drinking while driving

[skippa1]

Just for clarity.

Impairment means just that. Impairment. It should be "neutral" as to
the cause (i.e. whether alcohol, drugs, some combination of both, or
(say) a medical condition is involved.)

If you "pass" a roadside breath test, all it means is that you've not
exceeded the legal limit (in terms of you having to hand over your
keys and being liable to be prosecuted).

However, if the nice officer has good grounds to suspect that you
are still somehow "impaired", then he can request you to then do an
impairment test.

But if you fail the impairment test, it still does not indicate whether
your impairment is due to:

- drugs (recreational or therapeutic)
- drugs plus some alcohol (where the latter was found to be below
the legal level during the preceding alcohol test)
- a medical condition

It just means you're deemed to be "impaired" at that point in time,
and should not be driving.


The number of drivers regularly driving around our country on benzos,
opiates and analgesics would be interesting data.

Especially when many drugs and alcohol can have an "accentuated"
(adverse) effect on the body when in combination.

absolutely....

[Scuba_Steve]

Really, zero breath alcohol is stupid and unrealistic?

Until self-drive vehicles come about, absolutely... and even then...
Just like zero booze in the prohibition era was stupid & unrealistic; it'll just cause more problems than it solves

You equally have nothing to show that a few drinks then driving is safer than (or as safe as) no drinks and driving.

There's plenty of stats out there showing no discernible diff between diff booze limits & fatalities caused by booze, alot of these were pointed out during the whole dropping the limit to .5 here, as again it's the drunks that cause the problems. The limit is simply a "look we're doing something vote for us" with no actual results (other than more of that sweet cash moneys for the Govt)

Why shouldn't there be some emotion, you can analyse the facts out of anything if you want but prove to me that alcohol and driving are a good mix and if you can, please quantify the volume for each of us as individual, or are you saying that the same blanket you don't want thrown over a zero tolerance is acceptable if you throw it over a predetermined "safe" limit?

You do realise that the same breathalyser I rely on as setting the zero limit is the same as the breathalyser you rely on to set the "safe" limit? And you are ok that in your words it ignores the low percentages, therefore the reading on the unit is actually under reporting the "safe" limit?

I'm saying it won't detect minuscule amounts of booze, just like your speedo won't detect minuscule amounts of movement (usually under 5-7km/h) your bathroom scales prob won't detect the 1st 5kg or so & almost certainly won't detect grams but doesn't mean they ain't there...
So how Zero is Zero? I can roll a stop sign but have my speedo show 0km/h. Do the products I've previously mentioned mean you can't drive under your system because they contain alcohol or do we ignore them for hypocritical convenience?
As for a "safe" limit, I was fine with .08 we had previous, as again no discernible variation in road toll over .05 & 0. However I accept the roads as a dangerous place & choose to operate dangerous vehicles such as motorbikes & vans. I'm less worried about someone driving at .08 than I am at the sober driver doing her lipstick in the mirror or most the daily drivers out there. Drunk drivers are a different issue tho & they need more serious seeing to

Also if your against drink & drive do you also make sure never to drive for the 4-6hrs most pharmaceutical drugs do their stuff for? We tend to ignore the effects they can have unless specifically noted in bold DO NOT DRIVE OR OPERATE MACHINERY WHEN USING THIS DRUG; just wondering where you've decided to draw your sand line

[skippa1]

Until self-drive vehicles come about, absolutely... and even then...
Just like zero booze in the prohibition era was stupid & unrealistic; it'll just cause more problems than it solves



There's plenty of stats out there showing no discernible diff between diff booze limits & fatalities caused by booze, alot of these were pointed out during the whole dropping the limit to .5 here, as again it's the drunks that cause the problems. The limit is simply a "look we're doing something vote for us" with no actual results (other than more of that sweet cash moneys for the Govt)



I'm saying it won't detect minuscule amounts of booze, just like your speedo won't detect minuscule amounts of movement (usually under 5-7km/h) your bathroom scales prob won't detect the 1st 5kg or so & almost certainly won't detect grams but doesn't mean they ain't there...
So how Zero is Zero? I can roll a stop sign but have my speedo show 0km/h. Do the products I've previously mentioned mean you can't drive under your system because they contain alcohol or do we ignore them for hypocritical convenience?
As for a "safe" limit, I was fine with .08 we had previous, as again no discernible variation in road toll over .05 & 0. However I accept the roads as a dangerous place & choose to operate dangerous vehicles such as motorbikes & vans. I'm less worried about someone driving at .08 than I am at the sober driver doing her lipstick in the mirror or most the daily drivers out there. Drunk drivers are a different issue tho & they need more serious seeing to

Also if your against drink & drive do you also make sure never to drive for the 4-6hrs most pharmaceutical drugs do their stuff for? We tend to ignore the effects they can have unless specifically noted in bold DO NOT DRIVE OR OPERATE MACHINERY WHEN USING THIS DRUG; just wondering where you've decided to draw your sand line

You're a fucking idiot. I drew my line in the sand when I got out of hospital after 7 days in ICU and 7 days on the ward with a missing leg and got the full prescription, Gabapentin for phantom pain, Tramadol for mild pain for a broken back, Zoplicone sleeping pills because lying on my side to sleep wasn't an option, 50mg codeine cause it stings when yah rip yah leg off just the usual's. I stood in the Chemist on crutches waiting for my prescription and the doctor came through, I asked her if I could drive with any one of these or a combo, she said no and I threw the cunts away.

