Stung $400

[Hawkeye]

Though you do have to question the law since one cop has been on tellly saying 70 was too slow and he would ticket below that even though there was laws requiring it on the motorway........


What does one do after seeing that article on the tv? I mean? Here is a uniformed member of the constabulary saying he will ticket those that drive that slow on the motorway even though by law they are required to...... one could get all confused.............. weak defence I know..... but try it!

I don't claim to be the leading expert on the law.... But my understanding is that, as a learner, you are not allowed on the motorway.
And before everyone flames me about how you get from A to B without going on the motorway in certain part of the country, I'm talking about the law, not the practicalities.

I had the yellow thing on for the whole 6 months 1 day until I got my 6R. Never went on the motorway. I did however ignore the 70k limit for safety reasons. As has been said on KB in more threads than I have fingers and toes, you are less likely to get ticketed following the 'common sense' approach of staying within the road legal limit than you are riding without the yellow thingy.
I never had any problems with cages whilst on the 6L. Could be because, as a fat bastard, in full leathers, sitting on a very small 250, it made me look bigger and more intimidating so was left alone.

[Mythical007]

There are always going to be a******s Who follow right up your rear tail pipe dont know why but some people are just idiots like that. As a learner biker I had similar problems however i still get tailgaters now just beacuse I am a motorbike and I'm doing the speedlimit... (one speeding fine was enought for me) However as I am now finally making an effort towards getting my Restrcited car licence the tail gater passing for no reason problem has once again reared its ugly monstrous head, so the L-plate problem it seems applies to both cars and motorcycles. However there will always be impatient people driving on your tail... *pass them on the straight and make them think twice bout passing you on yellow lines agin* right right i need to put my agro driving ego away now.... mmmm

[mowgli]

I haven't been stung yet although I do expect I will

I ride with an L-plate. I also travel with the traffic flow. If that means doing 100k then that's what I do. After getting my licence every biker mate I spoke to told me to ignore the 70k rule cos it's dangerous. They also suggested I remove the L-plate and leave a loose nylock nut rattling in the number plate. "Sorry Sir it must have fallen off. I'll rush down to AA and get another right away."

In the end I followed the advice regarding speed because I believe it improves my safety. I leave the L-plate on cos it signals my inexperience to other road users. Sure there are some shits out there who follow too close but a piece of yellow plastic won't change their behaviour. On the whole I reckon the L-plate improves my safety if even one cager gives me a slightly wider berth.

Mr plod hasn't tested my logic yet. When he does, safety may come at the additional cost of a ticket.

Finally, check out government online. Rumour is the 70k rule is being dropped but it may take 18mths to get through due process.

[Jantar]

I don't claim to be the leading expert on the law.... But my understanding is that, as a learner, you are not allowed on the motorway. .

The intention is to discourage learners from being on open roads and motorways, but it isn't illegal. As you point out, there are circumstances where there isn't an alternative.

[Hawkeye]

The intention is to discourage learners from being on open roads and motorways, but it isn't illegal. As you point out, there are circumstances where there isn't an alternative.

Read somewhere that there is a minimum of 80 on motorways (except during controlled roadworks) which by default, makes it illegal for learners. (70k max).
Can't remember where I read it!
I'm sure the more informed on KB can shed some light on it.

[sunhuntin]

There are always going to be a******s Who follow right up your rear tail pipe dont know why but some people are just idiots like that. As a learner biker I had similar problems however i still get tailgaters now just beacuse I am a motorbike and I'm doing the speedlimit... (one speeding fine was enought for me) However as I am now finally making an effort towards getting my Restrcited car licence the tail gater passing for no reason problem has once again reared its ugly monstrous head, so the L-plate problem it seems applies to both cars and motorcycles. However there will always be impatient people driving on your tail... *pass them on the straight and make them think twice bout passing you on yellow lines agin* right right i need to put my agro driving ego away now.... mmmm

yep... ive basically only just got rid after the plastic l [hell, after some 25,000k with it, i was kinda attached...] and still get gaited on a daily basis. that doesnt change whether im on the 250 or the 500, whether im doing the speed limit or slightly over, in town or open road. had a good one today with a beemer... dunno where the hell she came from, but fuck she came up fast. i was doing 51 at the fastest, and dropped to 49, combined with weaving into her line of view. eventually she backed off, but man! no reason for her to be that close.

[J_P]

Read somewhere that there is a minimum of 80 on motorways (except during controlled roadworks) which by default, makes it illegal for learners. (70k max).
Can't remember where I read it!
I'm sure the more informed on KB can shed some light on it.

Not sure what you were reading, but it sounds like mis-information.

Extract from NZ road code http://www.ltsa.govt.nz/roadcode/

You may drive slower than the speed limit shown, but you must be considerate towards any vehicles behind you.

