Wearing Hi-Viz Black.
Stuff that. A free sombrero or nothing!Originally Posted by Toaster
Luckily in a few years time, NZ will be a cheap labour source and we will be attracting work from (other?) third world countries.
I wonder if you will be able to get a free squishy from ANZ/National bank soon...?
TOP QUOTE: “The problem with socialism is that sooner or later you run out of other people’s money.”
Forum whore
Not the directors fault - they are obliged (by law, I think) to get the best possible return for the shareholders. NZ minimum labour rate is about $12/hr. Chine, thailand, etc, if they have a minimum rate at all, is going to be about $1or less an hour, and the products will be made nearly as well as they are here. Likewise Mexico.
But Italy? surely the labour rate there is pretty high, protected as it is by all the EU regulations.
it's not a bad thing till you throw a KLR into the mix.
those cheap ass bitches can do anything with ductape.
(PostalDave on ADVrider)
Psyclepath
So you expect F&P to compete with all the big names who are already manufacturing in cheapo places, and keep building here?
What you would buy? Thai-built, NZ designed or US designed Mexico built?
Only a homo puts an engine back together WITHOUT making it go faster.
Forum whore
yeah the labour may be more in tialy , but the cost of the shipping may be stuff all
Having a Zen moment...
Like National would have done any different - both large parties think the China FTA is a great idea, remember.
Don't mind me, I'm an honorary member of the Balance Police.
Buy NZ Made is the legacy of Rod Donald, and is, what's the word, aspirational. Also known as A Bloody Good Idea, although possibly a little optimistic.
Today's job losses are just the fruit of globalisation, and continued population growth, coupled with (yes, still) cheap oil. For as long as you can get a(nother) wage slave in a foreign sweatshop to work for two bowls of rice and a rusty farthing a day, while making a product/delivering a service that's, well, close to the same quality, and it doesn't cost that much to ship lots of them about the place, businesses will do it. Because all they value is money, not people's lives.
So much for the free market dream.
Might be worth having a look at this.
Redefining slow since 2006...
Wherever you go, there you are
I'l be in quick before Finn adds his $.50 worth. As an investor in various parts of the world I can certainly understand the need to make a profit. However as a worker, who has lost his job twice, I can also understand the hardship that those workers are going through. Shareholders take risks in companies when they invest money in them just as workers also take risks by investing their time and careers into a company. If it goes wrong the investor is out of pocket and any smart one wouldn't put all their eggs in one basket, so the whole portfolio isn't lost. On the other hand the worker is out of a job, money and often in for a career change. It is a little hard for a worker to "spread their risk" so they tend to lose all of their investment. So the workers are personally the biggest losers here and yet they seem to be seen and treated as an easily disposed of commodity when the share holders bottom line isn't met. Often this is done with little more than a wry grin (as the CEO of F&P did tonight on Campbel Live) along with a shrug of the shoulders as if there was nothing that could be done with a company that last year posted a profit..! It was nothing short of a silky shafting by a smiling knife. I'm also with Hitcher on this one.
Us New Zealanders just seem to be rapidly becoming tennants in our own country.
If you love it, let it go. If it comes back to you, you've just high-sided!
مافي مشكلة
Forum whore
So, why aren't you on a Hyosung then? (not a very good analogy, since Hyosung are not actually bad quality. But none of the Chinese manufacturers make a 650 V twin)
Henceforth F&P will just be another brand of cheap Asian crap. Like the chinese motorcycles. Many people here buy them? Why not? after all, they're made with cheap labour?
F&P have elected to abandon the "Why should you buy F&P. Because it's good quality, NZ made ", and opt for "Why should you buy F&P? because it's cheap".
Trouble is , whe n your only market differentiator is "we're cheap", there's always going to be someone in a short while will be able to say "we're cheaper". Like those chinese bikes .
And , like the chinese bikes, a lot of people will elect not to buy F&P any more. Because there's another brand of cheap chinese crap that's $10 cheaper, and when the only distinguisher is cheapness, one buys the cheapest cheapness.
