100 bhp is all I need debate - again

[ducatilover]

I've watched a husband and wife team make Ducati riders cry on the Rimutakas on their ex-Army KLX250s. Supposed to be 20-something-hp, but after decades of being tortured, more like 12hp. With shocks installed upside down.

I think you guys are a bunch of spoiled cry-babies. It's not about the hp, all you need is a bike.

I reckon I could take a CT90 on with my GN.

[mossy1200]

I reckon I could take a CT90 on with my GN.

Or a MT01 also

[ducatilover]

Or a MT01 also

I have a bike, so I'll win.

Wait, whut?

[Big Dave]

I reckon I could take a CT90 with my GN.

In the cornhole as it ran over you.

[ducatilover]

In the cornhole as it ran over you.

[GrayWolf]

dunno if refined is the right word. basically it just wasnt as fun as the brand new crossplane I rode back to back. crossplane just seemed more fun.
If I was looking for a track bike, id go the beemer, it would be easier to go faster
for the road Id get the yamaha, Id have more fun, more of the time. it just felt like it had more character. it was bigger, heavier, felt heavier in the corners, and required more rider input to do the same thing, to me it felt more like I had achieved the result when riding the yam, in the beemer though, I felt more like a passenger, the bike just made it a bit too easy.

just my opinion, and I have no doubt there are plenty out there that disagree with me.

Now this I find confusing... you liked the cross plane as it felt heavier, felt heavier in corners and required more rider input..... yet the MT is boring,,, but at 260+kg fully wet,, it is a heavy bike that still requires 'rider input'.... so following that logic,, an R1 which is light, flickable, easy to throw round in bends and is highly suited to the race track??? yet you own one!!!!

Also i do get your point of wanting vibes etc... but try owning a bike that vibrates full time.. Like a couple of old bonnevilles, after a few hundred K's a few times trust me that vibration is nothing other than a pain in the ass..... bits fall off, hands tingle, feet tingle, mirrors (if they stay attached) are useless. This also brings up another point? IF HP is so critical, why is it that low HP cruisers, Triumphs, HD's and Guzzi 750's etc are selling in large numbers? nothing there tops 100bhp. OH and as an historical point the MT has as much HP as the original 4cyl King, the Z1 900. The worlds fasted production bike for over 30 years was also under 100bhp... The mighty Vincent!

[98tls]

Also i do get your point of wanting vibes etc... but try owning a bike that vibrates full time.. Like a couple of old bonnevilles, after a few hundred K's a few times trust me that vibration is nothing other than a pain in the ass..... bits fall off, hands tingle, feet tingle, mirrors (if they stay attached) are useless. This also brings up another point? IF HP is so critical, why is it that low HP cruisers, Triumphs, HD's and Guzzi 750's etc are selling in large numbers? nothing there tops 100bhp.!

Possibly because the average age of motorcyclists is rising mate and with age comes blah blah....Internet forums and HP threads always prove worthy of a few laughs really,theres a thread on here re the SV1000 which provided a few for me anyway ie the suspensions crap etc etc the bottom line is anybody with real ability on 2 wheels will go point to point on the roads that matter onboard an SV or even older than the average bloke onboard anything he cares to wobble out the new bike showroom on period,few will care to admit that though sitting in front of a computer screen.

[tigertim20]

Now this I find confusing... you liked the cross plane as it felt heavier, felt heavier in corners and required more rider input..... yet the MT is boring,,, but at 260+kg fully wet,, it is a heavy bike that still requires 'rider input'.... so following that logic,, an R1 which is light, flickable, easy to throw round in bends and is highly suited to the race track??? yet you own one!!!!

Also i do get your point of wanting vibes etc... but try owning a bike that vibrates full time.. Like a couple of old bonnevilles, after a few hundred K's a few times trust me that vibration is nothing other than a pain in the ass..... bits fall off, hands tingle, feet tingle, mirrors (if they stay attached) are useless. This also brings up another point? IF HP is so critical, why is it that low HP cruisers, Triumphs, HD's and Guzzi 750's etc are selling in large numbers? nothing there tops 100bhp. OH and as an historical point the MT has as much HP as the original 4cyl King, the Z1 900. The worlds fasted production bike for over 30 years was also under 100bhp... The mighty Vincent!

