Is a helmet actually necessary?

[Dean]

I have to agree.
Frankly, if I were to go riding without one, and I end up dieing because of it, at least I died a free man.

-j

With all respect dude, what does it mean to die a free man? Getting your head split open on hard concrete in complete and utter pain then dieng without a helmet on your head.

Is that a good thing, for you in this case? is that a grand way to die? im confused.

[Badjelly]

The argument about the helmet fails, as quite simply it increases your chances of survival in a crash so marginally that you have to use a microscope on the data to detect the improvement.

A Google search turned up the following

http://www.iihs.org/research/qanda/helmet_use.html

which says:

...per mile traveled, the number of deaths on motorcycles in 2006 was about 35 times the number in cars

That sounds a little large. I've seen other sources that quote a factor of 15-20. [Edit: 15-20 times not 15-20 percent!]

NHTSA estimates that motorcycle helmets reduce the likelihood of crash fatality by 37 percent. Norvell and Cummings found a 39 percent reduction in the risk of death after adjusting for age, gender, and seat position.

Now, I don't call a 35-40% reduction in the chance of a fatality microscopic, though it obviously doesn't cancel out the 15-35 times larger risk from riding a bike in the first place. Based on figures like these, plus a bit of common sense, I choose to

• ride a bike
• ...as safely as I can
• wear a helmet and protective gear

If you choose not to wear a helmet, i really don't care.

[Ixion]

A Google search turned up the following

http://www.iihs.org/research/qanda/helmet_use.html

which says:



That sounds a little large. I've seen other sources that quote a factor of 15-20%.



Now, I don't call a 35-40% reduction in the chance of a fatality microscopic, though it obviously doesn't cancel out the 15-35 times larger risk from riding a bike in the first place. Based on figures like these, plus a bit of common sense, I choose to

• ride a bike
• ...as safely as I can
• wear a helmet and protective gear

If you choose not to wear a helmet, i really don't care.

Those figures are always a bit suspect. They tend to be garnered in the US. Now, there, most places you don't *have* to wear a helmet. So, odds are, the folk who *do* are probably a lot more safety conscious (and probably more experienced, too) than the average. And since the US allows any noobie to jump straight on an R1, without helmet, comparison of the safety conscious, experienced helmet wearers, with the R1 riding bullet proof noobies is not really comparing apples and apples.

Same problem tends to exist here in trying to compare injury rates of riders who wear hi-vis with those who don't

I was riding here when helmets were made compulsory. Can't say I, or anyone else , noticed any *marked* drop in casualty rates.

But, withal, wearing a helmet is a good idea. A very good idea. Heads don't bounce well. Would be a good idea even if they weren't compulsary. Two different topics, don't mix them up . One, is wearing a helmt a good and sensible thing. T'other, different, should helmets (or anything else) be compelled by law.

[Badjelly]

Those figures are always a bit suspect. They tend to be garnered in the US. Now, there, most places you don't *have* to wear a helmet. So, odds are, the folk who *do* are probably a lot more safety conscious (and probably more experienced, too) than the average. And since the US allows any noobie to jump straight on an R1, without helmet, comparison of the safety conscious, experienced helmet wearers, with the R1 riding bullet proof noobies is not really comparing apples and apples.

Same problem tends to exist here in trying to compare injury rates of riders who wear hi-vis with those who don't.

All good points. Doubtless there are other statistical analyses out there, and doubtless they suffer from the same problems. Double-blind experiments are not possible. I guess all we can say is that common sense suggests that helmet should reduce fatality rates and the data are consistent with that.

Actually, I'm surprised that the (apparent) effect of helmets isn't larger than 35-40%. That's similar to the (apparent) effect of high-vis vests.

I wrote this post because I was irritated by davereid's unquantified, unsupported and rather bombastic assertion that the effect is microscopic.

But, withal, wearing a helmet is a good idea. A very good idea. Heads don't bounce well. Would be a good idea even if they weren't compulsary. Two different topics, don't mix them up. One, is wearing a helmt a good and sensible thing. T'other, different, should helmets (or anything else) be compelled by law.

Agreed. But it wasn't me who was mixing them up.

[Tink]

I have to agree.

stop trying to control every aspect of the world around us.

-j

But, withal, wearing a helmet is a good idea. A very good idea. Heads don't bounce well. Would be a good idea even if they weren't compulsary. Two different topics, don't mix them up . One, is wearing a helmt a good and sensible thing. T'other, different, should helmets (or anything else) be compelled by law.

I would wear a helmet simply because I am sane, and value my life...