You must drive slower than the limit if:

conditions make the speed limit shown unsafe, or
you are driving a vehicle which requires you to drive at a lower speed (such as heavy vehicles, which have a lower speed limit than cars

I can't find anything which mentions a minimum limit for the motorway. If you find it, post evidence, otherwise stop your argument as you are only confusing the topic.

In saying this, I watched a NZ cops programme on TV where they monitored a tractor unit to ensure they were doing 45km/h on the open road. Therefore, to be able to drive on the road your vehicle should be able to maintain 45km/h. It was on TV so it must be true

Also, I say good on the cop who feels that it is right to ticket drivers doing under 70km/h on the open road. Assuming he ain't being a There are some drivers whom drive only for themselves, and don't pull over to allow faster travellers to move on. Not as big a problem for bikers, as we overtake them anyway, (could be a problem if we get caught in a bad overtaking maneuvour by fellow frustrated motorists) However, I imagine the truck drivers get pretty sick of being stuck behind an inconsiderate driver, leading a cue of 10 cars on a leisurely Sunday drive at 70km/h and never pulling over.

Closer to topic...
I did the time with my L-Plate, I think it helped more than hindered. I was pulled over by a cop in the first few weeks of my licence for a minor indiscretion. He didn't issue a ticket, just chatted with me about my mistake.
I rode regularly at all times of the day and night and I was also pulled over after time by a motorbike cop. I explained that I had been caught late at work and he just told me to ride safe and left me to it.
Without the L-Plate who knows what would have happened, but it didn't hurt to have it there.

[Ixion]

Read somewhere that there is a minimum of 80 on motorways (except during controlled roadworks) which by default, makes it illegal for learners. (70k max).
Can't remember where I read it!
I'm sure the more informed on KB can shed some light on it.

Nope.No such law, either one forbidding learners from the motorway, or imposing a 70kph minimum (oh, if only. Be still my beating heart).

Only rules are , mopeds and pedestrians and treadlies forbidden (mopeds mainly cos the law still thinks they're a pushbike with a strapon. Shut up Ms Kittyhawk). And you must not unreasonably impede other trafffic. Pity the plod never apply that last rule to camper vans and horsefloats, isn't it?

[mowgli]

Read somewhere that there is a minimum of 80 on motorways (except during controlled roadworks) which by default, makes it illegal for learners. (70k max).

I've done a fair bit of digging on this subject. There are numerous references to advice received directly from Police that there is a minimum 80k limit on motorways. However, trawling through the Land Transport (Road User) Rule 2004 and subsequent amendments I can't find any reference to an 80k minimum. The best I can surmise is that 80k is used by Police as a guideline to decide whether or not to pull someone up to find out whether they are justified in travelling slow. This would be akin to the 20k discretion they generally exercise with bikes lane splitting.

While there is no mention of discouraging learners from using main roads, the stated objective of the Land Transport (Driver Licensing) Rule 1999 includes this.

"These changes are aimed, in particular, at reducing the exposure of young drivers ... to road crashes; ..."

Given that there are fewer accidents per km travelled on motorways than on other roads and that the majority of motorcycle accidents occur at intersections (off the motorway), then I think the reasons for discouraging motorway use are flawed.

There is also suggestion in various forums that the 70k restriction may be scrapped on the grounds that it is dangerous. The Road User Amendment (Rule 61002/2) is in progress but I'm not confident that scrapping the 70k limit is included. The amendment is intended to implement the findings of the Road Safety Strategy 2010. There were heaps of submissions on speed, particularly what the open road limit should be, but I can't find any reference to the limit imposed on 6L/6R riders. Perhaps it got in though common sense ... yeah right! I'm not holding my breath.

[Hawkeye]

I can't find anything which mentions a minimum limit for the motorway. If you find it, post evidence, otherwise stop your argument as you are only confusing the topic.

Pull your head in. Who is argueing. Just making a statement about something I have read. I never said it was fact - Or is it illegal to post anything on this forum unless you are the leading expert in the field? Maybe that's why you have only posted 8 times in the last 8 months. No discussions happening in you specialized field.

As stated in an earlier post (quoted below) there has been references made to it which is where I was coming from. Just couldn't remember in what context it was being used.

I've done a fair bit of digging on this subject. There are numerous references to advice received directly from Police that there is a minimum 80k limit on motorways. However, trawling through the Land Transport (Road User) Rule 2004 and subsequent amendments I can't find any reference to an 80k minimum. The best I can surmise is that 80k is used by Police as a guideline to decide whether or not to pull someone up to find out whether they are justified in travelling slow. This would be akin to the 20k discretion they generally exercise with bikes lane splitting.

