The rear brake. Who uses it?

[Drew]

rear brake with to much power or lack of feal as some may put it, bleed AIR into the system so it works as a chassis ballancing tool,but not enough power to lock up the rear wheel but will still help reduce speed as it is intended

You're joking right?

You wan't to add something that expands when heated, to a system that gets fucken hot?

Down sizing the master cylinder gives more 'feel' (and braking power some might be surprised to learn), and doesn't end with constant binding and a smoking hot disk.

[Shaun Harris]

You're joking right?

You wan't to add something that expands when heated, to a system that gets fucken hot?

Down sizing the master cylinder gives more 'feel' (and braking power some might be surprised to learn), and doesn't end with constant binding and a smoking hot disk.

No I am not, and this technique won me many nz races as well as 2x TT wins and my technique is free, just what all kiwi tight arses want haha

[george formby]

No I am not, and this technique won me many nz races as well as 2x TT wins and my technique is free, just what all kiwi tight arses want haha

Really enjoyin this thread. Never been on a track but I have learned to use the rear brake religiously when I ride. A combination of big, senseless feet, thick soles & a plastic back tire had me leaving darkies all over Northland initially.
A bit of time with a racer setting my bike up properly & adjusting levers to where they work as I want them too has made a world of difference. No more accidental lock ups & more consistency braking.

That's it from the cheap seats. As you were.

[Shaun Harris]

Really enjoyin this thread. Never been on a track but I have learned to use the rear brake religiously when I ride. A combination of big, senseless feet, thick soles & a plastic back tire had me leaving darkies all over Northland initially.
A bit of time with a racer setting my bike up properly & adjusting levers to where they work as I want them too has made a world of difference. No more accidental lock ups & more consistency braking.

That's it from the cheap seats. As you were.

A huge part of it as you say is setting up the leavers into positions that work for you as we are all different, kinda like suspension set up

[george formby]

A huge part of it as you say is setting up the leavers into positions that work for you as we are all different, kinda like suspension set up

It's taken me 30 years to learn that.

[Mental Trousers]

Would cutting out sections of the pads do the same thing and keep lever feel?

It's dodgy doing that cos you risk the pad breaking up and chunks jamming.

rear brake with to much power or lack of feal as some may put it, bleed AIR into the system so it works as a chassis ballancing tool,but not enough power to lock up the rear wheel but will still help reduce speed as it is intended

I had a bike with 6 pots that was much better with old brake fluid that hadn't been bled. As soon as the brake fluid was changed and the system bled the brakes were really touchy and had no feel at all. It had braided lines on it and changing back to rubber lines made a huge improvement in the feel and confidence levels.

A little bit of give, whether it's air/the lines/old fluid/whatever, is actually a good thing sometimes.

NOTE I don't recommend trying anything like this. Improving the brakes is (almost) always better and safer.

[Dave-]

Ok, wise guys.

What about using the rear brake to slow the rear wheel down?

It represents one of the largest (if not the largest) gyroscopic forces on the bike, therefore it really doesn't want to lean over. This is irrespective of its contact with the ground.

[george formby]

Ok, wise guys.

What about using the rear brake to slow the rear wheel down?

It represents one of the largest (if not the largest) gyroscopic forces on the bike, therefore it really doesn't want to lean over. This is irrespective of its contact with the ground.

We practice moto gymkhana and use the rear brake to control speed.
Both brakes to slow down & start turn, front released as lean angle & lock increases, maintain revs, rear brake still on to hit apex, release to stand bike up. Works like a charm! No clutch used. No extra throttle until bike starts to stand up.
Brake & disc gets really hot if you don't release it properly...

[Dave-]

We practice moto gymkhana and use the rear brake to control speed.
Both brakes to slow down & start turn, front released as lean angle & lock increases, maintain revs, rear brake still on to hit apex, release to stand bike up. Works like a charm! No clutch used. No extra throttle until bike starts to stand up.
Brake & disc gets really hot if you don't release it properly...

What's the top and average speed one might achieve in gymkhana?

Your gyroscopic effect might be negligible (purely conjecture, I haven't even worked out the angular momentum)

[Mental Trousers]

A video of Nicky Hayden pissing about on the 2013 Ducati Hypermotard. Most interesting is how often he's slipping the clutch, not only into corners like a mechanical slipper clutch does, but all the way through the entire corner and on the exit as well.

[10bikekid]

Practise all you like. If you're riding along minding your own business and a truck unexpectedly pulled out in front of you I guarantee you would (at least initially) grab a handful and stomp on the rear.

Happened to me and I did pretty much that,

Was travelling at about 110kph on my KTM950ADV when the truck that had pulled to the shoulder (presumable to let us by) turned in on me, I went into Survival shut-down and was really a passenger, my instincts acted while I just saw still frames of the event like time had slowed down and as I slowed I had to turn to miss the side of the truck while still braking in panic mode eventually the front locked but was nearly at a stop and bike flopped onto the hard side pannier and skidded along a little, I ended up staring at the face of the bewilder driver who seemed more freaked out than me, had about 1 metre to spare and did lock both wheels a bit but lived.

My riding buddies who were behind couldn't pull up in front of me (cause they weren't going to die) and shot past the truck on the other side, had to stop them tearing the driver to bits and to explain how I was able to stop so quick

Sometimes you gota do what you got to do and as Glen said Both brakes seemed to work

[Shaun Harris]

A video of Nicky Hayden pissing about on the 2013 Ducati Hypermotard. Most interesting is how often he's slipping the clutch, not only into corners like a mechanical slipper clutch does, but all the way through the entire corner and on the exit as well.

The clutch has more usage than the average rider realises man. Doohan lived on it to control wheel spin

[richban]

The clutch has more usage than the average rider realises man. Doohan lived on it to control wheel spin

On sunday I was really wanting to go through Pepsi a gear up. It was just not happening as the 2 smoke was just out of its happy place. I thought I should just man up and go really fast in, but that ended in some rumble strip action and getting smoked. So bring in some nice clutch abuse and it was all coming together. Must buy some more plates. Its gunna get a hammering.

Didn't touch the rear brake all day. ha ha. Will try that next time.

[george formby]

What's the top and average speed one might achieve in gymkhana?

Your gyroscopic effect might be negligible (purely conjecture, I haven't even worked out the angular momentum)

Speed? What is this you speak of?
Gymkhana is slow. Prolly never get over 60kmh & turns are 15-20 kmh but full lock & full lean. Gyroscopic effect increases with speed but it is there regardless.
One of the things taught is that what works at 20kph also works at 120kph etc.

[cowpoos]

I used just before applying the front to lower the rear as much as poss to aid keeping rear on ground whilst heavy breaking,

Yep...a lot of dirt riders hit the rear just before the front too. Helps the bike [dirt bike that is] track while braking into a corner in that case. You example makes plenty of sense.

I had a bad track habbit [so I was told] of holding the rear brake on a bit till I was well out of the corner...used to help with sudden wheel spin on dirt bike...was just a habbit I carried on with in my mediocre racing.