The balance sheets of companies like Fisher & Paykel always include an entry for the value of the brands and goodwill. Usually in the tens of millions (anyone know a figure ?) . I reckon that F&P wrote all that off today.
Good for the investors in the short term? Probably. But I wouldn't care to be leaving a parcel of F&P shares to grandchildren. In effect the directors have elected tro asset strip the company. Ten years time and it'll be gone
'
"channellling the Pleideans"
ever think that by culling the new zealand manufacturing, that it might allow the company to survive the next five years, preserving SOME value to the shareholders, whereas if they did nothing the whole company would likely go down the shitter?
Personally I am surprised that its taken as long as this to close their manufacturing facilities in NZ. F & P Healthcare stuff (medical and surgical equipment) has been made offshore for years and is a world leader in its niche markets.
The directors of these companies, in addition to facing some personal liability, or at least the potential of it if they get it too wrong (Bridgecorp) are not stupid, are at least as patriotic as anyone reading this thread, and probably lost a lot of sleep about the decision they inevitably had to make.
Bet you're all winging about F & P while watching your Chinese made plasma screen, and sitting scratching your arses on your Korean made couch, with your feet up on your delightful Thai made wife or coffeetable.
Get a bloody clue!
I thought elections were decided by angry posts on social media. - F5 Dave
Hardcore Biker
I think the Unions could have done better for everyone here, instead of just marching to Labours tune they should be lobbying the Govt for the kinds of deals that keep manufacturers happy. In the last 9 long years what has been done to improve the manufacturing sector, SFA. EPMPU hasnt had much to say. EMPU should be working for the workers not propping up labour and its weak , shallow on most things especially experience ministers.
If mexico can offer manufacturers incentives , then to level the field we should do the same. I cant blame F&P for their actions they want to be in business 10 , 20 , 30 years from now, playing duelling banjos in Mosgeil isnt going to assure them of that
Wherever you go, there you are
Oh cool, does that mean we (NZers) are going to get some cheaper F&P whiteware?
If you love it, let it go. If it comes back to you, you've just high-sided!
مافي مشكلة
Wherever you go, there you are
Bit over the top with the aggro there mate...
If you love it, let it go. If it comes back to you, you've just high-sided!
مافي مشكلة
Having a Zen moment...
Some valid points there (although I don't have a plasma or a Thai wife or coffeetable), but what's the end game? We keep shifting manufacturing capability somewhere cheaper, big race to the bottom, and then what?
Redefining slow since 2006...
Loud and Uncouth
I was surprised MORE NZ manufacturing companies haven't closed down - how can they compete when the cheap overseas wages can make the same profit??
BTW: Should somebody discover that milk causes Alzhiemers or similar Kiwiland would be in the crap right up to it's little tiki eyeball, talk about starting to put all ones eggs in the basket....
Winding up drongos, foil hat wearers and over sensitive KBers for over 14,000 posts...........
" Life is not a rehearsal, it's as happy or miserable as you want to make it"
"channellling the Pleideans"
No, no, and especially no.
HOW could the unions have done better? WHAT could they have done specifically? Isnt a union now as state recognised organisation whose job it is is to obtain better wages and conditions for its members. Surely then it could be argued that the unions have been very successful, to the point in fact where their success impinged on the ability of the company to continue. yes, infinite expansion in a closed system, what is that, oh yes. Cancer. Thats it, unions are cancer.
And how you can say that after what, 10 years in gummint that Labour lacks experienced ministers is very strange indeed. Particularly in industrial relations and labour they have very experienced people there.
I thought elections were decided by angry posts on social media. - F5 Dave
Forum whore
Made-in-China.com lists 1999 chinese refrigerator manufacturers. Now, it's 2000.
I'd be quite certain that at least one , probably hundreds of the other 1999 can undercut F&P. And someone will organise importing them.
F&P have traded on the loyalty of Kiwis to the local boy for years. Now, that's gone. They're no different to Hangzhou Kator Foreign Trade Ltd or Jinan Bestar INC. Long term, they've signed the company death warrant.
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