Thinking of getting vaccinated?

[oldrider]

Except you aren't searching for the Truth, You are searching for confirmation of your beliefs.



And besides - The game in the case refers to people posting links without bothering to fact check them as evidence for their beliefs.

With respect TDL.

I get the impression that you are doing exactly the same thing as you accuse Katman of only your focus is upon Katman rather than the subject of this case!

I.E. Prove Katman wrong at any price - thought you were better than that actually. - Just my observation, I may well be wrong!

[TheDemonLord]

Who the fuck are you (or any government agency for that matter) to decide who is capable of evaluating information?

Some subjects require very specific prior knowledge and understanding in order to properly evaluate them and as such, the average member of society cannot properly evaluate the information.

Case in point:

Should I run this on my PC:

$HomeFolders = Get-ChildItem C: -Directory
$group = get-adgroup | where{$_.name -like "everyone"}
foreach ($HomeFolder in $HomeFolders) {
$Path = $HomeFolder.FullName
$Acl = (Get-Item $Path).GetAccessControl('Access')
$Ar = New-Object System.Security.AccessControl.FileSystemAccessRule ($group, 'Modify', 'ContainerInherit,ObjectInherit', 'None', 'Allow')
$Acl.SetAccessRule($Ar)
Set-Acl -path $Path -AclObject $Acl
}

or should I run this:

$HomeFolders = Get-ChildItem C: -Directory
$group = get-adgroup | where{$_.name -like "admins"}
foreach ($HomeFolder in $HomeFolders) {
$Path = $HomeFolder.FullName
$Acl = (Get-Item $Path).GetAccessControl('Access')
$Ar = New-Object System.Security.AccessControl.FileSystemAccessRule ($Group, 'Modify', 'ContainerInherit,ObjectInherit', 'None', 'Allow')
$Acl.SetAccessRule($Ar)
Set-Acl -path $Path -AclObject $Acl
}

Now - you might be able to make a guesstimate as to which one to run - but to properly evaluate requires an understanding of Powershell, NTFS permissions and the Security implications for running them.

The problem then is when people see something that makes them panic or confuses them and they make an irrational decision based on that, as opposed to understanding. There are 2 great examples of this - one is http://www.dhmo.org/facts.html and the other is the Annoying StoneDine advert that is shown on NZ TV - which warns consumers that their current Pans may contain PTFE, the implication is that this is an Acronyms and is therefore bad/dangerous (just like the Anti-Vaxxers love to do) - however anyone who recognizes them will know that PTFE is just the technical name for Teflon - which of cause their nonstick pans contain! The entire advert is trying to sell you something based on the fact that the average person won't know what PTFE is.

So you ask who am I to decide who can and can't evaluate information, but your premise is flawed, because it assumes everyone CAN evaluate the information, whereas the opposite is true.

[Katman]

So you ask who am I to decide who can and can't evaluate information, but your premise is flawed, because it assumes everyone CAN evaluate the information, whereas the opposite is true.

You dumb fuck.

People don't vaccinate their children themselves. They go to a doctor.

If the parent can't make their own informed decision then a doctor who has access to the full scale of risks involved can ensure the parent is adequately informed.

[TheDemonLord]

With respect TDL.

I get the impression that you are doing exactly the same thing as you accuse Katman of only your focus is upon Katman rather than the subject of this case!

I.E. Prove Katman wrong at any price - thought you were better than that actually. - Just my observation, I may well be wrong!

In this case and at the moment, I AM doing what I am accusing Katman of - If there was something to discuss about the Subject, I would do so, but this isn't about the Subject, this is about religious faith. No matter what I put up, Katman will see conspiracy and a Coverup, No matter what numbers that show the Millions upon Millions of lives that have been saved thanks to Vaccines, Katman will claim Big Pharma trying to keep us sick, No matter which studies I post up showing that there is no Causal link between the MMR vaccine and Autism, Katman will still believe it causes Autism.

IF Katman (or anyone else for that matter) was to have a hypothetical debate about the Needs of Society vs the Rights of the Individual, then I'd happily discuss that - as I think that is a much more interesting topic of conversation especially as I don't actually have an answer and both sides of the debate have very valid concerns.

[TheDemonLord]

You dumb fuck.

People don't vaccinate their children themselves. They go to a doctor.

If the parent can't make their own informed decision then a doctor who has access to the full scale of risks involved can ensure the parent is adequately informed.

