Anarchy is not what you think it is

[swbarnett]

There are still rules and responses ...and basic forms of censure.

Not on the internet. You're talking about social media. Although that is on the internet it is not the same thing.

Site rules may vary between sites ... but there is always someone that controls what is presented ... and remain visible. And/or ... who sees it.

Again, this is social media. There's nothing stopping you creating your own web site (or whatever else you want to put on the internet).

[Virago]

...There's nothing stopping you creating your own web site (or whatever else you want to put on the internet).

Try creating a child porn site and see what happens. The internet is not without rules and controls.

[Berries]

Yes it is.

[Big Dog]

While the internet appears anarchic it it impossible to present content without following the rules needed to comply with thousands of rules.
IP rules, code, local laws, international laws, registration, all loosely governed by a series of standards committees so that you can see "Who is impaling Sarah Palin" without accidentally loading "Sesame Street" and vice versa.
Take away those governing bodies and see what happens.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[TheDemonLord]

Try creating a child porn site and see what happens. The internet is not without rules and controls.

It is a Sad fact that in Data Havens, such sites are allowed to exist.

FWIW - generally the way that such sites are dealt with is through the 'importation' of the illicit material by the users of the site to their PCs (and so into the Jurisdiction of the country they reside in), then going after the person who hosts the site (who resides in a country) and going after them.

If we are going to discuss the Internet and its concept as an Anarchy - then I vote the thread be split - I have much to say on this topic (it is one near and dear to me)

[swbarnett]

Try creating a child porn site and see what happens. The internet is not without rules and controls.

Depends on which country the server is in.

[swbarnett]

Take away those governing bodies and see what happens.

I never said the internet wasn't governed. Just not in any way that controls what you can present to the world.

[Big Dog]

I suspect the owners of thepiratebay.com and Kim Dotcom may disagree with you.

Or the solo mum that got done for sharing Rihanna songs last year.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[swbarnett]

I suspect the owners of thepiratebay.com and Kim Dotcom may disagree with you.

Or the solo mum that got done for sharing Rihanna songs last year.

This is not a function of the internet. It's a function of standard copyright laws. The internet is only the medium.

[Big Dog]

This is not a function of the internet. It's a function of standard copyright laws. The internet is only the medium.

This is still coersive government.

Sure there is no one government that oversees the whole internet, but each and every facet is governed.
The existence of child porn sites is not an example of a lack of governance any more than a gang selling meth is proof of a lack of government in NZ.
The Dark Net is no different to any other organised crime syndicate except that most participants have never met their contemporaries and would not know them by name or on sight.

If I start putting up hate speach on a blog I can expect most hosts to reconsider my custom unless I self host.
IF I start advocating violence I can expect to be scritinised by my government.

We have a degree of freedom of expression but there are boundaries to what can be said by who and to whom before you find your self on the loud end of a firearm at dawn.

Here in NZ we have quite a lot of freedom to say what we want without fear of reproach other internet users are not so lucky. That does not in itself meant there is no coercive government here, just that it chooses to flex its muscles infrequently.

[TheDemonLord]

This is still coersive government.

Sure there is no one government that oversees the whole internet, but each and every facet is governed.
The existence of child porn sites is not an example of a lack of governance any more than a gang selling meth is proof of a lack of government in NZ.
The Dark Net is no different to any other organised crime syndicate except that most participants have never met their contemporaries and would not know them by name or on sight.

If I start putting up hate speach on a blog I can expect most hosts to reconsider my custom unless I self host.
IF I start advocating violence I can expect to be scritinised by my government.

We have a degree of freedom of expression but there are boundaries to what can be said by who and to whom before you find your self on the loud end of a firearm at dawn.

Here in NZ we have quite a lot of freedom to say what we want without fear of reproach other internet users are not so lucky. That does not in itself meant there is no coercive government here, just that it chooses to flex its muscles infrequently.

Yeah.... Nah...

Think of the Internet like the open ocean - no one country can enforce their laws over the open ocean - however countries do have territorial waters where they can enforce laws. A country can also enforce laws over Physical equipment that is located within its borders - but that is not the same as enforcing law over the internet. The closest thing to governance that the Internet has is the IETF - however they only concern themselves with writing standards for Protocols (including the April Fool's day RFC) and maintaining Net-Neutrality (which is that all traffic is treated equally by the internet)

[SPman]

Anarchy is the lack of hierachy - to talk of anarchic rules, or governments is rather beside the point. Governments, or control of any kind is hierachical. An official organisation of anarchists, is, by it's nature, not anarchy! Anarchy is about mutual cooperation and works very well in nature.

Peter Kropotkin was perhaps one of the major subscribers to anarchism as a way of life and wrote many articles and books on the principle at the turn of the 20th century.
(We must shed the old stereotype of anarchists as bearded bomb throwers furtively stalking about city streets at night. Kropotkin was a genial man, almost saintly according to some, who promoted a vision of small communities setting their own standards by consensus for the benefit of all, thereby eliminating the need for most functions of a central government.) - Stephen Jay Gould https://www.marxists.org/subject/sci.../kropotkin.htm

https://www.marxists.org/reference/a...opotkin-peter/

Dmitri Orlov condenses a lot of Kropotkin's thinking on anarchy in "The Five Stages Of Collapse".

[flyingcrocodile46]

Anarchy is the lack of hierachy - to talk of anarchic rules, or governments is rather beside the point. Governments, or control of any kind is hierachical. An official organisation of anarchists, is, by it's nature, not anarchy! Anarchy is about mutual cooperation and works very well in nature.

Exactly right. It is simply a lack of externally regulated order. Lack of externally regulated order allows the maximum efficiency of spontaneous order to occur. A good explanation of how this occurs is talked about in this video. Surprisingly, the most intense and potentially chaotic traffic congestion is where its best effect are well demonstrated. See the video for a more detailed explanation then think of those crazy Asians intersections where anarchy rules and ... where's the chaos?

https://youtu.be/Vbb2_Yq0-Po

[sidecar bob]

Exactly right. It is simply a lack of externally regulated order. Lack of externally regulated order allows the maximum efficiency of spontaneous order to occur. A good explanation of how this occurs is talked about in this video. Surprisingly, the most intense and potentially chaotic traffic congestion is where its best effect are well demonstrated. See the video for a more detailed explanation then think of those crazy Asians intersections where anarchy rules and ... where's the chaos?

https://youtu.be/Vbb2_Yq0-Po

You're a fuckin tard wasting you're life dreaming of fanciful shit that will never work or happen in real life. Why don't you concentrate on things that are worth the time & mind space? It would be more beneficial to you & the rest of the world at large.

[mashman]

You're a fuckin tard wasting you're life dreaming of fanciful shit that will never work or happen in real life. Why don't you concentrate on things that are worth the time & mind space? It would be more beneficial to you & the rest of the world at large.

... I believe what was provided shows that it's already working and it is indeed happening in real life. You should concentrate on getting your head removed from your arse. If you club in with ocean and oscar you guys could probably get a decent discount