My liking for the crossplane wasnt necessarily because it felt heavier, it was just one aspect of the overall experience of riding the bike
the mt I didnt like because it lacked soul, and frankly, the MT did not feel anywhere near as heavy as it really is, its incredibly flickable.
beemer = light, fast as hell, but no soul
MT = toyota corolla on 2 wheels, does everything just fine, but boring
the crossplane had a uniqueness to the sounds, vibration, delivery, everything.

If you look back youll see that Ive not said at any point that HP is critical - of the 3 bikes, the beemer has the most HP by quite a way, and I didnt like it.
What I have said, is that its not about whether or not you NEED it. you dont NEED a car over 1.5 litres either, you dont NEED a bike at all, in fact you could probably get by on public transport.
horses for courses, I seldon use all the power of my bike, but I LIKE having it.

I think the argument of 'do you need xxx HP' is redundant - who am I to tell you how much power you need? or you me?
we ride what we want to ride because we have our own tastes.

as for the MT matching the power of the Z1 900, well Ill take your word on the numbers, but if you took ten different bikes that all had the same HP rating, youd find they all had different quarter mile times, different top speeds, different braking distances, different 80-130 times etc etc - there is so much more to the equation than HP - I cannot understand the intense focus on HP all the time. what about power to weight, what about centre of gravity, what about torque? these things affect your ride and your experience much much more than a max hp number on any bike.

[James Deuce]

Throttle connection to right hand is everything. There is nothing worse than that modern abomination of the closed throttle to open throttle "flat-spot". It isn't a flat spot, it's nothing straight to 5%. It doesn't matter how much hp or how many torques a bike has, if you can't smoothly transition from a closed throttle to a linear application of power, it needs to be set on fire, shot, crushed, and then blown up. Then posted back to the manufacturer with a demand for a refund.

[BMWST?]

Throttle connection to right hand is everything. There is nothing worse than that modern abomination of the closed throttle to open throttle "flat-spot". It isn't a flat spot, it's nothing straight to 5%. It doesn't matter how much hp or how many torques a bike has, if you can't smoothly transition from a closed throttle to a linear application of power, it needs to be set on fire, shot, crushed, and then blown up. Then posted back to the manufacturer with a demand for a refund.

thats why a test ride is mandatory when buying a bike

[porky]

Throttle connection to right hand is everything. There is nothing worse than that modern abomination of the closed throttle to open throttle "flat-spot". It isn't a flat spot, it's nothing straight to 5%. It doesn't matter how much hp or how many torques a bike has, if you can't smoothly transition from a closed throttle to a linear application of power, it needs to be set on fire, shot, crushed, and then blown up. Then posted back to the manufacturer with a demand for a refund.

I think you will find the hp follows the talk....torque......and the flat spot preceeds the talk...torque...........otherwise refered to as the...........


MT = corrolla on two wheels.....yeah right and the Gn = a shelby cobra?????

[mossy1200]

I think you will find the hp follows the talk....torque......and the flat spot preceeds the talk...torque...........otherwise refered to as the...........


MT = corrolla on two wheels.....yeah right and the Gn = a shelby cobra?????

I agree. My MT is more like a diesel turbo Ford Courier Ute.

[James Deuce]

That's not the issue at all. Some modern FI systems simply turn the fuel off when you close the throttle. Manufacturers are getting better at ameliorating this as it is simply an emissions lark, but some companies still do this with their cheaper FI systems. Keep fuel going to one cylinder and the problem is fixed. I really hate that elastic feeling ride-by-wire throttle controllers have too.

By contrast, what I ask the RVF for, I get. Now. 4 carbs you see, and yet they're supposed to be a horrible compromise. Not for "feel" they're not.

HP is a function of torque.

HP = rpm x T(torque)
5252(constant)

[Big Dave]

T I really hate that elastic feeling ride-by-wire throttle controllers have too.

[Andy67]

beemer = light, fast as hell, but no soul.

I think the Soul ugrade is included as part of the the sports package and not factory standard in the base model.