Life is cheap

[husaberg]

Judges are not permitted to 'lead' a jury.

Judges instruct a jury.

[Katman]

Judges instruct a jury.

They do not instruct the jury as to what their verdict should be.

They are not even allowed to 'imply' what they think the verdict should be.

[husaberg]

You seem to be forgetting that the ultimate decision came down to a jury of our peers.
The judge and the lawyers didn't hand out the verdict.

I am not forgetting that at all. Juries take direction and cues from the judge & the lawyers. The consistent elements of the legal system are the police, the prosecutors, the judge and the lawyers. Juries come and go.

I need a reality check. I am debating with Katman? what a waste of time and oxygen. .

Hey, I'm just pointing out your mistakes.
You could learn something or you could sulk.
Your choice.

Judges decide what evidence is admissible, lawyers decide what charges will be laid and what deals will be done.
Jurors weigh up the evidence that is presented to them with instructions from the Judge as to what to consider and what to put aside.
As RDJ said though, this is Katman logic does not need apply.

Judges are not permitted to 'lead' a jury.

Judges instruct a jury.

They do not instruct the jury as to what their verdict should be.
They are not even allowed to 'imply' what they think the verdict should be.

Judges decide what evidence is admissible, lawyers decide what charges will be laid and what deals will be done.
Jurors weigh up the evidence that is presented to them with instructions from the Judge as to what to consider and what to put aside.
As RDJ said though, this is Katman logic does not need apply.

Katman, You would have to be completely fucking brain dead......... each one of your posts is clear evidence that you father should have had a wank rather than a fuck.

[mada]

Get caught at the airport with some drugs in your shoe sole and you get 15 - 18 years in jail.

Rob and murder someone at knife point and you get a jail free card.

New Zealand Justice #1.

A lot of murders are related to meth though - which is why it should attract a stiff sentence. (not defending the low sentences dished out for manslaughter).

Problem with NZ's justice system regarding homicide is there is only three options - not guilty, manslaughter, and murder.

Manslaughter doesn't give much lee way when it comes to recognising the difference between someone who killed unintentionally thinking that their actions were unlikely to cause death/grievous bodily harm - like the naval rating who knocked out the Indian fella in town with one hit - the victim then hit his head and died, compared to those who do know their actions have high probability eg. taking a fucking knife and stabbing someone. Murder is clear in that an intention to kill needs to be proven. Sentencing will probably reflect the difference. But they really need to change the offences, and be like the States in terms of having 1st degree murder, 2nd degree etc. And there needs to be a lot more heavier sentences for premeditated violence in general - as most the time when people survive but victims are left brain damaged, handicapped, whatever, offenders get a slap on the wrist.

[Katman]

Katman, You would have to be completely fucking brain dead......... each one of your posts is clear evidence that you father should have had a wank rather than a fuck.

Don't worry cunt - we'll come face to face one day.

[husaberg]

Don't worry cunt - we'll come face to face one day.

here's my boots..... you will note I are not quaking inside them.

Ps I don't think being able to see you, could make you appear any smarter.

[jasonu]

Don't worry cunt - we'll come face to face one day.

Bring your GoPro and post the video here.

[The Reibz]

KB Scrapz vol one. I'll organise a venue and some kegs...

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/ar...ectid=10695705
My old lady knows this woman. Shot her husband and got 12 months home d.

[oldrider]

KB Scrapz vol one. I'll organise a venue and some kegs...

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/ar...ectid=10695705
My old lady knows this woman. Shot her husband and got 12 months home d.

Hmmmm - mixed emotions on this one - would need to know a lot more actual fact to be able to even consider merit of judgement!

Sounds extremely sad to live life like that - there must have been some happiness somewhere along the line surely! - Interesting post Reibz.

[Mike.Gayner]

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/ar...ectid=10695705
My old lady knows this woman. Shot her husband and got 12 months home d.

That's......not quite as clear cut as you're trying to make it sound.

She killed her husband with a single shotgun blast after he threw a bottle of spirits at her, tried to throttle her and told her "I'll gut you like a fish".

[MD]

from what i have heard the boys parents should have been in the dock with them

In DomPost today it seems the father was already behind bars. He's been held in custody since 2013 for a vicious mongrel mob home invasion.

More proof that we need sterilisation of these violent crims and evil bludgers that prey on society, all the while living of the good will of the very society they attack (Tax payers for one). Dompost said the father had 10 kids all requiring CYF upbringing. Just how much money has the state wasted on this tribe so far? And the next generation, and the one after that becuase it's very unlikely they will turn out hard working law abiding good samaritans. If each spits out 10 kids we will be supporting 1000 violent budgers within 30 odd years from this one crim.

I feel for the victims family. The jury has victimised them again and should be charged with inflicting cruelty and punishment on others.

[swarfie]

In the Stuff article it stated that the grandmother of the 13 year old (that it looks like, got off scot free) had strung up a rope from a tree in her back yard and tried to commit suicide....shame the little cooont didn't succeed.
Another case of wet lettuce/slap on wrist by our "justice" system. It SUCKS
Gotta feel bloody sorry for the Kumar family for sure.

[Banditbandit]

If kid had been found guilty of murder opposed to manslaughter = longer stint in jail.

That is not necessarily true - the maximum sentence for manslaughter is Life ... Dean Wickcliffe, originally convicted of murder after the shop owner was shot and killed during a robbery, appealed his conviction, arguing he had no intention to kill, had it reduced to manslaughter (the case is quite similar) but was still sentenced to Life in Prison ...

1) The jury made the decision and brought in their verdict.

2) No-one here was in court to here ALL the evidence and arguments.

3) The Judge has yet to sentence - and he can sentence up to Life ...

As to the 13-year-old ...

Go here

http://www.justice.govt.nz/policy/co...responsibility

The Crimes Act 1961 sets the age of criminal responsibility in New Zealand at 10 years of age. Children aged 10-14 years old are open to a very narrow range of criminal charges, and very few end up facing prosecution in a youth or adult court. Most offending by children is dealt with under the care and protection jurisdiction of the Family Court, where the welfare of the child is the main concern. Criminal Courts focus on accountability rather than welfare.

He's a child ...

[Tazz]

2) No-one here was in court to here ALL the evidence and arguments.

Hear, hear!

What's the world coming to when a citizen cannot rob another citizen without them getting in the way, causing the need for said robber citizen to have to 'defend' themselves, with a knife they just happen to have (it's for opening letters, honest). Outrageous!

If anything the dead mans family should be charged with obstructing the course of burglary. How dare they.

And what's more, stabbing is not even a big deal. It's like a 'sup' between friends. No malicious intent at all!

Pip pip!

[RDJ]

That is not necessarily true - the maximum sentence for manslaughter is Life ...

Manslaughter does not fit the crime. Killing a person with a lethal weapon during the commission of a crime is murder and should always be treated as murder. Manslaughter is, "well, your honor, I didn't intend to kill him". What was the knife for then? (Rhetorical question).

Poor Mr Kumar's family. They get victimized twice. They get a life sentence without their husband / father. The ferals who killed him will be living, and often enjoying, their lives long after Mr Kumar is a fading memory to all but his family.

Remember the RSA killer Bell? He will be out in 17 years. He "didn't intend to kill" either. He was on probation for a previous violent offence. 3 of his 4 victims are dead (one remains horribly crippled).