True Production Racing series

[Crasherfromwayback]

I worked for Bruce when he had the Tas Suzuki out here. . . . . . . . . . .

So you are who?

[Mishy]

And do you mean 'Jay' that raced the Museum Hotel ZX6? I could be outta line here...but I think if that's the 'Jay'...he had all sorts of problems with handling 'issues'. Does anyone know if his (if that's the 'J' in question) ZX6 was running stock suspension??? Bet it wasn't.

And you'd win that bet too It's a good thing too, because It just wasn't nice at all on the stock stuff once Jay pushed. Don't get me wrong - they are all very good machines, but there are guys like Jay and Sam and Dennis and James and Nick etc etc who quickly get to the point where they could go faster with more control from the bike than it gives them in stock trim. That's what we want to give them - and when they get it, they go faster.
The ZX6 was actually quite good by the end of the season, but it needed some fairly large adjustments from one track to the next, ones that would have been impossible with stock suspension. And "issues" are a relative thing. Jay set pole at Timaru whilst riding around "issues". At least we were able to work with those issues. . . . . . . . .

[Mishy]

So you are who?

Cliff Burton reincarnated . . . . . . . .

[Shaun]

Hey Mishy, what you have been saying so far has been interesting.

1) Put trick suspension internalls into a bike, and you need a person who under stands what does what to get the best value for buck from it all

2) Put a different tire compund on, and you need to re set bike and tire psi etc to get the very best from the package

3) Play with your geometery radically like you guys did, and end up with a bag of shite, like you guys did at manfeild many months back, when I suggested a different set up, which you guys tried, and went faster ( Jay and Andrew were happy)

The point to this dribble is, ALL of the above can be learned on a std production bike!!!!! Fuckin Cheap, no $3000 front fork kits, or $3000 shocks or $800 stearing dampers

Just saved near on $7000-00--- And there is ya full season running costs of a STD 600 Production bike, where many many many riders have learned there skill.

Now it is time after a season in the production class, to move onto after market suspension, to get the very very best from your self and your bike.

You cannot be an Accountant, with out doing the training, so WHY even bother, your average fastish rider here, may pick up a second or so from $5=6000 of suspension parts, that is NOT worth it for FUN riders, and learners!

Tires, bahahaha, if one brand cannot deal with a true production class of racing, another can, there is a good quality tire breed out there that can deal with this class simle, you know it and I do.

CONTINENTAL Tires will be on ALL these bikes, and I will decide which compound, from testing that I will personally do, to determine the compound etc.

PS, remember what was said by some one we both know last year about a certain person working on suspension?

If you do not have a good set up man, there is NO point to having trick shit in ya bike.

Dennis and Robert are good, I have never met any one else in New Zealand that can even come close to them, apart from ME as a set up expert, which I am Big headed as well hahaha

[codgyoleracer]

Hey Mishy, what you have been saying so far has been interesting.

1) Put trick suspension internalls into a bike, and you need a person who under stands what does what to get the best value for buck from it all

2) Put a different tire compund on, and you need to re set bike and tire psi etc to get the very best from the package

3) Play with your geometery radically like you guys did, and end up with a bag of shite, like you guys did at manfeild many months back, when I suggested a different set up, which you guys tried, and went faster ( Jay and Andrew were happy)

The point to this dribble is, ALL of the above can be learned on a std production bike!!!!! Fuckin Cheap, no $3000 front fork kits, or $3000 shocks or $800 stearing dampers

Just saved near on $7000-00--- And there is ya full season running costs of a STD 600 Production bike, where many many many riders have learned there skill.

Now it is time after a season in the production class, to move onto after market suspension, to get the very very best from your self and your bike.

You cannot be an Accountant, with out doing the training, so WHY even bother, your average fastish rider here, may pick up a second or so from $5=6000 of suspension parts, that is NOT worth it for FUN riders, and learners!

Tires, bahahaha, if one brand cannot deal with a true production class of racing, another can, there is a good quality tire breed out there that can deal with this class simle, you know it and I do.

CONTINENTAL Tires will be on ALL these bikes, and I will decide which compound, from testing that I will personally do, to determine the compound etc.

PS, remember what was said by some one we both know last year about a certain person working on suspension?

If you do not have a good set up man, there is NO point to having trick shit in ya bike.

Dennis and Robert are good, I have never met any one else in New Zealand that can even come close to them, apart from ME as a set up expert, which I am Big headed as well hahaha

Well said, best read more than once.
Glen

[Shaun]

Well said, best read more than once.
Glen

haha took me a couple of reads to even under stand myself

[vtec]

I understood you for once Shaun.

[sidecar bob]

Now it is time after a season in the production class, to move onto after market suspension, to get the very very best from your self and your bike.

Or maybe, enjoy budget racing sooo much that you just want to keep doing it for years.

