Get ready to hit your kids...

**Flatcap** · 22nd August 2008, 18:13

Originally Posted by Grahameeboy

People are good judges of Laws are they....mmm...so they are objective when ignoring then...

Do you really think that smacking is the most effective component of the parental toolbox...funny how we don't apply adult v adult tools to our kids and set an example...

He said A tool, not "the most effective" tool.

Yes - perhaps we should have corporal punishment for adults as well.

**Grahameeboy** · 22nd August 2008, 18:15

Originally Posted by Flatcap

He said A tool, not "the most effective" tool

and he said "effective"...

**devnull** · 22nd August 2008, 18:16

Originally Posted by Grahameeboy

People are good judges of Laws are they....mmm...so they are objective when ignoring then...

Do you really think that smacking is the most effective component of the parental toolbox...funny how we don't apply adult v adult tools to our kids and set an example...

What a bullshit argument...
It is a valid and effective tool - only you said most effective

See Millchamp (Otago Uni 2006) for info on effectiveness
See "Child Deaths in Sweden: The Swedish Myth" (Beckett, British Journal of Social Work) for examples of the anti-smacking fallacy.

Bottom line - the law is crap - they didn't want to target the real risk indicators, because it would upset core Labour supporters

**Flatcap** · 22nd August 2008, 18:17

Originally Posted by Grahameeboy

and he said "effective"...

which is completely different to "the most effective"

**Grahameeboy** · 22nd August 2008, 18:18

Originally Posted by devnull

What a bullshit argument...
It is a valid and effective tool - only you said most effective

See Millchamp (Otago Uni 2006) for info on effectiveness
See "Child Deaths in Sweden: The Swedish Myth" (Beckett, British Journal of Social Work) for examples of the anti-smacking fallacy.

Bottom line - the law is crap - they didn't want to target the real risk indicators, because it would upset core Labour supporters

To you, yes.

Studies are for a reason, not always a good ones

**devnull** · 22nd August 2008, 18:19

Originally Posted by Grahameeboy

To you, yes.

Studies are for a reason, not always a good ones

Ah, so any research that doesn't conform to your opinion is automatically wrong?

**Grahameeboy** · 22nd August 2008, 18:20

Originally Posted by Flatcap

which is completely different to "the most effective"

Okay, my lazy English...apologies but the reality is that parents tend to treat kids different to the way the treat adults which I don't agree with.

Now I cannot smack Nats amd I just use chat and reason and it works so to me smacking is 100% not necessary

**Grahameeboy** · 22nd August 2008, 18:21

Originally Posted by devnull

Ah, so any research that doesn't conform to your opinion is automatically wrong?

No I did not say that but say you did a study into smacking it is likely that it would have a biased slant on it...human nature...

**Flatcap** · 22nd August 2008, 18:22

Originally Posted by Grahameeboy

Okay, my lazy English...apologies but the reality is that parents tend to treat kids different to the way the treat adults which I don't agree with.

No -that's not lazy english, it's a total misquote of a post to suit your argument.

I do agree with your point above though. Corporal punishment for adults

**Grahameeboy** · 22nd August 2008, 18:24

Originally Posted by Flatcap

No -that's not lazy english, it's a total misquote of a post to suit your argument.

I do agree with your point above though. Corporal punishment for adults

Nope, was lazy English and I apologised for that.

**devnull** · 22nd August 2008, 18:24

Originally Posted by Grahameeboy

No I did not say that but say you did a study into smacking it is likely that it would have a biased slant on it...human nature...

Neither of those papers are smacking specific - before claiming bias, I suggest actually reading them.

**Grahameeboy** · 22nd August 2008, 18:25

Originally Posted by devnull

Neither of those papers are smacking specific - before claiming bias, I suggest actually reading them.

Fair enough............

**MisterD** · 22nd August 2008, 18:35

Originally Posted by Grahameeboy

Okay, my lazy English...apologies but the reality is that parents tend to treat kids different to the way the treat adults which I don't agree with.

My esteemed friend Flatcap has done most of the follow up arguing for me but I set my own standards for how I treat my kid, I abide by society's standards for how I treat other adults and other people's kids.

I believe the authorative research says that kids need the following:

1) Love
2) Boundaries and
3) Consequences for crossing those boundaries

**Grahameeboy** · 22nd August 2008, 18:38

Originally Posted by MisterD

My esteemed friend Flatcap has done most of the follow up arguing for me but I set my own standards for how I treat my kid, I abide by society's standards for how I treat other adults and other people's kids.

I believe the authorative research says that kids need the following:

1) Love
2) Boundaries and
3) Consequences for crossing those boundaries

Societies standards?? That is interesting...

Agree with 1 and 2 and 3...although I guess I have a different personal perspective...just don't think that consequences = smacking...