Labour leadership

[Banditbandit]

So, how are we feeling about a Grant Robertson/Jacinda Ardern ticket?

One would give you a blow job - both of them I'd be scared to ask for one ..

[HenryDorsetCase]

One would give you a blow job - both of them I'd be scared to ask for one ..

as if it matters. Had blow job = win.

If I close my eyes......

[youtube]1BrTn16_0AY[/youtube]

also I just have to point out that the misogynistic and homophobic slant of your post, couple with your rabid communistic tendencies, reveals the true depth of the horror that is the Labour party in 2014. If you don't mind my saying.

[Ocean1]

Why don't the unions form their own party?: https://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/top-st...e-poor-result/

MMP was made for them!

well they kind of did. In 1908.

the big issue is that the country has changed so much.... and unions represent <20% of workers now. Yet they hire and fire leaders of the labour party. And the gay demographic is a real one, and its another faction.

Shane Jones would have been a great leader, except that he did not and never would have union or gay support. But actual people loved him

My personal view is that the labour party is done. The greens will expand and further soften their fundy principles and will morph into the "social justice" side (i.e. Left) while retaining the mainstream environmental cred. The clear model is Ze Cherman Green party, and they have been stunningly successful. So much so that pretty much all the Yrpn Green parties are following suit.

National under MMP has clearly moved from the right wing (which are now mainstream), and pinched the good centrist labour policies, et viola, "the natural party of gubblemunt"

To a student of the political sciences (which I was, once, but now am not) it is fascinating.

If you have stapled your colours to a particular mast (particularly a red one) then it is disconcerting at best, disastrous at worst.

Yeah, pretty much.

A philosophy that doesn't work embedded into a political party that didn't work. National have supplanted Labour as the mainstream left, and good riddance to 'em.

[flashg]

Cunliffe resigned but will put his hat in the ring for another go WTF. The longer he stay's the more he helps National (that's good)

[caseye]

News Flash, He won't be back as Leader, ever, the country and his ex colleagues are aware he's poison to most ordinary New Zealanders, who know a fake when they see one.

[fridayflash]

nats have been through it too, english got the shove after he failed to deliver at election time. cuntlippes certainly wasnt the man for the job, looks like fancy boy grant robertson is a contender, with ardern as his wingman . i cant see how theyll get over the line in three years time to be honest

[flashg]

Not sure the country is ready for a gay prime minister. The islanders in NZ won't vote for him, they made that clear already

[Swoop]

News Flash, He won't be back as Leader, ever

The in-fighting continues on tonight's news. A real shame that he isn't staying on...

What is amazing, is the 1/3rd percentage (of total labour vote) of the unions, when electing a new leader.
If national had an open and clearly stated criteria, that farmers and also business owners held a large percentage of the voting process, the leftists' would be foaming at the mouth!
Quite a contrast in procedure really.

[oldrider]

One good thing about MMP is that all these little party factions and quangos can form their own little parties and stand on their own "principals"!

Then they can be independent and stop riding on the coat tails of things they don't believe in and focus on what they really stand for!

Thats what Tariana Turia had the guts to do and I take my hat off to her, pity we didn't have more people like her in this country!

[BMWST?]

Nicky Hager is exactly what I am on about. He published a book based around stolen emails & gave none of targets of his book the right of reply. Where is the balance in that .
Clark called him ' a sanctimonious little creep ' after corn gate .
I do not take him seriously, he is not an unbiased investigative journalist , he twists facts to suit whichever political barrow he is currently pushing.

he has never pretended to be unbiased.His vie provides some balance to the overall media noise

[Winston001]

Much as I enjoy KB opinions, on the subject of David Cunliffe and the Labour Party I pay regard to left wing commentators.

Chris Trotter says Cunliffe is dead. It must be painful for him to say that because he's been a hard left supporter since Otago university days.

Labour stalwart Dr Brian Edwards says that David Cunliffe did not have the common touch. In his words Cunliffe was theatrical, even Shakespearean in his oratory and very impressive but he didn't look people in the eye and talk to them. By contrast that is what John Key excels at.

I've done a lot of public speaking over the years and its no easy thing. In time I learnt to put down my notes and talk to the people in front of me. Cunliffe needed to do that.

On election night TV3 someone suggested that Cunliffe looked like he had four media minders and every time he fronted up, was acting a part but pulled in different directions. That was exactly my impression.

[Winston001]

Wut the heck, while I'm ranting...

David Cunliffe suffers from the same flaw as Judith Collins (whom I admire but...dunno) which is Hubris. Vanity. Absolute total self-belief. Never apologise never admit you were wrong.

I'll reserve judgment on Judith (a sideshow) but David Cunliffe lacks humility and that is a serious character flaw. Helen Clark looked the same but no - she fronted the 2008 loss immediately and resigned. Respect.

[Winston001]

My opinion:

Labour was the party of intellectuals, the forward thinkers, people who looked around them and wanted a flat society. Equality for all. No uber-rich and noone in poverty.

Those are still lofty and worthy ideals.

However today Labour stands for uplifting tiny minority interests, a political activism which might well be admired in Singapore, Malaysia, and India where such interests are totally ignored. But in New Zealand which is a benign tolerant society the battle has already been won.

Quite why David Cunliffe apologised for being a man is beyond my comprehension. There simply aren't Labour male voters who get that. Certainly on an intellectual level we can understand what he was saying but Labour voters don't parse clever stuff from their leader. Nor should they.

[oldrider]

Much as I enjoy KB opinions, on the subject of David Cunliffe and the Labour Party I pay regard to left wing commentators.

Chris Trotter says Cunliffe is dead. It must be painful for him to say that because he's been a hard left supporter since Otago university days.

Labour stalwart Dr Brian Edwards says that David Cunliffe did not have the common touch. In his words Cunliffe was theatrical, even Shakespearean in his oratory and very impressive but he didn't look people in the eye and talk to them. By contrast that is what John Key excels at.

I've done a lot of public speaking over the years and its no easy thing. In time I learnt to put down my notes and talk to the people in front of me. Cunliffe needed to do that.

On election night TV3 someone suggested that Cunliffe looked like he had four media minders and every time he fronted up, was acting a part but pulled in different directions. That was exactly my impression.

Wut the heck, while I'm ranting...

David Cunliffe suffers from the same flaw as Judith Collins (whom I admire but...dunno) which is Hubris. Vanity. Absolute total self-belief. Never apologise never admit you were wrong.

I'll reserve judgment on Judith (a sideshow) but David Cunliffe lacks humility and that is a serious character flaw. Helen Clark looked the same but no - she fronted the 2008 loss immediately and resigned. Respect.

My opinion:

Labour was the party of intellectuals, the forward thinkers, people who looked around them and wanted a flat society. Equality for all. No uber-rich and noone in poverty.

Those are still lofty and worthy ideals.

However today Labour stands for uplifting tiny minority interests, a political activism which might well be admired in Singapore, Malaysia, and India where such interests are totally ignored. But in New Zealand which is a benign tolerant society the battle has already been won.

Quite why David Cunliffe apologised for being a man is beyond my comprehension. There simply aren't Labour male voters who get that. Certainly on an intellectual level we can understand what he was saying but Labour voters don't parse clever stuff from their leader. Nor should they.

Or to put it mildly ... Caesar was ambitious!

[husaberg]

Simply put labour needs rebranding.
No one knows what makes it different what it's platform now actually is.
National and the right wing in general controls the media.
So getting a brand and a leader out there is going to be difficult.
I am not sure they have anyone who fits the bill and has charisma.