Where are the police and camera vans?

[Gremlin]

I remember 15 years ago they had one on Manakau on ramp northbound at about 8pm. Entering a god dMN MOTORWAY!!!! Lucky I didn't have the GSXr too tapped out....

I remember one New Years Eve I think, riding around. Hit 6-7 checkpoints around the city

[rastuscat]

I remember one New Years Eve I think, riding around. Hit 6-7 checkpoints around the city

I've stood on those checkpoints.

The point of CBT checkpoints is not to catch people. The point is to create the perception of a higher risk of being caught.

The more people breath tested, the greater the deterrent.

Thing is, cops like catching baddies. At the end of a 2 hour 3R (checkpoint) cops think it's been a failure if nobody got processed. Nothing could be further from the truth.

The higher profile the better. Look how long you remember the 3R on the Manukau on ramp.

Of course, it has to be balanced off against passing too many people off or causing a hazard.

[jellywrestler]

I've stood on those checkpoints.

The point of CBT checkpoints is not to catch people. The point is to create the perception of a higher risk of being caught.

The more people breath tested, the greater the deterrent.

Thing is, cops like catching baddies. At the end of a 2 hour 3R (checkpoint) cops think it's been a failure if nobody got processed. Nothing could be further from the truth.

The higher profile the better. Look how long you remember the 3R on the Manukau on ramp.

Of course, it has to be balanced off against passing too many people off or causing a hazard.

i used to work at massey uni in palmy, just up the road was linton army camp, with one bridge into town, there's be a reasonably regular checkpoint there at finishing time on a friday mostly, and one rarely saw any later in the night, good move as it got it into several thousand peoples heads to go home, have a jar or two and leave the car at home, i never mind getting pulled over at a checkpoint as it's my arse that could get hit by a drunk driver.

[Grumph]

The "checkpoint on a single access point" smacks too much of entrapment for my liking - but I'm not arguing it doesn't work.

Many years back I was at a speedway meeting at Dunedin. Had to duck back to the motel for something early in the evening and there was a trap just set up on the single access road...When I went back to the track I mentioned it and word got around.
Doubt it would have caught any locals but the out of towners could have had problems.

[Moise]

I've stood on those checkpoints.

The point of CBT checkpoints is not to catch people. The point is to create the perception of a higher risk of being caught.

The more people breath tested, the greater the deterrent.

Thing is, cops like catching baddies. At the end of a 2 hour 3R (checkpoint) cops think it's been a failure if nobody got processed. Nothing could be further from the truth.

The higher profile the better. Look how long you remember the 3R on the Manukau on ramp.

Of course, it has to be balanced off against passing too many people off or causing a hazard.

"Cops like catching baddies"

That's the whole issue in a nutshell. Having visible police cars on patrol does more to improve driver behaviour than hiding up an on ramp to catch someone doing 111 km/h. But that's not the psyche of your average cop.

If you look at the road deaths over the holidays, you'd have to say that very few would have been prevented by standard police enforcement practices.

You'd hope that the people in power would realise that what they are doing is not working, and the messages aren't getting through. Just look at all the deaths where seatbelts weren't worn. If you can't even get people to wear seatbelts, then clearly something is badly wrong.



Sent from somewhere using Tapatalk

[Akzle]

. Just look at all the deaths where seatbelts weren't worn. If you can't even get people to wear seatbelts, then clearly something is badly wrong.



Sent from somewhere using Tapatalk

i never wear a seatbelt.

only ~30% of fatal crashes involved "not wearing a seatbelt"

so 60% of fatals, were wearing a seatbelt.

statistically, crashing is what will fuck you up.

[Berries]

i never wear a seatbelt.

only ~30% of fatal crashes involved "not wearing a seatbelt"

so 60% of fatals, were wearing a seatbelt.

But if 50% of crashes involved motorbikes that only leaves 20% where the driver/passenger had a seatbelt on so you are in fact at more risk.

Seriously though, the first thing that often happens when you get thrown from a vehicle is that you are halfway out the window frame when the car rolls on you and squashes your head against the road like a cartoon Wile E Coyote leaving a ghoulish impression in the side of the door. Or you get thrown out the back window and run over and smeared across the road like a hedgehog. Or you go out the front window leaving behind the top of your skull and blood soaked scalp wedged where the sun visor should be.

That's why the flies are so big over here.

[Moise]

i never wear a seatbelt.

only ~30% of fatal crashes involved "not wearing a seatbelt"

so 60% of fatals, were wearing a seatbelt.

statistically, crashing is what will fuck you up.

Using that logic, I don't suppose you wear a helmet either.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

[Laava]

Using that logic, I don't suppose you wear a helmet either.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

���������� Haha, you sarcastic bugger!
I guess it must be frustrating though when no-one believes anything you say...

[jasonu]

i never wear a seatbelt.

only ~30% of fatal crashes involved "not wearing a seatbelt"

so 60% of fatals, were wearing a seatbelt.

statistically, crashing is what will fuck you up.

