Scooter pillion laws

**Romeo** · 29th April 2008, 15:51

Gidday,
I was just researching about carrying a passenger on a moped. I was pretty confident that if you had a full class 1 licence you could carry a passenger on a moped. However I cannot find a single reference to this on the LTSA website.

I have a full class 1 and a learner class 6.

Does this entitle me to pillion a passenger on a moped?
Do my class 6 restrictions apply?

OUTCOME:

EMAIL FROM Land Transport NZ

Good Afternoon ,

Thank you for your email dated 29 April 2008.

Legislation does not clearly state that the holder of a class 1 licence (of any stage) is permitted to carry passengers when operating a moped nor does it forbid the carriage of passengers when operating a moped. Where a licence holder holds both class 1 licence (of any stage) and class 6 graduated licence, legislation does not clarify which licence class must be used when operating a moped.

This legislative gap will be address in the Omnibus Rule 2007, which still has not been passed into law. The link to this Rule can be found on your forum.

The police may choose to ticket the person where they hold both class 1 (of any stage) and class 6 graduated licence if they are carrying passengers on a moped. If the driver disputes the Police's decision to issue the ticket, the driver can appeal through the Courts. The Courts will then decide the outcome based on the facts of each case.

The Police also have the option of exercising "constabulary discretion" and not issue a ticket.

Either way this is a decision for the Police as to whether or not a ticket is issued and a decision for the Courts as to whether or not the Police's decision is upheld.

Land Transport New Zealand recommend the individual comply with the conditions of the class 6 graduated licence. This will ensure they are full compliant with legislation - thus removing any risk of being ticketed for carrying pillion passengers.

I hope this information is helpful.

Kind regards

Senior Customer Service Representative
Contact Centre

Source: Land Transport NZ: Section 2

Cheers,
Romeo

**kevfromcoro** · 29th April 2008, 15:55

Fairly sure you can on a full....
Scooter has to have approved back pegs...or somewhere for pillion to put there feet safetly

**hellnback** · 29th April 2008, 16:03

Class 1 is for cars therefore license restrictions only apply when driving a car and vice versa.
Only things needed for a pillion are footpegs, helmet and rider must have a full class 6 license.
See here.

**breakaway** · 29th April 2008, 16:08

^ What? Class 1 is car, 6 is bike.

**xwhatsit** · 29th April 2008, 16:16

I became very confused reading the moped rules.

As far as I can work out, you can ride one on any license (well we knew that) -- but (importantly) it didn't mention anything about L/R etc. Not with reference to curfew, passengers, anything.

Can somebody well versed in the art of silly-speak translate it for us?

**xwhatsit** · 29th April 2008, 16:16

Originally Posted by hellnback

Class 1 is for cars therefore license restrictions only apply when driving a car and vice versa.
Only things needed for a pillion are footpegs, helmet and rider must have a full class 6 license.
See here.

That's for motorsickles. Mopeds ain't.

**hellnback** · 29th April 2008, 16:17

Originally Posted by breakaway

^ What? Class 1 is car, 6 is bike.

^ Fixed....

Found another link
I could be wrong.... again
Doesn't say anything about needing to have a full class 6 license in order to carry passengers on a moped.....

**Romeo** · 29th April 2008, 16:39

I guess you all see what I mean now. Does anyone know of a copper who'd know? If so, a PM might be in order.

Cheers,
Romeo

//EDIT: I've flicked an email off to the LTSA, though they say it may take up to 10 working days for a reply. So don't hold your collective breaths.

**EFFBEE** · 29th April 2008, 19:04

Hi
2 things - 1. Mopeds are restricted to a max speed of less than 60 and are not supposed to carry passengers. You can ride on a full car or bike licence. They do not need to be regularly WOFed.
2. A scooter that is sold new that can do more than the limit above is classified as a motorcycle, has to be WOFed and can only be ridden by someone with a full, restricted or learners motorcycle licence. Only the holder of a full bike licence can carry a pillion passenger (legally).

I think this is correct.

**Gubb** · 29th April 2008, 19:10

Originally Posted by EFFBEE

Hi
2 things - 1. Mopeds are restricted to a max speed of less than 60 and are not supposed to carry passengers. You can ride on a full car or bike licence. They do not need to be regularly WOFed.
I'm pretty sure the restriction is on power (2Kw or under 50cc), and not on top speed. Also, as far as I can remember, Moped's don't need a WOF at all.

2. A scooter that is sold new that can do more than the limit above is classified as a motorcycle, has to be WOFed (see point 1) and can only be ridden by someone with a full, restricted or learners motorcycle licence. Only the holder of a full bike licence can carry a pillion passenger (legally).

I think this is correct.

That part is pretty much understood by all.

But this puts you back at Square one. Sorry, I hope LTSA is helpful.

**Romeo** · 29th April 2008, 19:54

Originally Posted by EFFBEE

Hi
2 things - 1. Mopeds are restricted to a max speed of less than 60 and are not supposed to carry passengers. You can ride on a full car or bike licence. They do not need to be regularly WOFed.
2. A scooter that is sold new that can do more than the limit above is classified as a motorcycle, has to be WOFed and can only be ridden by someone with a full, restricted or learners motorcycle licence. Only the holder of a full bike licence can carry a pillion passenger (legally).

I think this is correct.

Well, unfortunately that doesn't exactly tell us what we need to hear.

You've said...
Case 1) It's classified as a moped (so what are the pillion laws?)
Case 2) It's not classified as a moped, so the motorcycle rules apply

If you have any access to the specific moped rules regarding pillions I'd love to hear them ;D!

//EDIT: I've just read through my '99 and '07 road codes, and both say "It is illegal to carry a passenger unless there is a pillion seat and footrests". Neither roadcodes state any licence requirements.

I assume the learner + restricted licence rule of "must not carry passengers at any time" overrides the above statement. Therefore since I have a full NZ class 1 drivers licence, I should be able to carry a passenger, without any restriction.

**Timber020** · 29th April 2008, 20:17

I read that it was legal for a moped to have a sidecar or trailer, that way you could carry 3 others!

**Romeo** · 29th April 2008, 20:34

Originally Posted by Timber020

I read that it was legal for a moped to have a sidecar or trailer, that way you could carry 3 others!

As far as I know it's legal for a trailer, but not a sidecar?! Go figure ;s.

**scootnz** · 29th April 2008, 20:58

Proposal currently under way to stop mopeds carrying pillions anyway. Apparently LTNZ have noticed this grey area regarding car licence/moped/pillion stuff.

http://www.landtransport.govt.nz/con...mendments.html

Off topic: Notice under there a reference to adding 'tractor' to the list of vehicles on which a driving test cannot be carried out. "From time to time, a person presents for a test on a tractor. This amendment would make it clear that tests cannot be taken on tractors."

**Romeo** · 29th April 2008, 22:24

Originally Posted by scootnz

Proposal currently under way to stop mopeds carrying pillions anyway. Apparently LTNZ have noticed this grey area regarding car licence/moped/pillion stuff.

http://www.landtransport.govt.nz/con...mendments.html

BINGO - you found it ScootNZ!

As of the 14th of September, 2007...
"...Class 1L licence holders can carry pillion passengers..."

That's right folks, you can legally pillion a passenger on a moped, on your learner car licence! WTF...

Source: Land Transport NZ: Section 2