While there is no mention of discouraging learners from using main roads, the stated objective of the Land Transport (Driver Licensing) Rule 1999 includes this.

"These changes are aimed, in particular, at reducing the exposure of young drivers ... to road crashes; ..."

Given that there are fewer accidents per km travelled on motorways than on other roads and that the majority of motorcycle accidents occur at intersections (off the motorway), then I think the reasons for discouraging motorway use are flawed.

There is also suggestion in various forums that the 70k restriction may be scrapped on the grounds that it is dangerous. The Road User Amendment (Rule 61002/2) is in progress but I'm not confident that scrapping the 70k limit is included. The amendment is intended to implement the findings of the Road Safety Strategy 2010. There were heaps of submissions on speed, particularly what the open road limit should be, but I can't find any reference to the limit imposed on 6L/6R riders. Perhaps it got in though common sense ... yeah right! I'm not holding my breath.

[Ixion]

The Road Rule 2004 actually makes provision for minimum speed lanes, and makes it an offence to drive at less than the posted minimum speed , unless unsafe to maintain the minimum, or ordered to drive slower by an enforcement officer. And the penalties regs prescribe a $150 fine for the offence.

But --- there have been no minimum speed lanes gazetted.

So, yes, it is an offence to drive at less than the minimum speed in a minimum speed lane. But none of them exist. More's the pity. And can anyone see the geraitric fools that set speed limits actuallys ettign a minimum speed. I sure can't.

EDIT: The motorway thing keeps coming up. In fact, the rules about what can or cannot go on a motorway are determined not by speed, but by registration class. So mopeds are banned from the motorways not because they are too slow (there are "mopeds" than can exceed 100kph) but because they are registered as mopeds.

Similarly banned are tractors,all terrain vehicles (ie quads) , track laying vehicles, forkhoists, solid tyred vehicles, Road going machinery , graders and such like. A general rule of thumb is that if it doesnt have to have a WoF (or CoF) its not allowed on the motorway.

And pushbikes, pedestrians and horse drawn vehicles .

[FilthyLuka]

Pull your head in. Who is argueing. Just making a statement about something I have read. I never said it was fact - Or is it illegal to post anything on this forum unless you are the leading expert in the field? Maybe that's why you have only posted 8 times in the last 8 months. No discussions happening in you specialized field.

fight fight fight fight!

Chill out dude

[J_P]

Pull your head in. Who is argueing. Just making a statement about something I have read. I never said it was fact - Or is it illegal to post anything on this forum unless you are the leading expert in the field? Maybe that's why you have only posted 8 times in the last 8 months. No discussions happening in you specialized field.

Didn't mean to offend.

The word argument can be used in a greater context than what you have percieved.
Your statements were misinformation. OK, you did not state it was fact, but by referring to not riding on motorways as an impractacle law and driving less than 80km/h as being illegal, it came across (to me anyway) with slightly more weight than a comment by itself.

If you are going to be telling us how it is, then tell us right. Thats all.

[skidMark]

Just wanted to warn people who dont use a L-plate.
Obviously u cant post a comment without getting shit.

you havn't been on this site long have you.

[awayatc]

Put your L plate on the left hand side of your bike at the very rear - attach it to the swing arm, the inside of the number plate, somewhere like that.

From the LTSA website :
'L' (learner) plates
All riders on a motorcycle learner licence must have an 'L' plate attached to the rear of their motorcycle.
You can get an 'L' plate from a driver licensing agent. It's also acceptable to make one yourself, to the dimensions shown.
The 'L' plate must be clearly visible to all other road users. It must not restrict your front or rear vision.


So it must be clearly visable, and at the rear - but it doesnt say it has to be visable from any particular angle.

That way other road users cannot identify you as a learner from behind, so you will not be deliberatly tailgated or what ever, but you are still within the law.

I like your angle of approach, though I can see somebody making an issue out of the " Visible to all other road users " bit....
Another way to dodge the L plate issue "my son" was clever enough to come up with:
-Attach plastic L plate to rear as per " keep everybody happy" method.
-Ride bike with L plate and ensure the lot gets dirty.
-Snap L plate off and keep broken plate with you whenever you ride (under seat/toolbag etc)
-should you be randomly pulled over by the strong arm of the law, Try the "it just snapped off officer..." appoach....
(However this will have more chance if you ride within the legal limits, and be polite when pulled over....)
Admittedly it works best on a road/ trail style bike, but....

$400 is a lot of money, and not at all in proportion to the severity off the "crime" committed.
I feel for the youngsters that have to fork it out.
Youngsters do not always deservedly get targeted by certain "law enforcing" types.
Give em a break! surely you can all remember when you where young and bulletproof!