Great news - Maori only beaches in NZ

[98tls]

And now people will say that south africans are a racist bunch with aparthied, well guess what that happened ages ago and now NZ is having its own version, who the racist mother fuckers now?? NZ is moving towards the aparthied era.
And i thought i left all that shit behind. Im sorry its going to be like lend a hand and they'l take the whole arm.
Sorry im racist sometimes have to be honest but im not that bad that i want white only beach's.
Fuck this lets all shift over to Aussi

Dont apologise its not your fault your white,combine that with having an opinion = racist,if your non white and have an opinion its called entitlement.

[roy.nz]

Dont apologise its not your fault your white,combine that with having an opinion = racist,if your non white and have an opinion its called entitlement.

Well said, im still fucked off about this shit

[candor]

Extension of customary fishing rights/traditional resource management is fine, but barring people from the beach and fines are rediculous.

I thought the point of the seabed and foreshore act was to nationalise the coast for the benefit of every New Zealander.

It was to prevent a potentially divisive situation of Maori trying a menacingly sound claim in Courts for something like freehold title on all beaches, as then they in theory could have legally banned non tribers or strangers. Tho they said "we wouldn't do that", it seems Clark didnae wanna risk it by giving them same appeal rights as whites. Might be why we cut ties with Privy Council so our corrupt judiciary could screw natives unmonitored.

Freehold title still isn't ownership - it is exclusive rights to Crown land ie land protected by the NZ defence forces.

As I understand it, the Act instead gives Maori control over beaches they traditionally were guardian of for purpose of resource management / conservation.

So if I really really wanted to go on a part of a shore apportioned to Maori I'd not expect to be booted off unless... I was polluting, risked stepping on threatened species, was breaching a raahui ie a person prohibition order that was placed for good reason for a time, or trying to take stuff that wasn't conserved or meant for me eg scarce seafood bound for functions at the pa.

Its a special designated area like dog walking parts of a beach so ha different rules. XXitecx story sucks - just goes to show some will let the control concept go to their head and abuse it, or at least the not even respectfully explain why you can't be there. It could be something like that someone has drowned and rites need performing. Could Dover have felt above providing explanations or expected maddening mockery if he had explained rationale?

My mate helps Polices her Maori beach at times in Waimarama. Sometimes there is a fee at the boat access like $5, and this is to pay toward track maintenance, plantings etc that the local Maori Trust have long done to keep the beach all good. Once a redneck tried to run her over, & not pay the poor hardworking thing this meagre non profit fee.

[98tls]

Well said, im still fucked off about this shit

Wouldnt bother being fucked off to much about it and certainly would bother directing it at Maori in general,many i know find all this shit embarrasing,a combination of radicals,decades of nutless government,media with nothing better to do and some white people taking every opportunity to puff there chests and cry racist in order to give there lives some sense of purpose isnt worth getting fucked off about.

[Headbanger]

Wouldnt bother being fucked off to much about it and certainly would bother directing it at Maori in general,many i know find all this shit embarrasing,a combination of radicals,decades of nutless government,media with nothing better to do and some white people taking every opportunity to puff there chests and cry racist in order to give there lives some sense of purpose isnt worth getting fucked off about.

It won't let me rep ya twice in a row.

Probably only encourage ya anyhow.

Muhahahahaha

[MSTRS:Me]

It flowers at christmas time...

Um, actually, the flowering is all but over by Xmas. Generally, they are at their best during November.
And to keep the Maori angle of this thread, they say that the earlier the Pohutukawa flowers the better the summer will be.

[Finn]

There are beaches around NZ that are in private ownership NOW! that are closed to all NZers, not just Maori or whites or asians or whomever. Do these private beaches (that may be owned by whites) also bother you?

As Ixion pointed out, you can't "own" a beach, but you can own the land and therefore "access" to the beach. There are many examples of this in NZ however most white folk (with the exception of some nasty Aucklanders) provide access to the beach as long as their land is respected. Many farmers fall into this category.

In fact, just this Christmas while staying in the Coromandel, I crossed a farm to gain access to some rocks for some free diving. I noticed many people doing the same to fish off the rocks. One day I saw the farmer repairing the fence where people where climbing over. The next day, I rode to the farmhouse (as I approached, it got bigger and bigger) with crayfish and scollop's in hand to thank him. Nice old farmer. Just sold part of the peninsular for $50m as was in the process of "retiring" his cows.

Maori's with chips, pies and crates of beer on their shoulders will not allow access to the beach because they believe the world owes them. Poor little people.

