Biker Down threads!

[ElCoyote]

Well said Ixion.

My thoughts are this; we all ride bikes and acknowledge on the road with a nod or hand wave..............why?

Do cages acknowledge each other............No?

Let's not forget we are an at risk minority and therefore when one of the minority is hurt/killed we empathise, whether this be internally or via media is not the point.

"There but for the grace of God go thee"

By all means include in the caption "Biker down at XXXXX" which aleviates the fears of those who can discount loved ones and if you are in this category do not read further.

If I suspected that somebody I knew was involved I would move heaven and earth to attempt to help or console those left behind.

Compare it to a censors rating on a program. Contains graphic scenes or gratuitous violence and bad language. If that offends you DON'T WATCH.

If this swims upstream so be it.

[Big Dave]

Mudguards have their own KB section - so should there be a place for those who need to grieve - and it should be away from those who don't.

[car]

What I do not understand (genuinely) is why people should think it offensive, or be so opposed to it. I can well understand those who say that it seems pointless and therefore they do not do it, I seldom do myself. But others are overtly hostile to the idea.

Maybe, maybe not. Maybe the people who're posting now aren't actually hostile, but just making a small noise, having their say, reacting with the equal and opposite post. It's not that much harder to understand than the need to say "rip [cryingsmiley]" is it? And it's in considerably better taste than waiting for a real biker down post to say "wat R all U fagets cryin about?"

Me, I really don't get it, and I'm usually happy to hold my peace. But the discussion of who and why, right now, is interesting to me.

A while ago , when the four motorcyclists were killed by the Austrienne, a number of people, knowing that I ride, commented on the tragedy to me, with conventional comments of good will (" not friends of yours I hope, Very sad, terrible for the family " etc).

They did not know the motorcyclists, were not riders themselves, but , figuratively speaking raised their hats and bowed. I thought it seemly of them.

Aye, more good sense Mr Ixion. I remember my first thought when the news of 9-11 hit (well, second; my sister was on a plane from Tokyo to London at the time so my first thought was some quick mental geography to assure myself that she wasn't affected) was for my friends in the US, and I figuratively doffed my hat the same way.

[chanceyy]

Well, if I am walking up the road, and a pass a neighbour, and say a good morning, as you do. And he (or she) says, "oh well, my (uncle, father, toilet cleaner , pimp whatever) died last night", I will reply "Oh dear, I'm really sorry to hear that. My condolences to the family " etc. Now, if I am willing to do that much for a person who I have never heard of, and know nothing whatsoever about , why should I not do as much for someone with whom I share at least one thing in common?

Even if I do not know the person, somone reading the thread may, and take some consolation from the expressions of sympathy, no matter how conventional.

Should I reply to my neighbour "Get stuffed, I don't know him, so who give a shit " ?

Exactly! it's a bit of common decency and respect for the person it's something that supposedly separates us from animals, of which there are plenty who lack it these days

And for those who are sitting on a pedestal blow-assing about morbid obsession and hollow statements of concern for fellow motorcyclists who have been taken Most of you haven't been right on that doorstep and almost gone through!
Some of us have been right there and come away with a better sense of what we really are as motorcyclists and know the pain and suffering that a fallen biker may have endured before lights out.

You want a bit of reality of what happens go here but be warned it is F@#*ING!!! GRAPHIC but it's reality, it'll actually teach plenty about not just how vunerable we are but also a bit about having decent bloody LEATHER gear and wearing it!
So have a bit sympathy and respect for those who pull the curtain for the final time, a small gesture isn't much but it counts in any form.

The only reason I read them is in case it was a member of k.b, if it is I like to read through their posts to get a feel for the person. I look at it as a mark of respect and the least I can do.
Others might disagree but each to their own.

I totally agree with all three posts above ..

for me its a mark of respect, totally feel for the families & have heard that a number of non kber family & friends hear bout the site & come in to read what is posted.
I really really feel for those who have lost someone & if a few kind words or acknowledgment of their loss can give a loved one a bit of comfort then I will continue to do so ...

perhaps those unfortunate families who have lost someone can give their perspective on the nature of these threads .. hurtful or helpful ?

[Mom]

What I do not understand (genuinely) is why people should think it offensive, or be so opposed to it.

Dont read me wrong Ixion

I am not offended by the Biker down threads at all! It saddens me to hear of a needless death, and it comes a bit closer when it is a 2 wheel vehicle involved, I guess that brings it a bit closer to me. I am not opposed to them either, you will remember that terrible time that KB had last year with the tragic deaths of some of our members. I felt the pain of the friends and families of those boys that died. That is something different altogether in my mind. The threads that were started back then were meaningful, as have been others since, my comment directly relates to the "I heard a biker has been killed" anyone know anything about it? type threads that lead into OMG the rider is dead...

The thing I actually struggle with is the

............. posts

rip.........posts

I dont know the person, more often than not the one that posts the Police Coms report does not know them either. Why post it, and if it is posted why comment?

[car]

Do cages acknowledge each other............No?

Yes, they do; air-cooled VW owners wave at each other. They wave at Morris Minor owners, too, who in turn wave at other Morris Minor owners, and air-cooled VW owners. But no-one but Mini owners wave at other Mini owners.

There is a sense of "club" on the roads, but it's not restricted to motorcyclists.

[Mom]

perhaps those unfortunate families who have lost someone can give their perspective on the nature of these threads .. hurtful or helpful ?

