Epic Fail?

[sinfull]

I must be thick - please explain.

One of "them" threads, Yeah guess ya had to be there !~

[Forest]

Organic means "Contains Carbon" or relates to organisms. It is impossible to make beer without yeast (organisms) therefore all beer (and fermented products) are, by definition organic.

One of the fun things about the English language is that words can have multiple and distinct meanings.

Ducati motorbikes are often praised for their organic flowing lines. Companies who acquire their competitors are said to be growing organically. A piece of art might be praised for its organic unity.

If the beer was described as "chemical free" then it would definitely be worth a chuckle.

[Forest]

It's perfectly possible - the empty in the recyclatron is evidence of that. However, it is kind of ironic. Or perhaps oxymoronic would be more correct.

It isn't oxymoronic. The word you wanted was tautology.

[vifferman]

i can't see the fail.
or are you saying that the fermentition process makes it (inorganic) ?
expect organic food to cost more as as someone has to keep a lookout for bugs and fungi,rather than just poisoning the food every week with sprays.
nz is getting a whole lot better with the chemicals we put on our food.
big up's to those leading the charge.

Oh dear - you have been sucked in haven't you (no offense intended.
Well... maybe just a little bit.
This isn't the answer - just a reply to your statements. Organic food is usually worse quality than normal food, and also more expensive, Take just one aspect of organic farming: avoiding "chemicals" for fertilising the soil. Many organic farmers use "natural" fertilizers (i.e., shit), with the result that many crops have very high levels of faecal coliforms, making the products extremely dangerous, c.f., "unnatural" food. No-one's demonstrably died from food fertilised with commercial fertilisers, but many people have got very sick or died from food poisoning due to faecal contamination. (And any way - the nutrients and organic compounds (in the true, not hippy sense) the platns need are just chemicals anyway. How can the plant tell the difference?)

Anyway, rant mode off.
The answer is this: the purpose of organic food is supposedly to make the food more natural and healthy. The makers of the organic beer have overlooked one very important fact: the beer contains (by design) 4.2% of a harmful neurotoxin. It doesn't matter WTF they make the beer out of, beer is by design poisonous.
Why bother? [insert that very useful :spudwhat: emoticodweebicon here]

[piston broke]

no offence taken.

but after a decade working on orchards,i sorta know a bit about the pesticides and fertalisers that are sprayed.
i think you will find that organic fertalisers are made from seaweed and such,not shit.

[vifferman]

no offence taken.

but after a decade working on orchards,i sorta know a bit about the pesticides and fertalisers that are sprayed.
i think you will find that organic fertalisers are made from seaweed and such,not shit.

Maybe in your experience (and I bow to the fact it's much greater'n mine), but not always - especially not for veges.
And yes, some of the chemicals used on orchards in particular are pretty nasty (father-in-law owned one for 25 years or so, and I worked on it on a casual basis).

[Mikkel]

I bought some beer today, including a really nice-looking one from a boutique brewery. When I cracked it and got around to perusing the label, I discovered it proudly proclaimed it was an "organic beer".
"Hmmm...." I thought, "that's an epic fail if ever there was one!"

I always laugh when I see "organic sea salt" in the supermarket.


Nothing wrong with using shit as a fertiliser. That has been done for centuries and is still being used today. It's not dangerous and it's not harmful. You don't spray the standing crops with it though - just use it to prepare the soil once it has been plowed, but before seeding. Much less harmful than pumping livestock effluent into the rivers (and onto the road as well).

There's nothing wrong with the idea of organic produce (although the organic moniker is misleading and ill-conceived - ecologically sustainable would be more precise I suppose). Adapting more sustainable farming methods is not a bad idea - plenty of examples of soil depletion. Same goes for fish and freshwater.
I do however agree that there's a lot of bullshit hype about all the organic, free trade, what-have-you labels that are, to a large degree, only there to make people feel better about themselves and better than everybody else.

Just a by-thought: Funnily enough some of the nastiest shit out there are organic chemicals. Especially some organical solvents (not thinking ethanol here) can be truly nasty!

[McDuck]

A lot of people missunderstand the work 'organic'. People think it is spray free, people think it is hippy based etc. It isnt. It simply means that no man-made compounds are used in crop managment.

This means that for a funicide spray copper (a heavy metel) is in but another synthisised chemical is out. Another example is say a farmer wants to apply Phosphorous. This is element that the plant may need (a soil test should be conducted to determan how much). The first option is Tripple Super By ravensdown. This is fine for a normal grower but is non organic. The organic farmer/grower will need to use RPR or reactive rock Phosphate. This is organic, is cheeper but is very slow to work so if you alredy have defency syptoms it will be to late. it also takes about twice the amount to get the same concentration as in the tripple super.

Another example is Nitorgen. The Cheepest way to apply nitrogen is with urea but an organic grower cant usethis, they need to use things like blood and bone, compost, seaweed ferts etc to achive the same result.


I hope this made sence.

[Swoop]

It couldn't have been Sweinlager then.
That shit has got to be 110% chemicals.

[Mikkel]

A lot of people missunderstand the work 'organic'. People think it is spray free, people think it is hippy based etc. It isnt. It simply means that no man-made compounds are used in crop managment.

Where does elbow-grease come from? I pretty sure most farmers add a bit of that into the mix along the way.

[vifferman]

But are we agreed that it's pointless touting beer has organic status, when by design it's poisonous?
WTF is the point?

[Morcs]

I bought some beer today, including a really nice-looking one from a boutique brewery. When I cracked it and got around to perusing the label, I discovered it proudly proclaimed it was an "organic beer".
"Hmmm...." I thought, "that's an epic fail if ever there was one!"

Talk about laugh - I very nearly started.
It tasted OK though...

not sure it qualifies as an Epic fail. Maybe just a Fail.

to be an epic fail:

The highest form of fail known to man. Reaching this level of fail means only one thing:

You must die, or the world will fail itself due to such an extreme level of failage.

I dont think it qualifies.

So in a sense,

[vifferman]

not sure it qualifies as an Epic fail. Maybe just a Fail.

Of course you're right.
I entitled the thread "Epic Fail" only because it looked more betterer.
Perhaps I should get a Mod to change it to, "Maybe a Fail (on the basis of Oxymoronism)"

[slofox]

Vifferman, if you were drinking Epic Pale Ale, it would have to have been an EPIC SUCCESS.........and if you haven't tried Epic Pale Ale, you should have. I could always freight some to ya if you need me to.....at a modest cost of course.....

[-df-]

Take just one aspect of organic farming: avoiding "chemicals" for fertilising the soil. Many organic farmers use "natural" fertilizers (i.e., shit), with the result that many crops have very high levels of faecal coliforms, making the products extremely dangerous, c.f., "unnatural" food. No-one's demonstrably died from food fertilised with commercial fertilisers, but many people have got very sick or died from food poisoning due to faecal contamination. (And any way - the nutrients and organic compounds (in the true, not hippy sense) the platns need are just chemicals anyway. How can the plant tell the difference?)

Sigh...another person talking about "shit" they don't know about.

So...to qualify as bio-gro certified organic food, what must be done with the "shit" before it is used?