Slightly off topic, but I'm more concerned about how much land DOC has under "control". Fucking up access and fun for all. Mother fuckers.

[Waxxa]

really??? care to name them

I dont know the name of the beaches but a couple on Waiheke Island, along the Kaipara harbour, around the Bay of Islands...it goes on and on. People are denied access.

Thanks to Finn, you do clarify that by 'own' I do mean 'access'.

[Max Preload]

What about Traditional folk who want to manage their resources the way it's worked for a lot longer than us whiteys have been doing it.

For that reason I like the idea of areas of traditional natural resource management.

What you call traditional resource 'management' is nothing of the sort. It's simply a case of supply outstripping demand - much lower levels of population placing demand on a resource does not equate to management.

If reckon if you went to the big kahuna and said - dude, mind if I have a dip - all would be cool anyway - just don't set up a sand mine eh bro.

Might be. Might not be. I like it the way it is - obey the laws and you're free to use public land.

About time someone read the article.

It is about restricting commercial use.

You might want to read it yourself. It says people.

Can someone explain to me in Plain english how this is at all possible.
Please explain how a 40 year old male born in New Zealand to New Zealand parents can have less rights in New Zealand than another New zealander of New zealand parents just because the second dude happens to have brown skin

It's called racism.

I was asked to leave and not return to a Hauraki Gulf beach by a National Parks Ranger 3 weeks ago.

Walking along it and taking photographs was scaring the birds.

So it wasn't anything to do with your parentage, skin colour or nationality? Sounds like whatever the reason it is the same for everyone. What could be fairer than that?

First of all, this agreement hasn't been ratified yet so there is no point in getting worked up and anxious over something that hasn't happened.

Incorrect - now is the EXACT time to get worked up about it - before it's enacted.

Also, not all land was sold to the British (on agreeable terms). A lot of land in NZ was confiscated for the most punitive of crimes and the confiscation was well over the top, hundreds and hundreds of acres for ridiculous charges. Some dealings over land was also legitimate sales too.

Completely separate issue.

If the land does belong to the local tribe (owner) then it is the tribe (owner) who has say over who has access and at what times of the year etc and all NZers need to accept that, as you would expect if 'you' had private land and people wanted to walk across it.

I'm pretty sure nobody is demanding right of passage through private land to access the beach. What is being taken from us is the right to use the beach itself on a whim.

I'll give you an example: a few years ago I was heavily involved with rock-climbing down in the Waikato region. All the 'crags' are on private land. Each time we would want to go climbing we would go ask the land owner. If the land owner said 'no' due to lambing for example, we would have to go somewhere else. No problems, no animosity. Respect the land owners.

He owned the land on which the 'crags' are found - again completely different.

So you guys can have my share of the beach, I hate the fuckin beach, I hate seafood...

Some maori you are...

I dont know the name of the beaches but a couple on Waiheke Island, along the Kaipara harbour, around the Bay of Islands...it goes on and on. People are denied access.

Denied access across private land. But Ixion has already clarified that in many cases access can be gain from the adjacent beach or water. Not that it matters - is your argument that, because it happens somewhere, it should be allowed to happen anywhere and everywhere? It seems you're complaining about lack of access in one post, then saying it's ok in another...

I would doubt if the beaches would be closed and if some are... so what. Go to another beach.

[twotyred]

and everyone used to diss Labour for their PC nonsense

[Tank]

I recon if us whities get banned from beaches - we should ban Maori from KFC.

Lets see who gives in first.

[Big Dave]

>>obey the laws and you're free to use public land.<<

From what I understand - that doesn't change - just don't pee on the totem pole.

[Big Dave]

November?? - The Pahutukawas on the Pahutu coast don't happen till mid december

[JimO]

and everyone used to diss Labour for their PC nonsense

who do you think set this up

[balans]

I have no idea.

My opinion is tempered by the way Australia did not learn enough about indigenous husbandry of the land before the culture was destroyed.
It's only in the last 30 years or so that we learned about 'Bush Tucker'.

For that reason I like the idea of areas of traditional natural resource management.

Kinda like a backup plan, because we know governments never get it wrong either hey.

Like the indigenous husbandry of Australias megafauna?

There was no indigenous husbandry in Australia, just hunter gathering. This was a major limiting factor in the development of the pre-european culture. This isn't a refelction of the potential of the societies members, merely a reflection of the needs of a small population relative to the size of the country and nutritional resources available.

"Bush tucker' is good in a survival situation or a nice novelty but is not even close to being able to meet the calorific needs of a modern society.