Accident report

[reofix]

yip.. yip... and yip!

[reofix]

ixion... in the modern parlance we need competency based training and licensing... do not hold your breath

[Ixion]

We had a trial of that - the CBTA. It was a total rort.

And don't talk to me about horses. Stubborn pig headed malevolent cunning scheming vicious brutes determined to get their own way. Good thing I'm more stubborn pig headed malevolent cunning scheming vicious and determined to get my own way.

[Fudmucker]

Another possible factor is that in right handers, many riders are leaning over into the opposite lane with only their wheels on the left.
We have had a couple of serious head-ons in South Africa with the rider striking oncoming vehicles.

[MarkH]

I just had a read through that report and the same thing struck me that always strikes me when I read anything like this - the info I want is the info not available. What I want to know is this: how many person hours or kilometres of riding is involved per group? The report says that in 2007 there were 17 motorcyclists killed in the 40 years and over bracket, but we don't know how many kilometres were ridden in 2007 by motorcyclists 40yrs old and over. In 1981 there were 6 deaths in the same category, but once again we don't know how many kilometres were ridden by that category in that year.

The more time you spend riding the more you are at risk, logical really since it is obvious that the risk of dying while riding a motorcycle if you ride for zero hours is pretty damn low! The statistics could be showing a trend towards an increased risk of death or they could be showing a trend towards a decreased risk of death - I just can't tell due to the info I want that is unavailable.

[Tone165]

Why should I support him 110% if I don't agree what he's saying?

Because he has a platform from which to put forward our concerns, and to have "us" cut his legs out from under him will just mean that once again nothing gets done. I dont know why you dont agree with him, because he seems to be on track. Perhaps you are not such an authority, and might do more good putting your own opinions aside in favour of the general consensus.


As for your comments - you're just giving me an excuse for my tombstone: "I didn't crash because of my lack of training, what killed me was environmental conditions, bad roads and bad drivers"

Some ppl take responsibility for their actions...some like to make excuses, still others put their time and effort into improving the situation, then there are the ones who sit and disagree with everything...so much easier than actually contributing anything!

[Tone165]

This is no surprise whatsoever. There are motorcyclists this fucking stupid...

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=PlvtI0WBrHY

(4:02 for the riding backwards bit)

Yeah yeah...I am not disputing that there are idiots around..just questioning weather law changes have any effect on them?

[Motu]

just questioning weather law changes have any effect on them?

Personally,rain on tuesday doesn't effect me at all.....but a sunny sunday has me out riding.

[Oscar]

Some ppl take responsibility for their actions...some like to make excuses, still others put their time and effort into improving the situation, then there are the ones who sit and disagree with everything...so much easier than actually contributing anything!

How do you know what I contribute?
Whilst you're trying to figure that out, look up ad hominem argument somewhere.

[Tone165]

Your right that I don't know anything about you, other than what I glean from a few paragraphs in a forum, but I gotta work with what I have!

ad hominem ....yes very nice!

My take puts folk into 2 groups..

Positive....those with ideas and action

Negative..those with critisism and obstacles

Rather than sabotaging the legitimate efforts of those that are doing something because you do not agree 100%, why not find some common ground and pitch in.

But again...you might be some kind of Motorcycling Messiah, and I just cannot see that from your negative and cynical posts.

In that case....keep up the good work!

[Tone165]

Personally,rain on tuesday doesn't effect me at all.....but a sunny sunday has me out riding.

so its true!

rainy tuesdays prevent accidents!!!!!!!

[Oscar]

Your right that I don't know anything about you, other than what I glean from a few paragraphs in a forum, but I gotta work with what I have!

ad hominem ....yes very nice!

My take puts folk into 2 groups..

Positive....those with ideas and action

Negative..those with critisism and obstacles

Rather than sabotaging the legitimate efforts of those that are doing something because you do not agree 100%, why not find some common ground and pitch in.

But again...you might be some kind of Motorcycling Messiah, and I just cannot see that from your negative and cynical posts.

In that case....keep up the good work!

Negative and cynical?
I think you'll find it's realistic and experienced.

You're very close to George Bush's theory "...if you're not with us, your against us and if you're against us, you're a terrorist." Goebbels 101, in other words.

And to reiterate, my original comment was aimed at the BRONZ spokesman who said:

But the Bikers Rights Organisation disagrees. President Finn Nielsen told Summer Report on Monday that he doubts a lack of skill can be blamed.

I think I have every right to disagree with him, as not only does his statement go against my personal experience (which is extensive and includes participation in Racing, Event Organisation, Club Administration, NZACU and MNZ), and flies in the face of all studies in this area - the FACTS are that inexperienced riders ARE the ones that get hurt.
Furthermore I do not belong to his organisation and I do not think he speaks for all motorcyclists any more than Allan R Kirk does.
So how does my disagreement "sabotage" anything?
What gives you the right to direct this discussion?

You can crap on all you like about people falling into your simplistic groups, but I have yet to see you put forth anything other than the theory that we should support everything this unelected minority group says.

[Mon ami mate]

Because if you run wide on a right hand corner you will hit gravel/ditch/fence. If you run wide on a left hand corner you have the other side of the road to use and you will only be unlucky if a vehicle is coming the other way at the time.

Who is unlucky if you run wide on a left hand corner ?
Only those you kill.