That's where I draw the line

[Scuba_Steve]

You're a fucking idiot. I drew my line in the sand when I got out of hospital after 7 days in ICU and 7 days on the ward with a missing leg and got the full prescription, Gabapentin for phantom pain, Tramadol for mild pain for a broken back, Zoplicone sleeping pills because lying on my side to sleep wasn't an option, 50mg codeine cause it stings when yah rip yah leg off just the usual's. I stood in the Chemist on crutches waiting for my prescription and the doctor came through, I asked her if I could drive with any one of these or a combo, she said no and I threw the cunts away.

That's where I draw the line

so you drove in pain? That's worse than driving within the limit after booze... fuck I love peoples moral compasses lol
Also if your missing a leg I hope you ain't operating vehicles cause you're as in control as again someone within the limit after booze, but hey I'm sure it's fine cause "you drive an automatic" or something & your moral compass says it's cool

[FJRider]

They have set the drink limit to what they believe is right, how can it be right for each and every individual, it isn't, but they had a to draw a line in the sand somewhere, and we have to adhere to that.

It's setting the limits for the lowest common percentile ... ie: the local village idiot. If he/she survives ... it must be safe for everybody else.

[skippa1]

so you drove in pain? That's worse than driving within the limit after booze... fuck I love peoples moral compasses lol
Also if your missing a leg I hope you ain't operating vehicles cause you're as in control as again someone within the limit after booze, but hey I'm sure it's fine cause "you drive an automatic" or something & your moral compass says it's cool

Like I said before you're a fuckin idiot, also now an ignorant cunt

as you were

[FJRider]

The young fellow was under the limit. Since the limit was lowered more people are dying from alcohol related crashes according to those that create the laws.

You mean more people are being reported as dying from alcohol related crashes ... Nowadays ... was he/she been drinking ???

That's the first question crash investigators ask at any incident ... If the answer is yes ...

[jellywrestler]

ok....my mistake then, what I am saying though is that impairment is very subjective and the only true way to take any doubt out is to have a zero limit. We don't have an impairment test, only an alcohol detection test.

I have sat down with an empty stomach and had a quick beer or two that has gone to my head, was I to drive at that time I would be under a breathalyser limit but may be too impaired to drive sensibly.........

my machine isn't my only judgement device, there are times when i've blown under the limit but not been prepared to drive, there are times when i've blown over and felt ok to drive but have not.
i wonder how many people of late have brought a breathalyser and used it purely as the final benchmark, a lot i fear.
i'm not an idiot and care more about the consequences to others and the guilt resting on me, than i do about myself simply

[sidecar bob]

The most pissed I've ever ridden was leaving a Police social.
The acting traffic sergeant got me to blow in the machine & pronounced me good to go.
That's the night I nearly wrapped my R100rs into a pole.
I'm quite glad the drink drive limit has been lowered, it was ridiculously high.

[pritch]

It seems that Skippa's zero reading proposal is considered earthshakingly radical. Unless I'm mistaken (entirely possible) zero is already the limit applied to young people. All the PTB would be doing is extending it to the rest of us.

Anyhow. Here's another nothing story. OK the offending driver is a twat no argument, and whoever was on duty at the police station may very well need a rocket up the arse, but to jump to the conclusion exhibited in the headline on the basis of a single incident is absurd. Even though it may very well be true. There is rather more evidence to suggest newspapers may be competing to print the silliest traffic story.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/taranaki-dai...euvre-on-video

Ok the editor must have sobered up. The original headline was to the effect that Taranaki drivers are the worst in the country.

[F5 Dave]

Like I said before you're a fuckin idiot, also now an ignorant cunt

as you were

Actually I considered he was making a rational argument. In fact if scoring points I'd say he was well above your, now abusive, rants.

[skippa1]

Actually I considered he was making a rational argument. In fact if scoring points I'd say he was well above your, now abusive, rants.

That's nice dear.....now go and rip a leg off and enjoy having the piss taken out of your capability to drive with a disability.

Enjoy that, maybe rate it as self appointed points keeper.

I expressed an alternative opinion for fucks sake...hardly a rant

[F5 Dave]

You did call him a fucking idiot first.

[bikaholic]

You mean more people are being reported as dying from alcohol related crashes ... Nowadays ... was he/she been drinking ???

That's the first question crash investigators ask at any incident ... If the answer is yes ...

Hey FJ, as your so over the top, please tell me what part of the law the driver in question, turkey according to you, did not comply with, if not, why was he not charged.
Also, why are all drivers with a positive reading but not over the limit not detained for one hour for retesting.
Also why did the queenstoned cops not accept the reliability of the eba equipment that are used for evidential purposes, and because not, why should the general public not also question their reliability.

[bikaholic]

That's nice dear.....now go and rip a leg off and enjoy having the piss taken out of your capability to drive with a disability.

Enjoy that, maybe rate it as self appointed points keeper.

I expressed an alternative opinion for fucks sake...hardly a rant

for one legged you sure can dig a good hole.