The comparison yes is invalid (law v sensible)... we wear seatbelts (law) to also protect our children... so why should it not be law to wear a helmet to protect ourselves.. often we don't value our own lives or our childrens.. (living in the south OF auckland, I sadly see many unbelted kids.. and ones in tshirts and short ON motorbikes "kids" )

My point... I think the law is controlling but we have to consider this.. there are many out there .. if there was no law... that would not wear helmets.. would that be our problem "no". I see laws as being there purely for those that know no better.....

[Pwalo]

I guess the bottom line is that wether a helmet is necessary is a moot point. It's a legal requirement (regardless of your moral stand point).

Regardless, I'm sure glad I was wearing a decent quality full face when I was punted. I still have a nose, chin, etc. Judging by the state of my helmet I wouldn't have had much of a face left. Was certainly necessary in that particular instance.

[davereid]

With all respect dude, what does it mean to die a free man? ...Is that a good thing, for you in this case? is that a grand way to die? im confused.

Free men get to make decisions that involve risk.

That might mean making yourself 35x more likely to die on the road by choosing to ride a motorcycle.

It might mean making yourself 0.35x safer by wearing a helmet.

If you can't see that the argument is about the freedom to chose risk, then you are missing the entire point.

[Oscar]

There is a pic on rotten.com of a Biker missing the lower half his face yep every thing below the nostrils, I think of this image when I see some one with no helmet or an open face helmet.
may be one of the smart ones can put a link to it for us.

If it's the one that was circulating years ago (claiming to be a motorcyclist with no helmet after a crash), it's a complete bust.

That idjut got pissed and was dared to bite a blasting cap.

He did (and if you look again the injuries are more consistent with explosion than abrasion).

[Oscar]

The argument about the helmet fails, as quite simply it increases your chances of survival in a crash so marginally that you have to use a microscope on the data to detect the improvement.

Have you facts and figures to back this up?

[Oscar]

Now, I don't call a 35-40% reduction in the chance of a fatality microscopic, though it obviously doesn't cancel out the 15-35 times larger risk from riding a bike in the first place. Based on figures like these, plus a bit of common sense, I choose to

If there is a 35-40% reduction in fatalities, what is the reduction in serious injuries?

[vifferman]

I've had a few crashes, and I've hit my head only twice: both times at a near standstill. In one (minor) crash, I didn't hit my head, but did get whiplash from the sudden decelerative force of a ~1400g helmet on a head reaching the end of its travel after falling sideways.
I'd wear a helmet even if they weren't compulsory, simply because (in most cases) it's more comfortable wearing one than being subject to wind, the weather, and the cacophany of mechanical noises most of my abused bikes' motors have made.
But there's another reason, one usually missed on Mrkn bike forums by clowns who say, "At least I'd be dying in freedom if I crash while not wearing one!"

Head injuries are scarily easy to obtain.

My cousin died when he tripped and hit his head on the wharf while disembarking from his yacht.

In one of those aforementioned 'crashes' where I did hit my head, I fell no further or harder than if I was sitting stationary on my bike, feet up, and toppled sideways. I had mild concussion symptoms for three days or so.

Some years ago, I worked with a 45 year old guy who had a series of strokes. I was staggered while visiting him in the brain injury unit to see how many victims of falls or other head injuries there were. A couple had fallen from horses, there were some who'd hit their heads in car accidents. All had moderate to severe brain damage. The average brain injury victim isn't someone you'd know about, because they're either in hospital or a home, and often just a semi-vegetative shadow of their former selves.
Fuck that.

I've had enough of mental health issues (and that scare with mild concussion) to know that even minor brain damage is something NO-ONE wants.

The ones who die of head injuries in bike, car, or other accidents are often arguably the lucky ones.

[Ixion]

Ginger Malloy is in the horspiddle with serious head trauma after tripping on his steps and hitting his head. I think maybe I should wear a helmet everywhere, not just on the bike. Can you sleep in them I wonder. make kissing a bit hard though.

[YellowDog]

After reading this thread yesterday I was down in Greenhithe today and to my surprise I saw a scooter rider wearing no more than a hoodie for protection

[caseye]

Doesn't surprise me, they do what they want up there YellowDog.I started to type, " I hope he bins and gets a face full" but i deleted that cause it's not true. I don't hope he does, thats mean and nasty. I hope he gets a large fine and an incentive ( u know a day in the wards) that makes him/them change their ways voluntarily.

[YellowDog]

Doesn't surprise me, they do what they want up there YellowDog.I started to type, " I hope he bins and gets a face full" but i deleted that cause it's not true. I don't hope he does, thats mean and nasty. I hope he gets a large fine and an incentive ( u know a day in the wards) that makes him/them change their ways voluntarily.

Well I suspect you may have hit the nail on the head there. Why are riders allowed on the road without sufficient education to prevent them doing something so obviously stupid.