I have no doubt that on the whole they will have and still take comfort from the words that are posted here when a member dies on the road, or at home or wherever.

That is entirely different to randomly posting ........

for some poor bastard that we have never heard of, dont know, were never likely to meet, that has died while riding a motorcycle.

[MotoKuzzi]

I generally read "biker down" threads, to see if there's any info relating to the crash that might be useful knowledge to another rider. I don't reply if I don't personally know the rider involved.

[Headbanger]

Yes, they do; air-cooled VW owners wave at each other. They wave at Morris Minor owners, too, who in turn wave at other Morris Minor owners, and air-cooled VW owners. But no-one but Mini owners wave at other Mini owners.

There is a sense of "club" on the roads, but it's not restricted to motorcyclists.

Truck drivers wave to each other...

And they still have their sub-groups. Big trucks wont wave to little trucks, so you need to give them such a giant and enthusiastic wave that they wave back as a reaction, Before there coolness kicks in and they stop themselves.

Then, ya flip them the bird.



Then, they try and bully ya off the road next time they see ya...But thats a whole different saga......

[chanceyy]

I have no doubt that on the whole they will have and still take comfort from the words that are posted here when a member dies on the road, or at home or wherever.

That is entirely different to randomly posting ........

for some poor bastard that we have never heard of, dont know, were never likely to meet, that has died while riding a motorcycle.

I have to respectfully disagree Mom .. I have heard of some family members who have found the site & copied the RIP threads regarding their family member & passed it on to other family members ..

regardless if we actually know the person its still an acknowledgment & recognition of the shared passion we have regarding bikes

[T.W.R]

for some poor bastard that we have never heard of, dont know, were never likely to meet, that has died while riding a motorcycle.

I hate to disagree with you, but I'm going to.


All of that said, here's a nice ZXR750 pic just to cheer you up.

Put it a slightly different context then:

You acknowledge other bikers on the road with a wave or gesture, sometimes you miss the acknowledgment from another biker as you pass on the road somewhere no knowing who they are, every now and then you may stop to help a stranded biker or have been helped when stranded by a biker not knowing who they are.
Well just think the fallen rider involved in a fatal could have been the biker who acknowledged you or stopped to help you.

expressing a small bit of acknowledgment of a fallen biker isn't some deep heart stopping form of mourning it's just expressing a thought towards someone who was involved in something that is close to you. An expression of realising how fragile we are out there on the road.

BTW CAR lols I see that ZXR is on TM

[WelshWizard]

Dont read me wrong Ixion

, my comment directly relates to the "I heard a biker has been killed" anyone know anything about it? type threads that lead into OMG the rider is dead...


I dont know the person, more often than not the one that posts the Police Coms report does not know them either. Why post it, and if it is posted why comment?

Police com reports are not much help and are normally fatal errors in them, and yes these do not help Police making comment as to why the accident happened befor a full investigation is just there way of trying to blame evry thing on speed, they are the one that need censoring to just proven facts.

But with some accidents they are not members of KB, but there is a good chance that some one on KB might know them, so all are relevent.

[car]

expressing a small bit of acknowledgment of a fallen biker isn't some deep heart stopping form of mourning it's just expressing a thought towards someone who was involved in something that is close to you. An expression of realising how fragile we are out there on the road.

I get that, and I understand that that's what it means to you. Are you sure that that's what it means to everyone else who posts?

BTW CAR lols I see that ZXR is on TM

Yeah, I'm increasingly less pleased about that. The "health reasons" I cite on the ad aren't bullshit, unfortunately. However, I made the mistake of taking it out for a blat up Paekakariki Hill Road, Gray's Road and then over the hill to the Hutt. What fun! And now every time I see the pics I think "am I compounding a mistake here, by making another?" Oh, well.

[Her_C4]

I generally read "biker down" threads, to see if there's any info relating to the crash that might be useful knowledge to another rider. I don't reply if I don't personally know the rider involved.

Generally that is true for me too. I have family in other cities that also ride, and I worry about them as well as friends and those that I personally know on this forum. I choose whether or not to read the thread, just as I choose whether or not to show my respect to the fallen rider and their friends / families by posting.

Isn't that what it is all about? Personal choice?

With all due respect, it isn't really about 'you' personally and so does it REALLY matter if the threads piss you off or annoy/irritate you in any way?

It is your undeniable right to choose not to read, acknowledge or contribute in any way.

[Cache Wraith]

I don't like seeing "Biker Down" posts but I think it epitomizes the spirit of the KB community. It's NZ's biggest on-line forum and I happily admit to feeling some kinship to other bikers I pass on the road and the ones on KB. If my brother or sister had an accident I would want to know about it.

"Biker Down" threads/posts bring out the good (read compassion) in us - and some of us are hard nuts - and to me that's a good thing. I think it is a little ignorant to think we can have this online community discussing anything and everything to do with bikes and other misc stuff but not have posts about "bikers down". It is a tough fact of life but it is very real in this community and it shouldn't be swept under the carpet or not posted, just so people don't get upset.

To placate the ones against these posts it might be the time to have dedicated threads for crash reporting/discussion/condolences. If that happens I for one will still read them as I will spend a minute thinking about the rider and family and send them some good vibes. It also serves to remind me to be careful out there everytime I read about a crash.

Ride safe brothers and sisters and if I ever read here that you have had a major bin rest assured my thoughts will be with you and your family.