Then where do the Anti-Vaxxers come from? Because no Doctor I have ever met has said that the risks of Vaccination outweigh the risks of not getting Vaccinated. The Reality is that people often get their information from the loudest source, as opposed to the most reputable.

You are always so fond of decrying the MSM and referring to people as a Sheeple, So which is it? Either people are easily fooled and therefore cannot make an adequately informed decision or everyone else is adequately informed when they tell you that your other beliefs are horse shit....

[Katman]

IF Katman (or anyone else for that matter) was to have a hypothetical debate about the Needs of Society vs the Rights of the Individual, then I'd happily discuss that - as I think that is a much more interesting topic of conversation especially as I don't actually have an answer and both sides of the debate have very valid concerns.

My discussion on this matter has never been about whether the MMR vaccine causes Autism.

It's about the right to be told the truth.

[Katman]

Then where do the Anti-Vaxxers come from? Because no Doctor I have ever met has said that the risks of Vaccination outweigh the risks of not getting Vaccinated. The Reality is that people often get their information from the loudest source, as opposed to the most reputable.

At the moment it appears that even doctors aren't being given the truth about the risks.

[FJRider]

The Reality is that people often get their information from the loudest source, as opposed to the most reputable.

So which is it? Either people are easily fooled and therefore cannot make an adequately informed decision or everyone else is adequately informed when they tell you that your other beliefs are horse shit....

The loudest source of information is inside their own tiny minds. They choose the risk factor to themselves and their family.

Their choice ... their decision ... their family ... their risk.

[Ocean1]

The loudest source of information is inside their own tiny minds. They choose the risk factor to themselves and their family.

Their choice ... their decision ... their family ... their risk.

But it's not their risk. Everyone else is unnescesarily exposed to the risk as a result of their choice. Any other choice they made that risked so much suffering and death amongst their own people would see them nailed to a tree at the nearest crossroad. Why should we treat these fuckwits any different?

[TheDemonLord]

My discussion on this matter has never been about whether the MMR vaccine causes Autism.

It's about the right to be told the truth.

What then do you define as 'Truth'? Because thus far, what you refer to as 'Truth' tends to be what you wish to be true, as opposed to what is objectively and demonstrably true. This is my point about this being a religious argument.

[FJRider]

At the moment it appears that even doctors aren't being given the truth about the risks.

Their aim is to find cheaper drugs to to the same job. The fewer the options ... the higher the price.

Often resulting in similar formulas (from different companies) ... but different side-effects. Some side-effects are as bad (if not worse) as the original problem that needed treatment. Often a lottery on how badly a patient is affected by those side-effects ...

If asked ... Doctors can only reply (starting with the line) ... studies have shown ...

[TheDemonLord]

But it's not their risk. Everyone else is unnescesarily exposed to the risk as a result of their choice. Any other choice they made that risked so much suffering and death would see them nailed to a tree at the nearest crossroad. Why should we treat these fuckeits any differently?

A Question then:

Does the Needs of Society overrule your sovereign right to your own body? And the follow up, Does the Needs of Society overrule my right as a parent to make decisions for my Child?

As I said above - this question I find much more interesting, because although I agree with the notion that not vaccinating your child (without a damn good medical reason) is akin to Child Abuse, I find the notion of the State being able to usurp my parental authority equally frightening.

[FJRider]

But it's not their risk. Everyone else is unnescesarily exposed to the risk as a result of their choice. Any other choice they made that risked so much suffering and death amongst their own people would see them nailed to a tree at the nearest crossroad. Why should we treat these fuckwits any different?

Do you think those motorcyclists/motorists ... that regularly infringe on the road rules ... could be thought of in a similar vein ... ?????????????

[Katman]

What then do you define as 'Truth'?

When data that doesn't conform to the official story is hidden (or worse, destroyed) there is a high likelihood that we're not being told the whole truth.

As a parent that should concern you.

If it doesn't, you're a fucking moron.

[TheDemonLord]

When data that doesn't conform to the official story is hidden (or worse, destroyed) there is a high likelihood that we're not being told the whole truth.

As a parent that should concern you.

If it doesn't, you're a fucking moron.

But you are taking it on Faith that:

a: The Data existed in the first place
b: Was destroyed
c: was done so at the behest of someone actively trying to cover something up.

And even if it were true - and there was a Causal link between Autism and the MMR Vaccine - Do you know what As a Parent concerns me more? Other peoples unvaccinated walking biological weapons making my child sick - because the historical data shows that there is an almost infinitely greater chance of that causing harm to my child.