Yes you are right, the sudden stop is what fucks you up. But of the 30% fatalities not wearing seatbelts it would be interesting to know how many of them died because they smashed their head into the windscreen or steering wheel because they were not wearing a seatbelt when the crash occurred.

[Akzle]

But if 50% of crashes involved motorbikes that only leaves 20% where the driver/passenger had a seatbelt on so you are in fact at more risk.

Seriously though, the first thing that often happens when you get thrown from a vehicle is that you are halfway out the window frame when the car rolls on you and squashes your head against the road like a cartoon Wile E Coyote leaving a ghoulish impression in the side of the door. Or you get thrown out the back window and run over and smeared across the road like a hedgehog. Or you go out the front window leaving behind the top of your skull and blood soaked scalp wedged where the sun visor should be.

That's why the flies are so big over here.

all of that presuposes i'm going to drive into shit at pace.
i do not.

[R650R]

Seriously though, the first thing that often happens when you get thrown from a vehicle is that you are halfway out the window frame when the car rolls on you and squashes your head against the road like a cartoon Wile E Coyote leaving a ghoulish impression in the side of the door. Or you get thrown out the back window and run over and smeared across the road like a hedgehog. Or you go out the front window leaving behind the top of your skull and blood soaked scalp wedged where the sun visor should be.

Correct... and my trucking bretheren are slowly as a community coming to realise that too. Theres' been tragic deaths in recent years of what could have been survivable rollovers but guys thrown out and squashed by own truck.
This holly wood shit of jumping out the door to safety is only pertinent at about 20k on logging tracks maybe...
Same on forklifts, its there to prevent you from jumping and being crushed by the forklift as it rolls.

Living by a busy intersection I've twice seen the results of no seatbelt, many times seen people walkout uninjured wearing seatbelts. The debate is over.
I will always remember one very blunt bystander, hard woman who used to own the motel. She told the victim "You wouldn't be screaming your face off ya silly bitch if you'd been wearing your seatbelt".... That one the driver walked out but the passenger had left classic spiderweb faceplant into windscreen....

Is it urban myth or not that ACC doesn't fully cover reconstructive surgery if not wearing seatbelt?

[Akzle]

Yes you are right, the sudden stop is what fucks you up. But of the 30% fatalities not wearing seatbelts it would be interesting to know how many of them died because they smashed their head into the windscreen or steering wheel because they were not wearing a seatbelt when the crash occurred.

which is pretty much my point. like alcohol and drug statistics, seatbelt stats are probably horseshit to push the company line.

no doubt, if you crash into shit head on, a seatbelt will keep you in your seat.
also no doubt, if you're T boned driver side, a seatbelt will kill you by keeping you in your seat.

what, on occasion, may be difficult to determine from a fatal, is how much any factor contributed to the fatality. (ie, would it have happend if/ if not....)

but it's all a bit irrelevant if you don't drive into shit.

[FJRider]

which is pretty much my point. like alcohol and drug statistics, seatbelt stats are probably horseshit to push the company line.

no doubt, if you crash into shit head on, a seatbelt will keep you in your seat.
also no doubt, if you're T boned driver side, a seatbelt will kill you by keeping you in your seat.

what, on occasion, may be difficult to determine from a fatal, is how much any factor contributed to the fatality. (ie, would it have happend if/ if not....)

but it's all a bit irrelevant if you don't drive into shit.

There has been a lot of debate on the value of seatbelts ... but as one who has survived crashes in vehicles that were not fitted (or required to be fitted) I would like to point a few things out to you ... even surviving such crashes ... I wish I had one those times ... to wear.

Any crash you are involved in (as a driver or passenger) it almost always involves some degree of pain.

If the car you are in is being driven into a tree at 140 km/hr ... some pain will result. Regardless of your seating position. Or safety equipment used.

Seatbelts keep you in your seat ... regardless where that seat may end up. When the outside world intrudes in the passenger space you partially occupy ... I would prefer not to go out to meet it

Seatbelts will not save your life in every instance you are involved in an accident ... but not every accident would be fatal for all passengers (wearing seatbelts or not) ... but they will increase the odds you will survive. Sort ... of make your own luck.

Personal choice is fine ... but ... are you feeling lucky ... ???


Good luck.

[Akzle]

This holly wood shit of jumping out the door to safety is only pertinent at about 20k on logging tracks maybe...

nigh on fucking impossible on a right hand slide, pretty achievable on a lefty.
doors are hard to open at speed so it's normally a window exeunt.

...so i hear.

Living by a busy intersection I've twice seen the results of no seatbelt, many times seen people walkout uninjured wearing seatbelts. The debate is over.

arguable. as above. it will help in certain types of crashes (ie target fixated panic braking and sledging into shit; and certain rollovers/pile drivers)

but others it will not. and in all cases you're liable to whiplash (maybe not, or less, with traction belts?) internal organ damage, bruising from shoulder to hip, winding, eye damage, brain injury....