The Britten in F3?

[Billy]

And that would be?

There was an appeal about something that meant they couldn't finalise the results. What was that about?

I was wondering whether the Ozzy450 would be allowed to stay because you know there will be more and would MNZ be happy about this. Is it a production 450. Nope. But it's just such a neat idea.

Can someone fill in the blanks seeing as I missed the news.

It had nothing too do with ozzys bike,It was about the SVs.Dont want to comment further until the appeal has been heard

[Billy]

I'm wondering if John Britten had built his bikes with a displacement of 650cc would they be allowed to race in F3 under the current rulebook?

I'll add two more questions for people that would like this one simiplified.


Can you build your own engine under the current rulebook in F3?

Can you build your own frame under the current rulebook in F3?

Yes you can in both cases but only if your not using a multicylinder 2 stroke engine.Thats the way it should be as its the only class left in NZ where you can do this sort of stuff,The only thing that really neds changing is the relaxing of restrictions for multi cylinder 2 strokes and possibly now that the front runners are going faster the inception of 250 GP bikes

[vtec]

What if someone makes a revolutionary new multi cylinder 4stroke prototype engine. Of say 400cc's. I've read the rules, and as has been commented, there's heaps of gaps in the rules. The only way to find out what you are allowed is to try it and see if they amend the rules to ban it. I think twins are allowed up to 750cc's. I don't think the rules say anything about them having to be production engines.

[Kickaha]

The only thing that really neds changing is the relaxing of restrictions for multi cylinder 2 strokes and possibly now that the front runners are going faster the inception of 250 GP bikes

Any good rider on a good 250GP bike would smoke any F3 bike

[FROSTY:Me]

The F3 rules were made up about 20 years ago and as billy said have been ammended so many times you need to really search to find them all.
My take on it is --if you have a single or a multi cylinder 4 stroke you can only displace 450cc other wise its all but open slather.
But if you are on a twin it can displace 650cc if a multi valve,750 if a twin valve.
You must retain factory-unmodified. fuelling/airbox/air filter.
So if you imported the Hyo as a Fisher then you need to retain the factory fisher stuff.
Precedent on the 650 twin front is in my view clearly set by the cagiva raptor 650. Like the Fisher they use a doner engine--SV650 but they are tweaked to get a couple more HP

[Billy]

Any good rider on a good 250GP bike would smoke any F3 bike

Yip,I agree with you 100%,But with the inception of the Ozzy 450 and development with the SVs they are getting closer and the Ozzy is still in the early stages of development.Theres also a rule written that if a bike becomes too dominant it will be removed from the class.Which also answers Vtecs question

[FROSTY:Me]

Yip,I agree with you 100%,But with the inception of the Ozzy 450 and development with the SVs they are getting closer and the Ozzy is still in the early stages of development.Theres also a rule written that if a bike becomes too dominant it will be removed from the class.Which also answers Vtecs question

A specific bike or the desighn?--Im thinkin there might be a few ozzi specials soon

[svr]

Basically, `formula three' is actually three sets of rules:
First, there are the original `proper' formula 3 rules ie. displacement, numbers of cylinders and valves, etc. Anything goes within the formula - build away.
Second, 250 production-based motorcycles have been added, with their own (overly restrictive) rules.
Third, 650 production-based motorcycles have been added, with their own rules.
The second and third sets of rules were written with specific production motorcycles in mind.
Simple aye?

[WarrenW]

The protest was about the airbox snorkel from what I inderstand, the rules were written in the days where there were only carburated SV's and now there are fuel injected ones. The result was a mismatch of what was a production motorcycle when the rules were written and what is currently available off the shop floor. All ok, points stood. Case closed.

[codgyoleracer]

My interpretation would be that a "Britten 650" could run if built, - but may find itself out in the cold the following year if to many competitors moan about it. (assuming that it dominated, - wheras if it didnt , - everything would be just fine......... :-) )

[GSVR]

Ok then... What if Buckley Systems had made the BSL a 250cc.
Would this be allowed to race in F3 under the current rules if not why not.

For this lets also assume it was never raced in 250GP.

Hypothetical quesions but only way to find out how others see these rules.

[lostinflyz]

the rules specifically outlaw ANY non production 250 2 stroke bits (well engine and frame ect.)

[GSVR]

the rules specifically outlaw ANY non production 250 2 stroke bits (well engine and frame ect.)

Yeah but the way I read those rules they only apply to:

"Specifications for up to 250cc production based twostrokes"

And the BSL is not a production based 250cc twostroke. And in this case woudn't be a 250GP bike either.

It would be a 250cc twostroke hybrid.

[lostinflyz]

Yeah but the way I read those rules they only apply to:

"Specifications for up to 250cc production based twostrokes"

And the BSL is not a production based 250cc twostroke. And in this case woudn't be a 250GP bike either.

It would be a 250cc twostroke hybrid.

theres some mad rule book flicking going on today

rule 5:

All two stroke multi-cylinder machines must comply with these rules. The machine must be based
on a volume production motorcycle that is road legal in New Zealand.

but the next sentence:

No homologation is
necessary however the Road Race Commission or Technical Steward shall have the power to rule
whether or not a machine is eligible

all the subsequent rules also state that the parts must be from the road going motorcycle.



So the rules don't specify only non gp parts and bikes but must be proddy. overall i think if you got your self a non-proddy 250 2 smoker you'd find an aweful lot of non helpful people about.

[GSVR]

Well if you dissregard the introduction paragraph ... whats the point in it being there?


What about these for F3 rules:

Singles any displacement and modifications
Up to 650 watercooled twins any modifications
Up to 500cc Multis any modifications
Up to 900cc Aircooled twins 2 valve any modifications
Up to 750 Aircooled twins any modifications
250GP bikes (possibly have a pre 2000 rule) any modifications

No other rules except general machinery saftey rules and pump gas only.

I'm sure this would leave no gray areas and the fewer rules there are the harder it is to cheat intentionally or otherwise!!!!