[scrivy]

Or maybe, enjoy budget racing sooo much that you just want to keep doing it for years.

What is this budget thing you wanna race????

[sidecar bob]

What is this budget thing you wanna race????

Havent you raced a budget before, Theyre a hoot!!! 3 wheels & loads of sideways!!
Unfortunately Ohlins products are not avaliable for a budget racer tho.

[Mishy]

Hey Mishy, what you have been saying so far has been interesting.

1) Put trick suspension internalls into a bike, and you need a person who under stands what does what to get the best value for buck from it all

2) Put a different tire compund on, and you need to re set bike and tire psi etc to get the very best from the package

3) Play with your geometery radically like you guys did, and end up with a bag of shite, like you guys did at manfeild many months back, when I suggested a different set up, which you guys tried, and went faster ( Jay and Andrew were happy)


Now it is time after a season in the production class, to move onto after market suspension, to get the very very best from your self and your bike.

Tires, bahahaha, if one brand cannot deal with a true production class of racing, another can, there is a good quality tire breed out there that can deal with this class simle, you know it and I do.

CONTINENTAL Tires will be on ALL these bikes, and I will decide which compound, from testing that I will personally do, to determine the compound etc.

PS, remember what was said by some one we both know last year about a certain person working on suspension?

If you do not have a good set up man, there is NO point to having trick shit in ya bike.

I agree with you on plenty of that Shaun. I have said before that I see a place for a straight production class - It's just exactly where it fits that matters. And i'm interested that you also see it as a stepping stone to the 600SP class - that's natural, and i see that as positive, while also reinforcing the importance of keeping that 600Sp class as it is.
On the tyre front for production class, a suitable compound would be no problem if you properly consider it's use (i'm talking generaly, i know you know . . . ), and are not too ambitious. Most of the Conti runners on Pro Twin are running much harder compounds than you might think at first, and are getting great results with life and grip. i find all that kinda interesting, but it's a different case with the bigger bikes. We should talk further on that sometime soon.
I think It goes without saying that if you want the best performance from the best equipment, then you either need to learn freaking fast, or get some good help. That's just how it is with more sophisticated stuff I guess - and if that's not for everybody, then there are classes that are less demanding
As for the geometry thing, yeah - you can still make bad bad mistakes regardless of what gear you run, thae same could happen on any bike out there ! I could fill pages with how that panned out, but lets just say that It'll NEVER EVER happen like that again ! and that's the whole point of making mistakes - to learn something.

[gimpy]

Cliff Burton reincarnated . . . . . . . .

True Bro

[Ivan]

weres the new Tigcraft Gimpy?
I was hoping to see it at last VMCC round

[scracha]

So pretty much everyone is saying the same thing?

• There are a limited number of riders who are either incredibly wealthy or want to move onto professional racing (and if they're lucky both).
• The majority of riders do it for fun.
• Pretty much every rider still wants to race competitively but to do so is unnecessarily expensive
• Most riders agree there should be one or two "elite" formula classes where anything goes.
• There should be a better and faster pathway to professional riding for the limited number of riders who are young enough, talented enough and have enough drive.

My tuppenceworth:

• There's a lot of riders who would prefer to be racing in a relatively inexpensive 600 class where up and coming riders can still fiddle with suspension instead of the one "essentially SV650" pro twins class.
• Shaun's production 600 class fits the above bill. Less development costs, less tyre & suspension costs etc. As a start, having the "production 600" class running simultaneously with the F2 makes a lot of sense.
• F3 is a mess at the moment and would be as well being ditched. There's no money in it and there's little interest in it. Manufacturers haven't developed small engined bikes for years. To be competitive, you need a highly tuned & expensive bored out hand grenade 450, modified Sv650 or some weird bastardised 3 cylinder 600. The majority of the bikes in the class at club level are 15 year old 400's so why not just have formula 400 (power limit and minimum weight)? It works, it's a level playing field and it's the most popular form of racing across the ditch.
• If F2 were dropped then surely F1 would become more "elite". More sponsorship money, better crowds, better riders and guys like Dr Taylor and Mishy would be kept even busier. I don't think there's enough money at the moment for F1 AND F2 and Shaun's "production" class could lead to the death of F2. This may be no bad thing.
• This leaves
  F1
  F2 / Production 600
  Pro Twin / Formula 400
  125 GP
  Streetstock 150 / 250 ?
  
  

Business is slow and I've got waaaay to much time on my hands at the moment.

[Ivan]

I agree this is a freat idea,
Its good to have the option of a cheaper stnaderised class if need be.

Pro Twins is cheap at the momment but still has costs to allow the guy with the bigger wallet a opportunity with power commanders etc

A class with no mods like Shaun has proposed would be a greatway of getting introduced to the bigger 600 field before taking the gamble of running a full 600 supersport spec bike.

Hope it takes success and will be watching this space good luck Shaun