Sadly the above fits the description of a great majority of drivers - except if I (or my workmates) is visible to them.

Add:

Rolling through stop signs Why stop when you can see there is nothing to stop for ????

Barely slowing going through give-ways Again, if there is no one to Give Way to, whats your point???

Cutting corners when making a right-turn in town I don't do this myself but if no one else is at or approaching the intersection, who gives a fuck?

Turn first THEN indicate.

And you've really summed up most drivers.

And dead right about crap driving standards passed on by siblings/parents teaching them to 'drive' - (more like "How to get the car moving, not to hit anything and bring it to a stop most of the time")

I was taught by my parents (not to drive through stop signs, I choose to do that as an act of rebellion against against petty minded bureaucrats). I taught my kids to drive (again, not to drive through STOP signs but to look thoroughly at each and every intersection regardless of its signage).

I'm happy to stand by my driving record. So far, my kids are doing well too.

[scumdog]

I was taught by my parents (not to drive through stop signs, I choose to do that as an act of rebellion against against petty minded bureaucrats). I taught my kids to drive (again, not to drive through STOP signs but to look thoroughly at each and every intersection regardless of its signage).

I'm happy to stand by my driving record. So far, my kids are doing well too.

I've :
Never been to a crash at a Stop sign where the offending car had stopped- then driven into the car that had the right of way

Never been to a crash at a Give Way controlled intersection where the offending driver had driven through it with caution instead of blasting straight through

Never been to a crash where somebody making a right turn onto a side street hit the car rolling up to the intersection on ITS incorrect side of the road.

Funny dat...

[Highlander]

I've :
Never been to a crash at a Stop sign where the offending car had stopped- then driven into the car that had the right of way

...

I was the bike that had right of way. I nearly missed the car that had stopped at the compulsory stop then pulled out in front of me.
Two up on wet road, fortunatey l kept it upright and no one was hurt, the rest is what I pay insurance for.

Car v bike accident that you can still ride home from is a good one though eh?

[Clockwork]

I've :
Never been to a crash at a Stop sign where the offending car had stopped- then driven into the car that had the right of way

Never been to a crash at a Give Way controlled intersection where the offending driver had driven through it with caution instead of blasting straight through

Never been to a crash where somebody making a right turn onto a side street hit the car rolling up to the intersection on ITS incorrect side of the road.

Funny dat...

What a coincidence, I've never been through an intersection and been hit by a car that wasn't there!!

[koba]

I was taught by my parents (not to drive through stop signs, I choose to do that as an act of rebellion against against petty minded bureaucrats). I taught my kids to drive (again, not to drive through STOP signs but to look thoroughly at each and every intersection regardless of its signage).

I'm happy to stand by my driving record. So far, my kids are doing well too.

Not all stop signs are equal, some really do require a proper stop. I've seen and been involved in multitudes of near misses at local ones that really mean STOP!
As an interesting side point this intersection is a rare example of one that should really be a stop but is instead a give way. Any guesses why?

[Shadows]

Shit, reading that I was sure you must be in Tauranga .
ChCh drivers crap too huh?

You don't know the half of it.

[Berries]

And dead right about crap driving standards passed on by siblings/parents teaching them to 'drive' - (more like "How to get the car moving, not to hit anything and bring it to a stop most of the time")

If you can go out and not hit anything then you have pretty much succeeded in being a safe rider/driver.

[SMOKEU]

If you can go out and not hit anything then you have pretty much succeeded in being a safe rider/driver.

I know idiots who frequently txt on their phone while driving, and they think that you're only meant to use your brakes on a car when you've already started turning, not before the corner. They are so distracted by their phones and their passenger that they drive straight through stop signs and red lights without even noticing. How's that for a safe driver?

It's only a matter of "when", that their luck finally runs out and they kill an innocent person or write themselves off into the path of an oncoming truck or into a power pole.

[shrub]

I was taught by my parents (not to drive through stop signs, I choose to do that as an act of rebellion against against petty minded bureaucrats). I taught my kids to drive (again, not to drive through STOP signs but to look thoroughly at each and every intersection regardless of its signage).

I'm happy to stand by my driving record. So far, my kids are doing well too.

Thank you, as part of the 5% you help me keep my game up.

[shrub]

It's funny how some posters chose to focus on the percentages you used... But in essence I agree that practice makes perfect, reduce the dickhead count on the road and you may gradually relax to the point where you miss the signs of the one that could kill you.

Another approach is that riding enough clicks, ie two wheeled time on the road, in itself keeps you sharp.

Returning riders are a problem though. One of my colleagues fits into this category, with at least 15 years since road riding. Talking with him about some of the challenges he admits he's having...his approach is all wrong yet he doesn't see any need for some refresher training. Oh well, I've been open about having done some Prorider training, taken some ribbing for it (as if I care) and yet this dude is only gonna admit he needs help once he's in a hospital bed?

The average Kiwi driver (and rider) are quite poor, but also impatient, combative and talk about indecision running rife! To a point this makes them predictable, or I should say that once you've driven/ridden a few million kilometres, so you can just about see what's gonna happen before it actually does.

Yeah, the 5% was a figure I plucked from my arse - it may be 1%, it may be 10%, but who cares. The fact that I am still alive and have never had an off that was caused by anyone else suggests that most people are safe enough most of the time. If not, I would be well dead by now given how much time I spend in traffic on my bike.

But you're right, practice is the biggest thing. I find that if I haven't been riding for even a couple of weeks my riding is crap for the first half hour or so until I pick it up. Any sportsman or musician is constantly practicing and training, even off season, because they know that the moment they stop their game drops. The difference is that the lead guitarist in a band is unlikely to die if he plays a few dud notes.

As an aside, I reckon one of the reasons there are so many crashes in holiday season is because most of the people hauling the Pajero full of kids up State Highway 1 haven't travelled faster than 70 kmh since last holidays and fuck up.

[Clockwork]

Not all stop signs are equal, some really do require a proper stop. I've seen and been involved in multitudes of near misses at local ones that really mean STOP!
As an interesting side point this intersection is a rare example of one that should really be a stop but is instead a give way. Any guesses why?

I agree, One of several such intersections throughout Upper Hutt that should be compulsory stop. You simply cannot see if there are any pedestrians about to walk out from behind those adjacent buildings!! In this, case that intersection is used mainly by the local constabulary to exit their car park.

And yet Upper Hutt is full of compulsory stop intersections where the visibility in both directions is fine!