Grafitti "artists" pay the ultimate price in Sydney

**Big Dave** · 22nd January 2008, 12:42

I went Urban Caving when I was seven.
Up the stormwater drains under St George Leagues club.
That was the last time I felt the urge.

And where I met my avatar.

**Mekk** · 22nd January 2008, 12:43

Originally Posted by MSTRS

I refer to the irony of you describing the actions of taggers vs 'urban cavers'...you seem to think there is a difference in tagging to mark territory or be seen by others, compared with leaving a mark to show they've been there or to be seen by others.
And FWIW, I think 'death penalty' is a tad harsh - but anyone stupid enough to enter a stormwater drain in bad weather...well, Darwin at work. No sympathy here.

I was perhaps not as clear as I had hoped.

I was trying to bring light to the difference of taggers doing what they do purely to be seen by as many people as possible. Also to stake territory as opposed to these guys doing it for themselves and the few others that trickle down there. Taggers are about tagging, explorers are about exploring.

I did ask myself why they decided to go in there in bad weather but I suppose the alcohol explains that. Obviously not the wisest of choices but shit, that doesn't make them the scum of the Earth either.

**MSTRS:Me** · 22nd January 2008, 12:56

A slight sideways shift in topic, but still on the subject...
There is a cave near Masterton that has been explored many times over the years and some people have seen fit to leave their mark on the walls, mostly in pencil of all things. The thing is, in some parts of this cave seepage of lime-filled water has left layers of clear over top of some of these marks, preserving them forever, and so they are there to be seen until such time as the cave is no longer viable.
The second thing is that these marks are the (full)names of the markers and the date they were there. The size of these marks is about the same as if you were writing a note to yourself (not big eh?) Vandalism? Perhaps. But they were not making a statement whilst hiding their identity, were they?
Nobody in their right mind would leave that info these days...I wonder why?

**MGST** · 22nd January 2008, 13:10

Originally Posted by MSTRS

anyone stupid enough to enter a stormwater drain in bad weather...well, Darwin at work. No sympathy here.

Exactly. Bling for you Mr

**sunhuntin** · 22nd January 2008, 13:23

Originally Posted by MSTRS

A slight sideways shift in topic, but still on the subject...
There is a cave near Masterton that has been explored many times over the years and some people have seen fit to leave their mark on the walls, mostly in pencil of all things. The thing is, in some parts of this cave seepage of lime-filled water has left layers of clear over top of some of these marks, preserving them forever, and so they are there to be seen until such time as the cave is no longer viable.
The second thing is that these marks are the (full)names of the markers and the date they were there. The size of these marks is about the same as if you were writing a note to yourself (not big eh?) Vandalism? Perhaps. But they were not making a statement whilst hiding their identity, were they?
Nobody in their right mind would leave that info these days...I wonder why?

just a thought, but marks like that, where nature is preserving them, could be fascinating for furture people. like cave drawings from prehistoric times, and hieroglyphics fascinate us today... im sure in their day they werent viewed as much.

**Mint Sauce** · 22nd January 2008, 13:27

just a thought, but marks like that, where nature is preserving them, could be fascinating for furture people. like cave drawings from prehistoric times, and hieroglyphics fascinate us today... im sure in their day they werent viewed as much.

Do you really think our stormwater drain infrastructure will last that long?

well, Darwin at work. No sympathy here.

Well seeing as you mentioned it, some people may be interested in this site
http://www.darwinawards.com/

**sunhuntin** · 22nd January 2008, 13:31

mstrs was talking about a cave, which is what i was referring to.

**Mekk** · 22nd January 2008, 16:18

Originally Posted by Mint Sauce

Do you really think our stormwater drain infrastructure will last that long?

It doesn't really have to last that long to be significant. Any number of events could happen in the next 10 or 20 years that could make it fascinating for future generations...but it's more for future explorers anyway.

**Bikernereid** · 22nd January 2008, 16:35

nasty nasty people

Originally Posted by sunhuntin

+1 ......................

**Dave-** · 22nd January 2008, 16:41

banksy

**sunhuntin** · 22nd January 2008, 19:06

Originally Posted by Bikern1mpho

nasty nasty people

as said, artistry like that is fine... its the shitty tags that drive people crazy.

**Big Dave** · 22nd January 2008, 19:25

Originally Posted by Dave-

banksy

Thanks for that.

In some ways Banksy conforms to the Robert Hughes paradigm where the art is the bridge between 2 previously unconnected ideas.

Of most of it I am in awe - some of it makes me uncomfortable - not for the content - but that the bridge is too obviously constructed of 'shock value'.

We were a bit over that with Warhol, but then some of it is just perfect.

For those noting the word paradigm and hoping to score points in a round of word-wanker-bingo, this is one of many favourites:

**Dave-** · 22nd January 2008, 22:21

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Wall-Piece-Banksy/dp/1844137864

want.

wonder if boarders have it...

**Mint Sauce** · 23rd January 2008, 06:09

nasty nasty people

Rather judgemental of others views and opinions don't you think?

I seem to remember some serious 'dummy spitting' and 'toys out the pram' behaviour from someone who felt emails were being judgemental about them not so long ago.