Protesters with boltcutters and pointy sticks deflate one of the Waihopai domes

[ManDownUnder]

I hope that the SIS continues to use National Radio to intercept their thoughts.

They can listen but not act upon them due to the privacy act... and probably the treaty as well as the RMA - somehow.

The red tape involved to use this info to any gain would be overwhelming.

[jrandom]

Deranged, delusional, paranoid, conspiracy theorists shit me to tears. Particularly when they indulge in senseless vandalism or worse to make a point, whatever that is.

You support the use of NZ taxpayer funds to provide SIGINT services to the American military establishment, then?

Or were you simply unaware that that was the case?

[imdying]

You support the use of NZ taxpayer funds to provide SIGINT services to the American military establishment, then?

Or were you simply unaware that that was the case?

Most definitely, we have leaned upon the Americans in the past, and most likely will do so again. This is a relatively minor imposition on the people of New Zealand, and probably quite cost effective compared to having a decent defence budget (which is what severing ties with the states would have to result in, as that's potentially what they'll do if we tell them to stick their dishes).

[Ixion]

Deranged, delusional, paranoid, conspiracy theorists shit me to tears. Particularly when they indulge in senseless vandalism or worse to make a point, whatever that is. I hope that the SIS continues to use National Radio to intercept their thoughts.

There is scarcely any "conspiracy", Deranged, delusional, paranoid or otherwise.

The Waihopai installations certainly exist. Their purpose is no secret, it has been openly stated in parliament, and is authorised by the Telecommnications (Interception Capability) Bill. The GCSB who run it certainly exist (they even have a - very badly designed- website). And that they form part of the Echelon intelligence network is openly stated by Ministers in Hansard.

None of this is a conspiracy. Some people think that NZ should not engage in such activities, and/or object to the perceived lack of controls over the GCSB. You, unsurprisingly, disagree. (as, somewhat more surprisingly, do I - which is quite irrelevant).

They are as entitled to their opinion as you are to yours. I doubt that ad hominen derogation would worry those involved in this incident, but it adds little to support for the activities of the GCSB.

Nor can their actions be deemed "senseless". Given that their opposition is valid, it makes perfect sense to create an incident which draws public attention to the activity which they oppose.

[Usarka]

If i ask are they obliged under the privacy act to divulge what information they have intercepted from/about me?

[Ixion]

No, they are exempt.

[Hitcher]

You support the use of NZ taxpayer funds to provide SIGINT services to the American military establishment, then?

Or were you simply unaware that that was the case?

I'd rather we had a couple of squadrons of F16s. The costs to the New Zealand taxpayer for maintaining useful working relationships with Uncle Sam are small beer. And the value of any "SIGINT" derived from Waihopai or any similar monitoring facility is questionable, given the events of 9/11 and the inability of the world's largest superpower to locate and destroy their number one most wanted person.

[jrandom]

I'd rather we had a couple of squadrons of F16s. The costs to the New Zealand taxpayer for maintaining useful working relationships with Uncle Sam are small beer. And the value of any "SIGINT" derived from Waihopai or any similar monitoring facility is questionable, given the events of 9/11 and the inability of the world's largest superpower to locate and destroy their number one most wanted person.

All very good points.

I note that the saboteurs' motivations were of an idealistic and religious nature, rather than being based on any form of political pragmatism.

[scumdog]

Nor can their actions be deemed "senseless". Given that their opposition is valid, it makes perfect sense to create an incident which draws public attention to the activity which they oppose.

They're dreamworld conspiracy dorks whose actions have brought derision around their ears.
Hope the have to pay zillions for their Intentional Damage - 'cos that's all it is.

[ManDownUnder]

I'd rather we had a couple of squadrons of F16s.

The costs of buying and maintaining them would be horrendous - the only Department with that sort of cash is Social Welfare I can only imagine how many poor innocents would be forced to get a real job.

You heartless bastard - can I buy you a beer?

[jrandom]

The costs of buying and maintaining them would be horrendous - the only Department with that sort of cash is Social Welfare I can only imagine how many poor innocents would be forced to get a real job.

Make Ethnic Minority Babies, Not War! (tm)

[ManDownUnder]

Make Ethnic Minority Babies, Not War! (tm)

I did - I'm Manx by decent...

[lb99]

that will be why some airforce dinosaur came in low and loud at about 9am on a queer angle, i told my workmate to look for a big cloud of smoke........

I drove past the base twice this afternoon and never noticed, until I got to work and saw the paper at afternoon smoko.

take that you pricks, those fuckers will probably collapse regularly now


I know they get really upset when the leave the gate open and you follow them in on your bike to snap a few pics, yes a cbx400 can outrun a white hiace, but the cops were waiting at home to tell me to pull my head in, so was the wife.

[bikemike]

As with the recent Lyttleton Coal / Greenpeace doodah, you are all being primed to loath these guys, even before you stop to think seriously about what they are doing and what is going on.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/4451578a10.html

"A lone constable was attacked in a brawl in central Christchurch yesterday as 30 other officers spent hours dealing with a Greenpeace protest on Lyttelton Harbour, police said."

According to Air Marshal Ferguson in the NZ Herald article linked in this thread:

"Obviously it's just imposing a cost on the taxpayer having to rebuild. That's why I describe it as a senseless act of criminal vandalism".

What about the cost(s) to us with the base as it is? (Quite apart from any consideration on whether you agree with it or not)

Manipulation of public opinion - that - is what is going on.

I thought you lot were free thinkers

[Toaster]

Deranged, delusional, paranoid, conspiracy theorists shit me to tears. Particularly when they indulge in senseless vandalism or worse to make a point, whatever that is. I hope that the SIS continues to use National Radio to intercept their thoughts.

That would be the GCSB mate.