Personal protection - (Was part of Africa on a GN250)

[Mikkel]

Because it'll jam.

Make it a double and add some grenades!

[Mr Merde]

Thought that I better add my thoughts to this thread.

Taurus revolver chambered for .30 Carbine with soft projectiles. 4" barrel

holds 8 rounds and the 30 carbine round in a handgun is quite nasty.

Nothing that I would need two hands to operate, so no uzi's or such.

Revolver is my preference as there are no safeties that need to be operated so first shot is just draw and squeeze. faster than draw, disengage safety then squeeze as most autos have.

30 carbine loads would be stoked up quite considerably as revolvers are very strong in their actions and tend to be able to withstand higher pressures that semi's.

Personally I detest the Glocks. They made a name as a "plastic fantastic" but all those I have handled have been f#@king horrible until a lot of work has been done on them

[jrandom]

Personally I detest the Glocks. They made a name as a "plastic fantastic"...

They were designed in response to a military RFT for a service pistol, with the primary (only?) considerations being reliability, magazine capacity, and ease of use, and the G17 probably nailed those design requirements better than any other semiautomatic pistol has to date.

It's hardly surprising that cops and soldiers like them.

Guys who think of Glocks as target pistols, though, need their heads examined. I too detest the stock Glock trigger, and I am not a fan of the ergonomics.

[Wolf]

and I am not a fan of the ergonomics.

Yeah, you and me both. Dunno about the trigger as I've never actually fired one, but the angle of the grip blows goats. Ugly ones, with halitosis.

The M1911, the Luger, P-38, P99 and loads more besides all have a far more natural point.

Dunno if they just decided to throw a few hundred years of practical ergonomics out the window "just to be different" or whether it was a design constraint due to other parts of the weapon but, whatever it is, it's not particularly comfortable to aim.

[Mr Merde]

Yeah, you and me both. Dunno about the trigger as I've never actually fired one, but the angle of the grip blows goats. Ugly ones, with halitosis.

The M1911, the Luger, P-38, P99 and loads more besides all have a far more natural point.

Dunno if they just decided to throw a few hundred years of practical ergonomics out the window "just to be different" or whether it was a design constraint due to other parts of the weapon but, whatever it is, it's not particularly comfortable to aim.

Dont forget the CZ75 and later variants. Been copied by so many other makers. A natural feel to it. But one shouldnt exect much else as the CZ75 itself was based on a design by the "MAN". John Moses Browning and the Browning semi auto pistol of 1934. Same man designed the 1911.

[sAsLEX]

Revolver is my preference as there are no safeties that need to be operated so first shot is just draw and squeeze. faster than draw, disengage safety then squeeze as most autos have.

Neither does my weapon of choice, other than a slightly heavier first trigger squeeze.........P226 all the way...... only as I have no other choice

[Wolf]

Revolver is my preference as there are no safeties that need to be operated so first shot is just draw and squeeze. faster than draw, disengage safety then squeeze as most autos have.

Walther P99, Heckler and Koch P7, P226 and quite a few others, including the dreadful Glock, have no manual safety to disengage. Just draw and fire. In the case of most of them the first shot is a "long" double-action pull on the trigger like a revolver, subsequent shots are shorter single action pulls as the weapon self cocks. The P7 is an exception as gripping it cocks it and releasing it decocks it so it's pre-cocked single action all the way (and it's uncocked before it hits the floor if you drop it). They have a decocking mechanism to enable the weapon to be carried safely after loading or firing.

For those who prefer the consistency of a double-action revolver's trigger pull (rather than it changing from first to second shots) and don't like having to remember to uncock the weapon afterwards, there's always the P99DAO ("Double Action Only") which performs as its designation suggests - it does not remain cocked between shots and each pull of the trigger must first cock, then release the striker.

The semis mentioned are just as fast as a revolver, I'm told, and lots of modern semis are safe and reliable, despite the comparative mechanical complexity.

Of course, I'd personally stick with makes known to be reliable and not the fly-by-night outfits.

[pritch]

Guys who think of Glocks as target pistols, though, need their heads examined. .

That's funny I know someone who recently bought one for just that purpose. He did so because for the intended events it is as accurate as anything else that's available and because of the magazine capacity. It also costs waaay less than anything else that shoots as well.

Remember we are not comparing it to a multiple thousand dollar race gun.
We are talking "Standard" or "Production" here.

I too detest the stock Glock trigger, and I am not a fan of the ergonomics.

The trigger is different it's true, but where there's a will there's a way...
"Practice" would probably be a good place to start.

The ergonomics work just fine thanks :-)

Also I note that the US Army Ballistic Wounds Laboratory spent a considerable amount of time and millions of dollars in recent years discovering something I would have considered obvious. They proved that big bullets are more effective.

What was formerly a matter of opinion can now be considered a matter of fact.

Merry Christmas y'all

[jrandom]

That's funny I know someone who recently bought one for just that purpose. He did so because for the intended events it is as accurate as anything else that's available and because of the magazine capacity. It also costs waaay less than anything else that shoots as well.

I probably should have specified "apart from IPSC". Glocks do seem to do well there in the hands of skilled operators.

They're not really much chop for bullseye-style shooting, though.

[pritch]

I probably should have specified "apart from IPSC".
They're not really much chop for bullseye-style shooting, though.

Well I never heard of anybody wanting to take one to the Olympics. The item referred to is a .45 anyway.

Thing is that the second load tried put 5 shots offhand into all but 2 inches @ 22m, right at the point of aim. They'd have all been tens on an ISSF target.

The first load tried all went into three inches right where it was pointed.

The pistol was new, absolutely untouched - out of the box.

People who tell you Glocks can't shoot don't know shite.

[jrandom]

People who tell you Glocks can't shoot don't know shite.

Don't get me wrong. Glocks are great tools and I know well that many significant competitive action-shooting results have been achieved with them.

Value for money, I suppose, is the key thing. If Glocks were exactly the same gun at twice the price, I don't think anyone would bother with them, but they hit a very sweet bang-for-bucks spot.

And, of course, a lot of Glock's American fans will be wanting to have their pistol do double-duty as a weekend IPSC shooter and for personal defence carry. If I was in that situation, a Glock would start to look like a far more attractive option.

[jrandom]

Thing is that the second load tried put 5 shots offhand into all but 2 inches @ 22m, right at the point of aim. They'd have all been tens on an ISSF target.

One of the ROs at Central Shooters put a perfect four-round cloverleaf into the ten-ring at 25 yards with a Hi-Point .45 a while back (he probably still has that target ready to show off somewhere, heh) but I still wouldn't touch a Hi-Point with a bargepole...

[Street Gerbil]

Strap a skanky old AK-47 to your back and they'll avoid you like the plague.

Actually it will be more like "... and you will blend right in".