Bikers collide with Police car in Buller Gorge (1 December)

[Coldrider]

What do you mean the difference is where lawyers make their money? You can't bring previous case law into Court if it doesn't relate to the circumstaces which are before the Court. - it doesn't matter how good a lawyer you are.

The outcome will be whose at fault and who is at fault will most likely be charged unless it is not in the public interest to do so. Most certainly the cop will be charged if he is found at fault.

This case needs to be substantially different to arrive at a different conclusion. How different is the essence of the arguement stripped from the frilly bits.

Lawyers make their money as know the law is not black and white, can be argued either way.
that is why guilty people walk free from the courts.

I am not sure what your arguement is.

[Coldrider]

Laser's can only ping one car at a time, hence he cannot lase three cars at once and pull all them over. You may mock it but it doesnt change that fact that it is very true that Traffic Cops are excellent at telling wether someone is speeding by simply looking at the vehicle.

I laughed at the time, all doing the same speed equally spaced, then all of us were speeding or we weren't. Doesn't matter how many cars he can pickup or pull over at once, he misjudged the speed of all of us.

These are getting too off topic, have a safe weekend.

[Usarka]

Being a veteran with some experience and in all likely-hood an ex MOT officer he would have been able to conclude from what he saw that the bike was probably speeding.

What Spud is saying is quite true, I have been amazed how some of the traffic cops can accuratley pick the speed a car is going from looking at it and then flick their radar on and see how close they are too it. Certainly i don't doubt that an experienced traffic cop can tell if a car is speeding from just visually seeing it.

If the cop had time to see how fast they were going why did he turn in front of them????

Everything looks fast when it is going crash into you.

[Usarka]

Yeah so stop speculating coppas!!!!

Any other driver, it would be "The driver lost control because he failed to drive to the road condition". But when it's a cop, the road condition becomes an excuse, and it's the car blamed for the loss of control. Subtle, but it clearly demonstrates the mindset.

Its obvious. you rarely hear "speed may have been a factor" in a police crash. People just want to be treated fairly - ie. no different from those in authority.

[MSTRS:Me]

You said he was using a laser and pointed at you, it only works on one car so I can't see how he misjudged anything? Doesnt matter if you think other cars were doing the same speed, he locked onto you and pulled you over.

If you make statements you can expect them to be discussed and questioned as to their accuracy.

Did you read your statement and ascertain it's accuracy? Where did Coldrider say he was pulled over? And he may or may not have been correct when he stated that it was his red Commodore that was lasered...can hard to tell when in a line.

[spudchucka]

If the cop had time to see how fast they were going why did he turn in front of them????

Lets think about that for a second shall we?..................................

The bikes weren't in view when he started turning, he was halfway through the move when the bikes appeared...............

Would be my best guess, speculatively speaking.

[Mom]

AHEM!!!!

Excuse me for interrupting here but...

Shhhhhhhhh

I have one question. The driver of the campervan that killed 4 bikers (well 3 and a child to be fair)on the same day has pleaded guilty in the court, has surrendered her passport and is awaiting her fate as I type this.

How come it is taking so long for this investigation to be completed?

SCU would have been involved at both crashes, maybe the fact that one driver admitted fault from the start makes the difference?

I go back to my earlier post on here, the longer this carries on the more some will smell the distinct smell of 2 rules apply depending on what you do for a living!

From outside appearances the car did the 3 pointer, in a place that may not have been prudent, careless anyone???

[MSTRS:Me]

I understand what you are saying.

You can quite easily pin point cars with a Police laser - even in row it's not that hard you simply have to see a part of the car in the row, line it up in the laser sights and shoot. Its almost impossible to miss.

You understood?? I think not. Now pay attention while I clarify....
From the perspective of the driver of a car in a line, approaching a handheld laser, it could be difficult to be sure it was his/her car that was the target.
Have another

[Skyryder]

No Mr Twister that's not what I said at all.

This is what you wrote on post 238.. It is in reference to the second rider. just to remind you

So, unless he was asleep or riding two abreast he should have had more warning, at least two seconds if he is good boy, than his mate did before seeing the stationary vehicle.

It is obvious that the two second rule would have help the second rider to some degree.


Now I don't know about you but I have interpreated that as the second rider being able to avoid or at least reduce his impact if he had done as you suggested. The inference from that is to reduce culpability for the officer in regards to second biker.

Skyryder

[Skyryder]

Being a veteran with some experience and in all likely-hood an ex MOT officer he would have been able to conclude from what he saw that the bike was probably speeding.

So what are the parameters of this 'experiance' that the officer used to come the conclusion that the bikes were speeding? Bearing in mind that speed is a formula of two measurements.

Skyryder

[Skyryder]

What Spud is saying is quite true, I have been amazed how some of the traffic cops can accuratley pick the speed a car is going from looking at it and then flick their radar on and see how close they are too it. Certainly i don't doubt that an experienced traffic cop can tell if a car is speeding from just visually seeing it.

I 'would' be amazed if it was true. But I have been informed by an optician who has done some research on this and his findings were, that it is opticaly impossible to accuralty measure speed with an oncoming vehicle. As we parted he said if the human eye could do this there would be no need for compulsary stops or give way signs as we could judge the speed of the oncoming vehicle. He also pointed out that it is more difficult to judge the distance of a vehicle with the lights on. Now there's clue here and we all know that with oncoming vehicle with lights we use more caution. Perhaps you and Spud can confer as you both seem to believe that it can be done. So how...........I await with interest as I believe others will too.

Skyryder

[JimBob]

So what are the parameters of this 'experiance' that the officer used to come the conclusion that the bikes were speeding? Bearing in mind that speed is a formula of two measurements.

Skyryder

The size of the dent in his car?

[Skyryder]

The size of the dent in his car?

I'm sure the SCU will be looking at this but doubt if the officer was trained or indeed took the time to ascertain this. Bling sent.

Skyryder

[spudchucka]

Now I don't know about you but I have interpreated that as the second rider being able to avoid or at least reduce his impact if he had done as you suggested. The inference from that is to reduce culpability for the officer in regards to second biker.

Skyryder

The only inference was that the second rider should have had a better chance of avoiding the collision if they were in single file and following the first bike at a safe distance.

Anything else is just YOUR speculation.

[spudchucka]

So what are the parameters of this 'experiance' that the officer used to come the conclusion that the bikes were speeding? Bearing in mind that speed is a formula of two measurements.

Skyryder

Bear in mind also that courts can and often do except opinion evidence as to speed of vehicles and sobriety of persons from experienced police officers. I'm not explaining it any further than that.